Help. First Time College Process (ex-Brit) - Trying Not to Meddle!

Good luck to you and your daughter. I was worried my son was choosing his college because two close friends were also going (one had gotten in ED) but it really turned out to be the right choice and he is thriving. Having the friends there has been only positive, and they ride home together for breaks, which is good too There are advantages to being in the upper quadrant, qualifications-wise and may turn out to be a real confidence-builder. She should be proud of her merit award. They really want her!

Thank you so much, LBowie. That means a lot. :slight_smile:
All in all my take-away from this thread has been to go to the Xavier admitted students day with an open mind, actually physically go and see UTK and not dismiss it out of hand, pursue the waitlist for Richmond (but not over-aggressively), check the NACAC list around May and try enticing my daughter down that route if at all possible, and then just let fate take its course.
The more I try and press the subject with her, the more she resists, so I’m going to have to ease back a bit for a while. Striking the right balance is hard.
Once again, thanks to all those who offered wonderful sage advice. If only I’d discovered this board BEFORE we’d started the college process. :slight_smile:

I strongly do NOT recommend a gap year for this top student. I doubt she could find anything academically challenging to keep her mind busy while waiting for a chance at another school. Her resume will not improve that much. Plus she would miss all of the experiences of being that 18 year old freshman fresh from HS.

I’ll bet she did a good job on those essays, despite what you think about her topic. Our son never let us see his. We discovered this in time, don’t worry about it- most people do not use this site. She is who she is.

Back off, mom! She will go to one of the schools she applied to. There were reasons she bothered to apply to them. Do not try to undermine her choices but instead embrace them. Be proud that she owned the process.

Many top students go to their state flagship, there will be the top tier along with the rest. Finances matter.

So, relax and ignore the college process for awhile. Look forward, not backwards. Enjoy the last few months of your D’s HS experience.

Thanks wis75. I know you’re right. I needed to hear that, I guess, from someone other than DD or my husband - who is of the attitude, if she gets passionate about something, we will embrace it and support it. If she’s going to be low key and disinterested, why fork out top whack at her waitlist school? She’ll succeed if she chooses to. End of. (Can’t say I;m fully onboard with that viewpoint, but I do understand where he’s coming from.)

Pay a deposit somewhere, and ask her to agree to consider other options come May 1. You can look at last year’s NACAC list and start doing a little research into some of,the colleges on it. I know there were some excellent schools last year. Then, try not to speak about college for a whole month (or as little as possible).

If she balks at the idea of a different college once the deposit is paid, make her aware that while getting off the waitlist is unlikely, she might not hear from them until the summer. She should keep an open mind about switching course late in the game, whether it’s NACAC or waitlist. My own kid was called off the waitlist at the beginning of July. Her first inclination was “it’s too late.” Then she decided to go for it, and it was the right choice for,her.

Sometimes it is good to not look back once the decision to attend a school is made. I would not undermine her choice by asking her to reconsider. Let her embrace the school she is accepted at without keeping her insecure about her future.

Seconding Lidagaf’s opinion in #24.
I don’t think Xavier is going to have the peers she needs and in the Humanities is very important because close reading and discussion are essential to progressing.
So, deposit at Xavier or UTK Honors, but do consider the NACAC list.
I think Ursinus is still accepting applications and it’s good for writing, although not at your daughter’s level.
Tell her that it’s not over, in fact there’s a list of colleges that miscalculated yield with topnotch options (because algorithms can’t predict fickle teens even at top schools) and they’ll really, really want her.

Truman University (a public honors liberal arts college in Missouri) also almost never fills up and I believe that they have automatic admissions with your D’s stats. It’s also very inexpensive, even for out-of-state

The 25-75 percentile range for the SAT:

Truman: 1190-1430
Xavier: 1060-1240

@smookypie100 : imagine you’re buying your child a house. The kid isn’t all that into house visits. Do you hand them $250,000 in cash and tell whatever they buy is good? Most parents would help, ask the right questions - is the roof leaky, has there been any ant colony to get rid of, bats, flooding, highway about to be built in the backyard, what’s to repair… Most parents would get involved because it’s a huge expense, it requires more than one person to see it all, and they’re giving an incredible gift to their kid and don’t want it wasted on something that doesn’t work (like a 10,000 acre farm with termite-ridden supporting woodbeams for a kid who hates gardening and the outdoors and is most at ease near take out thai and libraries.) You’d hunt a bit and suggest, look, that condo right by the river and the library, looks interesting, totally within budget, I’d like to visit, would you mind coming along? :wink:

In other words, it’s okay to meddle when such amounts of money are at stake, especially since you’ve sensed a mismatch between the college and your daughter (and there likely is) and since you can afford to provide her what she needs.

@MYOS1634 I am totally onboard with what you’re saying. It’s the point I’ve been trying to get across to anyone that’ll listen in my family, but to no avail. I think I originally launched into the college search process last year with too much vigor. We sat down and looked at a map of the US and said to DD, Where do you want to visit? Her response was “Anywhere as long as it’s not too hot.” Seriously. She doesn’t like hot weather much…
She also early on insisted she wasn’t interested in the traditional Ivy League schools, but we knew she was really bright when it came to English, so we just Googled the best colleges to study English. Of course, the top ones that came up were Princeton, U Chicago, Swarthmore, Kenyon, Duke, Emory, Wash U, etc., once we’d knocked off Harvard, Brown, and the rest of the Ivies. Also, she’d decided she didn’t want to visit the West Coast - too hot. (I kid you not. Shame, because I would have loved a trip to California!)

So in total, I think, first trip we visited Duke, Richmond and George Washington in D.C. She didn’t like the big city feel of D.C. Scratched that one off the list. She fell in love with Richmond but was indifferent to Duke.
Second trip we visited Xavier (because her friend is there), Kenyon, U Chicago, Northwestern, and Wash U. She loved U Chicago’s campus but not so much the city feel. She quite liked Kenyon but found it very remote, and she was indifferent to Northwestern and Wash U. (She gets indifferent a lot. Can you tell?)
Third trip we visited Princeton (more for me than for her - I was nosey), Swarthmore, Univ of Penn, Univ of Virginia, UNC-Chapel Hill, and Emory. She liked Swarthmore and Emory. The rest she was - you guessed it - indifferent. And the general take home from all of the above visits was the fact that it was too hot on the days we toured!
Over the summer we visited Vanderbilt (as it’s close to us). She actually loved it. It’s not known for its English programs, but she still wanted to try for there.
So in the end, she decided to apply to UTK (as we’re in Tennessee) and Xavier as safeties, to be honest, hoping they wouldn’t become necessary; Emory and Richmond we figured were matches; and then she applied to Duke, Vanderbilt, Swarthmore, U of Penn, and U Chicago as reaches.

And here we are facing rejections at all the reaches, waitlists for the two matches, and acceptances at the safeties. (I guess we had a good read on what were reaches, matches and safeties!) We know it wasn’t academics that let her down. It was her lack of decent ECs. She’s just never been interested in anything. It’s so very unfortunate.
I look at other people’s children’s lifestyles and they’ve grown up doing varsity sports, band practice, after school clubs, volunteer work, etc., etc. Not our DD. I tried to encourage it - piano lessons, ballet lessons, clarinet lessons, horseriding, IT for girls, psychology club - she was even inducted to the Honors English Society but I don’t think she did one thing associated with it that involved any form of participation. She’s a loner. She’s a writer. She loves her computer. That’s about it. :frowning: The one elective she’s focused on throughout high school has been IT, programming, coding - not exactly English work, I’d say, is it? She liked it so much she’s been taking AP Computer Science and AP Comp Sci Principles in senior year… she was doing great until it got too mathsy and sciency and then she’s switched off. Once she realized she’d need to take math and physics courses to follow a Computer Science major, she disengaged. She’ll probably finish with a good grade in it - she’s been low A’s throughout the year - but she’s just not passionate about it anymore. That’s why she’s going to study English as a major. It’s something she’s naturally good at but doesn’t have to work at. And that’s the problem. She’s undoubtedly lazy. Again, it’s her following the path of least resistance.

I do wonder is this very abnormal for an 18-year-old girl? She’s never been into having sleepovers with girlfriends. If she gets invited somewhere, she’ll go (often reluctanctly) but will still have a good time -surprising herself even on occasion. But she never instigates things. She’s had a boyfriend for the last two years who’s very like her, happy to stay indoors and play videogames. And I try not to think about the rest! It’s kind of fizzling out now (by her choice) because she knows it’s not going to last once they head off to different colleges. Again, not surprisingly, she’s apathetic even about her own relationships, it seems.
This is why I think college will either be REALLY good for her or REALLY bad for her. I’m hoping the former obviously! She’ll be pulled into doing things out of her comfort zone. She won’t be able to sit in her room on her own as much.

I’m so sorry for rambling. In response to the suggestions above, I’d LOVE the idea of her trying for new options off the NACAC list or Truman or Ursinus (I’d never even heard of that one!) but I know DD too well. It took enough for me to get her to visit the colleges we already did. Even considering (however unlikely) the option that Richmond might offer her a place off the waitlist is now turning into a testy conversation because, in her words, “Why pay full price for Richmond when Xavier are offering half the costs?” It’s an argument I’m losing because the fact that “Mum says it’s a better school overall and will have similarly minded peers” doesn’t outweigh the fact that “Daughter is apathetic and suddenly very cost-conscious!” and “Dad says if Daughter can’t show interest in anything past Xavier now, why fork out a bunch of money on a better-matched school like Richmond?”

It’s all so very demoralizing. :frowning:

But we’re going to visit Xavier again on Sunday. Maybe she’ll hate it… maybe I’ll love it… who knows. I know we all love our kids unconditionally, but I do so very much wish mine had an ounce of ambition and drive!

Thanks for listening. God bless.

Tell her she’s an excellent writer who will need great professors to continue her craft, and fellow students who will appreciate her for who she is.

She can write an entirely different common app essay. Heck: She’s a writer. She can probably write two, or two dozens. See if she can. Just for the sake of writing, because she knows she can write even if it doesn’t lead to something else. At this point, have her roll a die and writew just one draft, on the topic the die rolls to.

She may not be indifferent as much as seeking a spark somewhere. Or maybe she’s deeply into writing.

What you say about how she liked coding also means she may be interested in other things, a creative CS major with little to no math. Let me see.

Ha! You’re right @MYOS1634 about seeking a spark I like that thought. :slight_smile:

And, yes, my suggestions have often been to follow the tech route but also somehow involve a writing aspect. I think she’d be pretty good in the cyber field - data analysis, etc. We joked about working for the CIA! But currently she’s thinking more of a journalistic field because of her strong writing skills.

I appreciate your suggestions. :slight_smile: Thank you.

Hmm. So many fields require drive to be successful. Journalism requires a desire to investigate and get to the heart of a story more than writing skills.

Has she done much volunteering?

OP- I say this with the utmost respect- stop referring to schools as matches, reaches, safeties.

The game is over (at least for now- I realize there are wait lists and possibly more applications or a gap year, or a transfer or whatnot) but at least for April 2018 you are done.

Your d has two fine options and she should choose one of them. Visit both of them if you can.
Then make a choice and your D will see how she feels.

But nomenclature ain’t your friend right now. She’s in where she’s in, and she should choose one of them.

I believe that kids like your D may do better at a big U than a small one (just a larger critical mass of literary types, or whatever type your D becomes by the time she gets to college) but if she ends up with a compelling feeling that Xavier is for her- then embrace it.

Looking in the rear view mirror is not helping your mental health- and certainly not your D’s.

@PurpleTitan You’ll hardly be surprised to hear me say… nope, no volunteering either… unless you call writing for a rather snooty glossy local magazine volunteerwork. Granted, she didn’t get paid, so technically it was volunteering, but it didn’t involve going anywhere or meeting anyone, which is kind of the point; right? As I read my post back, I realize more than ever she didn’t really deserve to be accepted into any of the colleges she applied to. In fact, I’m surprised she was even waitlisted to Emory and Richmond all things being fair.
@blossom I am indeed trying to get onboard with Xavier. We are visiting this weekend.I’m hoping that might shine a better light on things. Thank you for you counsel. :slight_smile:

Yeah, not so much for getting in to college, but I think volunteering or working would be for her own good.

Oh, she does work. I guess as that’s paid work, I wasn’t counting that as volunteering. She’s had part time jobs the last two summers (in food service industry) and she’s currently working 3 days a week in a salad bar to save up for college, so she does get out the house. Maybe I portrayed her as a complete hermit. Nope, she’ll go out and give her all at work. She gets good reviews from her bosses (yet they always mention that she’s quiet!) as a hardworker, so I can’t fault her there. I should have been clearer. But as mentioned earlier, I guess we’re just waiting for her to find her spark. :slight_smile:

OP - could she be just a tad bit … spoiled? Not unheard of for an only child! :wink:
In my opinion, she will BLOOM in college, and I agree with @blossom that she might be happier at your large state school. Are you planning another visit to UT as well? Did you apply to their honors program?

Not everyone feels a spark about a certain college or major. Sometimes the spark comes AFTER taking some classes and meeting new people.

Also, getting away from the boyfriend will help! She sounds like a bright, lovely young lady who just needs to get started and see where the path leads her.

At Xavier, make sure she can attend a freshman composition class. Call the college or the dept, arrange it for her, make it a cool surprise.
(I think it’ll either seal the deal or make her lean toward UTK).

Don’t sell her short: you’d be surprised how few teens nowadays have a job… and keep it.

However, if she doesn’t like the heat, why in the world didn’t she apply to colleges in the North California + Pacific Northwest region? The weather is the closest you’ll get to England: mostly mild and rainy, with a few cold days in winter, some sunny but not hot days in summer, and generally “oceanic climate”.
Hopefully there’ll be some possibilities on the NACAC list in that region.

What about UIowa and it’s famed writing program? Did she apply to Denison (also excellent for writing)?

@smookypie100 For what it’s worth (only one date point, I know), my sister-in-law, who received her master’s degree from Pitt three years ago, was most impressed with the Xavier graduates who were also at Pitt in her program (international relations). So impressed that she encouraged her daughter (my niece) to apply there. When my brother (a Princeton grad) took my niece to Xavier for an art scholarship competition, he also noted how genuinely nice the school and professors/administrators were. A whole lot less snooty than at Carnegie Mellon, where my niece decided to enroll due to the strength of the design program. Maybe your daughter will thrive there. Maybe she wants/needs a lower key school where she can be a top student.

Another data point: My adult son’s best friend from high school, an above average but not outstanding student in high school, went to Shippensburg (a Pennsylvania “directional” not known at all for excellence in the sciences) because he didn’t want his parents to have to pay a lot more for his first choice (private) college. He was a top chemistry student at Ship, where his professors loved him, and went on to Princeton for his PhD. He is now a college professor at a well-known university in California.

Try to embrace your daughter for who she is, instead of wishing she were a more passionate individual. I know what it’s like to be the daughter of a mother who has always wished I could be different than who I am.