Homeschooled student in Oregon, with very little to show. What does he need to do to get admission?

Chance Me / Match Me
1

It is my humble request to all the participants in this forum to take a look at the unique situation we are in and provide some constructive feedback. I say"unique" because, as parents of a 16-yr old, we feel we have some real challenges in getting our son cross the impending hurdle and enter a reasonably good university. Here are the details:

Residents of state of Oregon

Supposedly “Home schooled”. Refused to attend high school beyond the 9th grade. He has had no teachers, counselors nor anyone to guide him. He refuses to seek any guidance; nor does he listen to any words of wisdom. He feels he has the innate smartness to reach his objectives. Of course, he is 17 yrs old and has no clue what the real world has in store for him. He spends lot of time in online games, chatting with members of virtual community. While he does possess a very capable intellect, I just don’t think he knows how competitive the world has become and how well one needs to be prepared.

So, very briefly, I have touched on the problems we are facing. Now, I come to the real issue…

He is preparing for SAT. He has taken ACT and has scored 28. He neither has transcripts nor does he have a portfolio of activities during his years away from school. In fact, he rarely interacted with the outside world. But, for a 16 year old, he does possess a good grasp of societal dynamics, geopolitics, financial markets, economic theories etc. I am proud of his intellectual capabilities, but also know that words without action mean nothing in this world.

He wants to pursue Economics/finance/cognitive sciences etc.

What are his chances in Oregon? We very much doubt that he could find himself in one of the elite schools (that was his goal, but he doesn’t have the work ethics to get there). He had NYU, Univ of Chicago, UCLA etc. in his short list. Now, he rarely talks about these schools. He seems to be slowly settling for lesser schools, a sign of resignation and awareness of lack of preparation, or even dwindling motivation.

If he continues with his frivolous attitude, and misses the SAT (this will be the 3rd time, and every time he rationalizes his decision to skip with some “exceptional” reasoning) does he have enough score on ACT to get admission?

What are your thoughts and suggestions. I deeply appreciate any feedback from the community here.

2

Most colleges generally require a high school diploma. He really wasn’t homeschooled in high school if he did nothing. Your best bet is to go to a CC and even they might require a GED if you can’t produce a high school transcript.

3

Without some indication of completion of the usual expected college prep high school course work and graduation from high school, frosh admission to colleges, other than open admission ones like community colleges, is likely closed to him.

Starting at a community college and aiming for transfer admission to a four year school that does not require high school stuff for transfer students may be a more realistic route, but only if he is willing to commit to school work.

4

You may want to post on the homeschool forum on this site.

What you are describing sounds closer to unschooling than homeschooling, but I think there are some unschooling parent on that page, and also could maybe direct you to forums off this site.

Does your state require a student not in a brick and mortar school to file a plan with the SAU?

5

As former homeschool parent this post kind of bugs me. Even my friends that “unschooled” could document their kids time and work it into a transcript of sorts and portfolio to back it up with. Your post reads like your kid dropped out of school after 9th grade and then played video games for a few years and because he scored okay on one test you think he should get into college?

My kids homeschool until 9th grade (with text books, assignments, on line classes, co-opts, community service…) and then start public school because they can get more instruction there than I can’t give them at home. They work hard to get good grades and good test scores. Do you really think it’s fair that a kid that hasn’t taken foreign language, advance maths, lab sciences… but has an okay ACT score should be looked at as the same as a kid who actually took these classes either at home, on line, DE, co-op, some documented exerience, independent study or in school?

You need to find out what the high school requirements are for the colleges that your son might want to apply to. Most homeschool parents do this in middle school so they can make sure their child has the required courses or some equivilent in high school.

I sincerely hope I am reading your post wrong and you as a parent put some effort into homeschooling your child, if not he may even have difficulty with the work load involved in CC classes despite his “innate smartness”

Please keep in mind that economics/finance require a high level of math. I have a friend with a very gifted/precocious son that wanted to follow that path and even though he graduated high school with honors, once he got to college he could not handle the level of math required in that major and had to switch majors.

6 
  Does he have a psych diagnosis? IEP from when he was at school?  He isn't a student, so he is a high school drop out per se? Do you have any help with that? Where does he get his ideas of possessing an innate superior intellect from? The ACT isn't much help in that regard.
7

If you know that, he must have done something:
What books has he read? List them, per “theme”, and classify the themes into fields (Humanities, Quantitative and Logical Reasoning, International Awareness, Ethics, Economics&Society…) rather than narrower subjects (English/History, Math/CS/Stats, Foreign Language/International relations/Geopolitics, Religion/Philosophy, etc.)
For instance, if he has a 28 ACT, he presumably covered Algebra1&2+Geometry and basic statistics+data analysis, right? List that. Think through what he’s done to prove he has a “good grasp” of these subjects. If he engaged you in discussion over an issue, write it down.
If you travelled, if he watched documentaries… add it to your big academic categories.

He should have proof of covering…

  • Math through precalculus
  • foreign language through level 4 (intermediate; 3 semesters of community college also covers that)
  • 4 years of history and social science (including geography, economics, sociology, psychology, government/political science). He is required by law to have covered US history in order to graduate.
  • 4 years of English including literature and nonfiction, with critical reading, literary analysis, and lots of writing/composition
  • science: biology, chemistry, physics + one other (this may be the hardest to document, since he

You’re the parent. Next time, don’t allow him to skip the SAT. He goes into the car and you drive him. Be ready to answer his “Or what?” when you announce you’re taking him to the SAT (“Or you go back to HS in the Fall” “or you"ll pay me back for all three tests by working at ***” ←
job he wouldn’t want but that has openings in town…or something relevant&credible.)
This “no skipping again” shouldn’t be presented as a threat - it should be akin to “I know you’re capable of doing very well and I want to see how well you do. So tomorrow I’ll make sure you’re up, I’ll cook you a nice protein-rich breakfast, I’ll pack you water, sliced apples, and your favorite candy bar for energy and morale, and I’m going to take you to the SAT. I’d like you to promise me you’ll do your best.”

Perhaps ask him whether he’d like to go back to a regular HS, or an alternative HS.

If he gets aggressive and angry when you cut his videogame access, consider he might be addicted to videogames or at least suffer from a dependency.
http://www.webmd.com/mental-health/addiction/features/video-game-addiction-no-fun#1

If he refuses to help you document his work, ask him whether he wants to go to college and what he’s ready to do in order to go. If not, does he want to take a break and start working somewhere, then resume his high school curriculum once he feels ready?

8

Do you have a community college near you? You might talk to them about him taking a placement test to see where he shakes out on math and English. A 28 on the ACT is pretty decent actually.

Definitely post in some homeschool forums to see if there are ideas for you.

What does your spouse think? What is the plan for when he is 18-19?

9

He needs a GED or he won’t be going to any college. His ACT score is decent. I would be impressed if his SAT score can top his ACT. He needs to go to CC and understand the kind of work that will be required of him at college. University is a lot of work. To go straight into one after playing games online for a few years is a recipe for failure, IMO.

Everyone parents in their own way. In your shoes, I would tell my son in unambiguous language that the second he hits 18, if he isn’t in college pulling decent grades, he is going into the workforce and paying rent, utilities, etc… Then at 19, he is out of the house. Reality is, well, real.

10

Your son can do CLEP exams too. There are many, go to college board’s website and check and see if any universities near you accept CLEP. If he passes the exams it means he won’t have to do basic Intro classes such as English 101, etc…

11

I am sort of similar to him, being also an avid gamer around the same age.

You, as a parent, need to sit him down one day and give him a pencil along with a sheet of paper. Ask him to write out his goals in life. Ask him what job/employment he wants to get. Ask him how he will make the income necessary to sustain himself. Ask him what sort of education he wants to pursue and how that education will further his goal of getting employment.

Make it abundantly clear to him to sitting around all day playing video games isn’t going to get anywhere. He seems to be a bit of a loner (talking to people on the internet isn’t the same as talking irl).

Get him to go to social events, encourage him to join local organizations (I assume up in Oregon you have lots of wildlife and conservation groups). I don’t want to sound cliche, but it’s not healthy for a developing teenage male to spend his days in front of his computer.

12

We struggled with school refusal for our younger child during 9th grade. She ended up losing credit for most of her second semester freshman year classes. We spent a lot of time talking/arguing (with lots of drama, tears, screams) about options including online school. Another option was a program at a community college for high school students that was on the CC campus and basically a combination of dual enrollment and regular HS classes. We also looked up and talked with D2 in detail about the requirements to be admitted to our in state universities. D2, for example, especially hated her foreign language and social studies classes, but we made it clear that by state law she couldn’t graduate without 3 years of social studies and couldn’t be admitted to the in state universities without 2 years of a foreign language.

Fortunately she was motivated by the fact that she wants to eventually become a doctor. She recognized that goal requires her to go to college. So despite her dislike of her high school, she finally came around and cooperated with going back to her old school. But if your son is 16 and totally refusing school, then I suggest to make him get a minimum wage job NOW and let him know that that’s his future if he can’t get at least a high school diploma. Make him work all summer if he won’t do some sort of summer school.

13

I read this more as “high school dropout” than “homeschooled”. He can’t just step back in when he refused any formal or homeschooled education options for years. He should earn his GED, then attend CC to prove he can succeed in the classroom. Then look at transferring to a 4 year school.

14

I was going to suggest community college as well. Is there a dual enrollment program at your CC?

How is your relationship with your child now? Was counseling suggested when the school refusal started? Do you have concerns about his transition back to classes?

15

Rules vary, of course. But at our local Illinois CC, there is no GED or HS diploma requirement to enroll at the community college, but there are basic proficiency tests that needed to be passed in order to enroll.

We know two homeschool students who started community college as young as 14, taking remedial “high school level” non-college credit courses at first (math, writing), then college credit courses in foreign language or art, and building up to full college level courses.

When it came time to apply for transfer to a four year, they had earned a AA and had a full transcript showing proficiency in a wide range of courses at the college level.

For any colleges or universities that required a HS transcript, a homeschool high school transcript can be built using the remedial classes at the CC, and other homeschool coursework completed.

For the OP’s student, it seems like the standardized test scores are not the important part of the equation here. Intelligent or not, four year colleges will be looking for evidence the student can handle college level coursework.

Seems to me the easiest way for a “drop-out” or other type of unconventional student to do that is to head off to community college and build a kick ass transcript and resume. Then apply for transfer to a four year, having gained some experience in conventional schooling, some maturity, and hopefully some $ in the bank from working.

16

@Lindagaf

I wouldn’t recommend CLEP for this student. Without a traditional high school transcript, the student needs to demonstrate he can handle conventional college level coursework. He should be taking all the basic courses, not only to fill out a college transcript for transfer eventually, but also because he probably needs the practice and confidence and discipline.

17

Even with CLEP or a GED, even with a long list of books he read, he hasn’t done the work. You may need to find a program that accepts conditional students, a sort of hybrid, where for two years, students are not matriculated toward a college degree. I doubt he can demonstrate the willingness to take on college courses, fit in that box.

And you need to look at the Home School Supplement in the Common App. It’ll give you an idea of the expectations.

What makes you feel he’d suit college and it would suit him? What has he done to demonstrate this? Seriously.

18

This isn’t true at all. My son is a former homeschooler who’s currently finishing his sophomore year in college. He was accepted to a dozen colleges – including one program with guaranteed transfer to an Ivy – and he’s never taken the GED.

OP, what are the laws in your state for showing high school completion? That’s what colleges will ask you to provide. Since he seems to dislike organized schooling and doesn’t seem to want to listen to you, I’d suggest cc too. If he gets his 2-year degree, colleges won’t necessarily ask for high school records. If he were my son, he’d be working to pay for the privilege until he got over his attitude.

19

Oregon laws are available here: http://www.ohen.org/oregon

OP: Your family needs a counselor. You are not describing a healthy family dynamic and it sounds like your son needs help with transitioning from being in his room all day back into the wider world. Pushing him off to college won’t change that.

20

@ 3scoutsmom: I really appreciate your honest feedback. There are reasons for this very undesirable situation and the way it turned out. I will not disclose these very personal reasons here. But I fully understand that my son is least prepared to face the trials and tribulations of life, not just as a student, but even later in his work life. Not much we can do about the past, but am trying hard to impress upon him to focus on his studies and do the necessary.

As for Economics/finance, the math is not high level for undergraduate studies. I have tutored undergrads during my post graduate studies in Engineering as well as MBA in finance. Except in Econometrics or analytical finance (where stochastic calculus is used), most of the math is quite easy and I am sure my son can handle it. I know he can do it if he gets his priorities right.

It was very difficult for me to intervene, from where I stood at that point of my life, when he started neglecting his studies and finding “refuge” in online/gaming activities. It was impossible for me to intervene. Believe me when I say that. Now, while he is respectful and loving, and seems to agree with what we are saying to him, he rarely follows up with required actions. So, unless he finds inspiration within, seeks some transformation out of the current “conditioned” life, it is difficult for us to force him to do anything. I try to inspire him by watching or discussing the stories of great men in various walks of life, the challenges they faced, how they overcame great adversities, their single-minded focus on goals they set for themselves etc. I talk to him about Malcolm Gladwell’s “10000-hour Rule” to be competent in a chosen field. He listens and I do see positive changes. But then, the college thing is upon us, and the time is ticking fast.

I really appreciate all the sincere feedback here. We are going to share this with him. Hope and pray that he can summon whatever internal reserves he has to seek higher level of consciousness.

Thanks all!