<p>Where did wealthy lawyer, PhD, MD etc go to college?</p>
<p>Funny, I know several MDs and PhDs who sent their children to their alma maters- often <em>gasp</em> public, non-flagship state universities. Living close to U of M, most every rich person I know sent their kids to U of M. Arguably, the most powerful law family in Michigan sent all of their kids to U of M and they’re now extremely successful lawyers. (Yes, U of M is elite but not “Top 20 US News” 
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<p>Think it could possibly be your particular social circle rather than a representative of anything else? </p>
<p>You’d probably be happier if you knew fewer lawyers, but I suspect that’s true for most of us. </p>
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<p>How many people do you know, linden? Enough to be statistically significant and prove your point with something other than anecdotes?</p>
<p>Funny, for every person who fits your assumptions, many of us know just as many or more who don’t. In my personal experience, the people who have founded and/or run the very successful organizations I have worked for got their degrees from places like Aurora College, Slippery Rock, Bradley, and UW-Eau Claire. </p>
<p>No one is saying elite schools aren’t wonderful. They’re just not the be all, end all for the overwhelming majority of people who are successful in life.</p>
<p>People love to cling to outliers and exceptions to the norm. Zuckerberg dropped out of college…so and so became a millionaire after community college…or even better, I know a Harvard grad who’s living with their parents! Just face facts: this rat race exists for a reason.</p>
<p>Top 30 LACs/universities bring added value to lower-income children, first-gen kids, URM’s, and children from immigrant families.
Let us note also that colleges that meet 100% need for low EFC families are more likely to promote success in this income group because they don’t make students and their family take on more debt than is advisable (if any at all) and limit recourse to off campus jobs, plus offer special resources or programs to make sure they succeed on-level with their potential.
For other students, it’s not their college that makes a difference to their success in life, it’s their hard work, at any college they may attend.</p>
<p>Why do some big doctors/lawyers want their kids at Top 50 universities/LACs? For many reasons: Because they’re legacy, because they will have access to more networking or more opportunities (as long as they seize them), because they won’t be subjected to the vagaries of sudden budget cuts dictated by the state, because there’ll be very good support services (perhaps because there’ll be better LD/mental health support), smaller classes/discussion-based classes/famous lecturers…
But just as many big doctors/lawyers want their kids at their state’s flagship, especially if it’s good (ie., UNC-CH, UVA, UCB, UCLA, UCSD, UMich, of course, but also UF, Ole Miss, UMN-Twin Cities, U Washington, Penn State, Ohio State, UIUC, UIndiana, Purdue…)</p>
<p>The topic here is not public vs private*, but whether 3.5/1300 can have zero admission in April.
I added: zero AFFORDABLE admission because getting into universities you can’t afford is for all intent and purpose the same thing has having zero choice.</p>
<p>*although the topic meandered to the issue of “fit” and other considerations :)</p>
<p>I apologize for my post upthread. I think I’ve fallen victim to a high schooler with too much time on his/her hands. </p>
<p>No apology necessary.;)</p>
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<p>That makes it seem like the Penn State branch campuses are like expensive versions of community colleges.</p>
<p>A friend of mine has a son who got into MIT EA, but not UMD-CP (his safety).</p>
<p>We know someone who applied to tippy-top LACs plus an HYP (double legacy), 2300+, 3.9 UW in full IB plus AP, lots of leadership and sports, and only got into the in-state safety. Got off of a waitlist in mid-July after what had to be some serious negotiations.</p>
<p>At the programs my kids attended, there was a strong tendency towards tippy-top schools or the flagship – but given the selectivity of the programs, these really were top-notch kids. However, Yale was never going to accept 28 of them SCEA in one admissions cycle. We knew a fair number of kids who were bummed to have been shut out and headed to the flagship instead, but there were any number of outstanding schools where they would have been welcomed with open arms and $$ – if only they had deigned to apply.</p>
<p>I was glad our kids applied to schools they’d be happy to attend, whatever the level of “brand name” or selectivity.</p>
<p>If one is applying to all Ivies/tippy-tops, the chance of getting shut out is higher than if one applied to a reasonable range of schools. At a certain level of school, a 2000/3.6 is just not going to be competitive – which does not mean the student can’t succeed there or anywhere else – it’s just that he/she will find it extremely hard to stand out in a pool of 2250+/3.8+ applicants.</p>
<p>Linden not every child of a wealthy lawyer or doctor makes it into an elite college so from the start your premise is flawed. Most PhDs are not wealthy (at least the ones I know). I know wealthy lawyers and business people with kids at Ivys and top 20 schools, but also kids at State Us because that is where the kid wanted to go or because the kid was not a good enough student to go to an elite. Many others have kids at top 50 privates because that is what the kid wanted. </p>
<p>@MYOS1634 Can you please post a link to the source of these findings? We may well be having to decide among a non top public school honors college with full tuition scholarship, a highly ranked public school and a highly ranked private but no Ivies. We are an immigrant family, cost is important. Our EFC is high and our CSS even higher, we have assets that count negatively for us but our retirement accounts are not as well funded as expected mostly due to arriving in the US later in our working careers.</p>
<p>Send your child to the school you can afford. There are a lot of college grads who are essentially “shut out” of life because of crippling debt. A moderate amount of student loans is acceptable, but if you would be looking at borrowing a large amount to send your child to the private school, then it is not really a good option no matter how well ranked. </p>
<p>One thing that people seldom think about is what happens after the kid arrives at college: some kids struggle and do poorly, and some are doing well enough but have to leave their school at some point due to financial barriers. </p>
<p>@ucbalumnus - I went to the Main Campus of PSU starting freshman year. The students who joined us junior year got an excellent education their first 2 years. We were all pretty impressed to be honest. Instead of the 300-student lecture hall, they were in a class of 30. (We had small review sessions once or twice a week, but we had to be able to learn in the big lecture hall and maybe we developed more independent learning skills in that environment.) I suppose if you had a CC that was local and of very good quality, that would be a good option. I live near RPI. They have an articulation agreement with a nearby CC to facilitate transferring from the CC after 2 years. I think it works well because there is a close relationship between the 2 schools and the pipeline is familiar. </p>
<p>@Roger_Dooley. Only if it’s possible to “like” your comment 1000 times…
Your comment about getting the safeties schools in the bag before March. </p>
<p>“That makes it seem like the Penn State branch campuses are like expensive versions of community colleges.”</p>
<p>Research indicates <em>most</em> 4-years are glorified community colleges. Expensive courses, kids aren’t challenged, kids taking longer to graduate, classes full of kids that don’t want really to be there.</p>
<p>As I said, this rat race exists for a reason. There isn’t a trick or shortcut to getting an elite education that provides social mobility. All of us are on here because we want to put our children in most selective schools, with the highest concentration of gifted socially mobile students. If money isn’t a concern, all of us would prefer our child to in a school with an 90% gifted student body vs the state school with a 10-20% gifted profile.</p>
<p>And if money is a concern, the top schools are generous for truly gifted students.</p>
<p>I’ve only known of one great student who was truly shut out in April. The student applied to two highly selective colleges, period, at the advice of a dearly loved relative who insisted the student was a “shoo-in”. This relative had no background in college admissions, no connection with the colleges involved, didn’t even live in the area where the colleges were located, but for some reason the student’s family believed him. They refused to listen to any warnings that this was a bad idea. It was as if the relative was Professor Henry Hill or something. April came, the student was rejected to both colleges and the family found themselves having to scramble. They never made that same mistake again.</p>
<p>QLM</p>
<p>What did they end up doing @QuietLurkingMom ?</p>
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<p>What research? If you are going to make such sweeping claims, you need to be prepared to document them.</p>
<p>linden, I looked at some of your other posts. You have started two threads about your “underachieving” sons. I get being a single parent and wanting the best for one’s kids. But you really need a reality check. You are living in a world full of misapprehensions and myths. It’s not good for you, and it’s certainly not good for your kids.</p>
<p>The student got in just under the wire to the in-state flagship which ended up being full that year. If that had fallen through, the next plan was community college with a transfer later to the flagship. The student did miss the deadline for the Honors College. </p>
<p>QLM</p>