Lookingforward, totally right on sometimes ignoring conventions sometimes just works out fine. Something I heard years ago also really resonated with me, that this is the first time in history that protecting one’s offspring from the culture (mainstream culture at this point) has become a parental task. At a point, the video games and so on become such an obsession, and we all walk a narrow line as parents as to how to not alienate and make our kids resentful as well as letting them be part of peer culture. S played plenty of Game Boy and later game systems, purchased by grandparents without my input, at at time when he was just starting to become a recreational reader. Guess which became an obsession. Heck, I blame my own stress level to an extent as well. Never know.
The ones who are really curious, who “love to know” things, who constantly “wonder why. . .” or just wonder, who ask questions, and take initiative to find the answers–those are the darn smart ones. High IQ alone doesn’t do it. It takes an active mind that is always interested in everything, always engaged. Verbal skills are important, too. (I have 7 kids who are all very smart in one way or another. Some have been in gifted programs, several NMFs, high IQs, etc. But some of the 98-99%ers don’t seem to be as smart as the 85-90%ers who have great verbal/social skills.)
It does not take a high IQ to do well in high school (and get into a top tier college).
Having lived in both the Northeast and the southwest, I think there is a perceptible difference in how URMs from lower socioeconomics neighborhoods are treated in different regions of the US. Was your D at a lower socioeconomic minority school? Also, which region of the US? The book Mismatch addresses the difference between URM student / school experience K-12, in the North v South.
Do you think its because 98%-99%ers have a harder time showing interest in what 50%ers have to say? For example, how much interest does an 80%-85% ers have in what a sub 15%ers has to say?
I find my that my son seems to have a lot to say to his professors and they seem to have a lot to say to him. As a sophomore in college he picked apartment mates who were graduate students in engineering. So, by default he seems to avoid hanging out with the mid 50% crowd and not say much among them to be polite.
One of the problems with consulting “most people” is that they have little to no knowledge of what “smart” is.
Back in third grade, kids thought “smart” was getting all your spelling words right.
I think it’s always important to balance what one learns from any study against other info. And watch how our own preconceptions affect us. (To me, that’s just smart.) In an ordinary sense, there must be plenty a 98% kid shares with a 50% kid, in certain situations. I’m not comfortable with notions that anyone needs to exclude based on a sense of intellectual superiority.
But I know there are differences in some respects. No, you don’t want the lagger for your study partner. And I’ll admit I didn’t want my kids to be affected by complacency. But real life isn’t theoretical. It takes many different strengths to get things done. In real life, we depend on lots of others who may have different sorts of smarts. And other strengths like loyalty, day to day problem handling, dependability.
My kid got it all from his mom. 
RE #424–Just referring to my own kids. Some with higher test scores are introverts/have poor verbal communication skills. It seems that my extroverted, talkative kid (who is not such a high scorer) is more often recognized as “very smart” because of her superior verbal/social skills. Yes, there are some 99%ers who sit in the back of classrooms grinding their teeth, scowling, rolling their eyes, and wishing they’d worn their “I’m Surrounded by Idiots” T-shirts They do have a hard time being interested in a lot of what others have to say. (Again, speaking of my own kids here!) It can be a burden at times, feeling alone/as if others aren’t on the same wavelength. OTOH, everyone has something to offer–even if they are not as “highly intelligent.”
My middle son is the smart kid who forgets his lunch and his homework. He scores a 95 on the test and forgets to turn in a daily grade. I noticed he was different when he was little. He started sentences with the word “actually” at age 4. He did not hear very well when he was young and was speech delayed. After tubes and surgeries, he was able to start speaking. Smart kids memorize facts and gifted kids question “why” at an early age. He is quiet and beats to a different drum. He read Harry Potter in the 3rd grade and has always been gifted at Math. All I know is that each child is wonderful in their own way. My oldest keeps saying he wishes he was gifted like my middle one. But, I told him we ALL have “gifts”. My oldest one has a love for people and an engaging personality that sets people at ease. He genuinely cares about others and friends come easy to him. For my middle one, he could spend all day reading or on the computer playing games. Friends are harder to make for him. I think the trick as a mom or dad is to identify what your child’s gifts are and to encourage them to find a field where they can do what they love each day. To get up each day smiling and doing what you love is the real gift.
- Genetics
- Read to them, read with them, get them to read early and often
- Foster a love of learning... I used to tell my kids "You have to learn to devour information. Learn to love to learn!"
Re #423
Which places in the north and south?
@perazziman, I’d say our town is solidly middle class, with an average annual income of around $100k. We are in northern NJ however, and are surrounded by wealthier towns - some actually the most prosperous zip codes in the nation. It is a majority white community, with a smattering of black, hispanic and recently more asian families.
Apparently, attending a Marshall Crenshaw show in a small club in New York during the 7th month of pregnancy also helps. W says she could feel S1 moving around to the music, particularly the bass line.
“I know it when I see it.” - yes, I totally agree with this definition of being smart. The key here is “I”. Yes, if one person is “smart” by YOU, it does not mean that he is smart by ME or somebody else. Then what we are discussing here? Savants with amazing mental abilities are probably not that smart for people who have to take care of then as many of them are basically 100% dependent on caregivers.
If " IQ is literally the measure of intelligence.", then what is this thread about? One cannot “become” smart, one cannot raise the IQ, it is inborn. We can obtain additional knowledge and skills but it does not mean that by doing so we raise our IQ. Kids can get much better grades if they work hard, but that is not even allowed to mention here, because, again, it is NOT going to raise a kid’s IQ. If " IQ is literally the measure of intelligence.", then some kid who failed classes may be smarter than the #1 student in his class. Are we discussing the means of raising IQ here since the topic is “How did your kid become so darn smart?? " Is it possible to raise an IQ? But then, the second part of the thread name is “Top five or ten.” - of what? If it is top 5 or 10 in class, then it has been decided that it has nothing to do with being 'smart” as high IQ does not guarantee the top grades at all, still have to do the work.
Maybe the thread title was a rhetorical question… simply postulated for parents to conjecture. There isn’t always a “right or wrong” or exact answer.
If you aren’t “allowed” to mention something, then why keep mentioning that you aren’t allowed to mention it?
IQ is nothing more than an attempt to measure something many now feel is broader and deeper than some arbitrary test. As if the best football player is only the one who can throw the ball furthest. On the day his/her throwing ability is tested.
Maybe try not to be so dang literal.
ok - nature - good genes (especially mother, father’s mother), nurture - environment that supports child’s full potential, reading, love, hugs, breast feeding, good nutrition, creative play, physical play, high expectations, opportunities to explore and learn, music lessons, free time, 2 married parents, reasonable rules and lastly, sufficient family income.
Nothing new.
When I said good genes - I meant according to research, mother and father’s mother are very important, not anything against father’s genes.
I remember reading something about that before as well. The child’s intelligence is much more strongly correlated to the mother’s than the fathers. Don’t remember reading anything about the father’s mother though.