fact, that’s an incredible story, your parents demanding on your bedroom and you and your wife submit! Vent here all you want but it looks to me it’s your parents who need to hear from you.
Established patterns, especially with family members, are very hard to break. I think mcat justified his giving in to his parents by saying his son was a toddler at the time and he did not want the expected outrage from his parents to affect his son. With a child that young in such small living quarters many of us might have just done the same thing.
mcat hoping that if your parents are still alive that you have been able to set some boundaries. Clearly by any reasonable person’s standards they are way out of bounds. You appear to have established a life for yourself here in the US, have a successful marriage and have raised a successful son. You really do not need the approval of your parents anymore. You have your own family now.
“My father repeatedly pressured me to force my son into organized sports (which my son hated) and military service (which my son did not think was a good path for him, although he has great respect for the military) on the grounds that he believed that a boy cannot grow up to be a man without these experiences. We had many, many arguments about this, but my husband and I never deviated from our decision that our son should make his own choices in these matters.”
What were the arguments about, though? Because if you’re trying to make the argument “no, it’s not necessary to participate in sports / join the military” (and here are my reasons to support that) - then you’re in a no-win situation, because nothing you say will convince the other person.
You needed to have changed the argument. If your position is “we’ve decided that junior needs to make his own decisions on this matter, and we are not going to pressure him or tell him what to do” - then there IS nothing to argue. You can’t argue with statements of fact. My guess is that you got in trouble because you tried to justify not needing sports / military to be a “successful young man” - but that’s the wrong argument to have.
Thanks.
Re: “sounds like some of the cultures going where son’s wife is almost considered like a servant to H’s parents - that is why in these households they want a son so bad instead of a daughter and elevate the baby boys so much”
It is indeed a part of the culture thing. We promise to ourselves that we will not become such inlaws.
@pizzagirl Actually, I did tell my father that we were allowing our son to make his own decisions about sports and military service. But my dad felt that these decisions were too important to be left to a teenager and that we were making a huge mistake by allowing our son this freedom.
My dad was utterly convinced that our son would grow up to be a deadbeat (and probably gay as well), and nothing could alleviate his distress. In my dad’s view, a teenage boy who did nothing outside of school except play with computer equipment and work part-time jobs so that he could buy more computer equipment (which is what my son did at that age) was headed for the gutter.
Have you ever known parents who never read to their small child? Were you distressed that they were denying their child an experience that’s important to the child’s development? I think that my dad felt the same way about sports and military service that many of us here would feel about reading to a small child.
“It is indeed a part of the culture thing. We promise to ourselves that we will not become such inlaws.”
OK, so you won’t. Why are you so worried, though, that you inadvertently will? Because your posts seem to reveal a lot of fear that inadvertently this kind of “pushiness” will come through, so you pull back from the girlfriend to the point that you won’t even wave hello in a Skype conversation for fear of it being too much. If I were a therapist, I might think that your parents really did a number on you and convinced you that the path they went down is the inevitable path for you, and I would urge you to remember that you determine your own path, with your son and with his eventual spouse. How your parents acted, and how miserable they were, has no bearing on anything - it’s in the past - and you control the future.
“I did tell my father that we were allowing our son to make his own decisions about sports and military service. But my dad felt that these decisions were too important to be left to a teenager and that we were making a huge mistake by allowing our son this freedom.”
You could agree with him that it might be a mistake, but what’s not debatable is that if it’s a mistake, it’s your mistake to make (as the parent).
mcat, that sounds truly horrible. I am sorry that you and your family had to experience that. Even as children, we notice when people are treating our parents poorly.
I am lucky to come from a family where we can absolutely call out our parents for bad behavior. I, and my cousins, exercise that right often. There isn’t a power imbalance like there is in most other families. Of course, it helps that my parents are generally reasonable people.
Mr R’s family is one where the children do not question the parents. That’s why it’s always amazing to me when Mr R sticks up for me when MIL starts on one of her issues with me. I stick up for myself but I try my very best to keep the peace whenever possible.
The bill struggle made me chuckle. That happens when I go out to dinner with my parents, but it’s a battle between me and my dad. It usually ends with one of us paying and one of us leaving the tip, with the person paying for the bill promising that the next one was on us.
Mr R’s parents would be horrified if one of the kids paid for the meal. That’s just not how it works in their family. Even when we go out with both sets of parents, FIL pays for the bill before it can make it to the table. (That, admittedly, makes my dad really uncomfortable. He doesn’t like when others consistently pay for his meals. I don’t blame him- I’m the same way.)
I cannot relate to “the battle of the bill” at all. Dh and I have been married for 27 years, and I can count on one hand the number of times fil has picked up the bill. We could never do the bill/tip split that @romanigypsyeyes suggested either. My fil is a terrible tipper! I distinctly remember one of those meals out that fil DID pay for. We had a $66 and some change bill, and fil left $70!! Fortunately, dh noticed this and discretely came along behind him and gave our waitperson more on the way out the door (without fil knowing).
For the sake of full disclosure, fil has contributed throughout the years to college funds as ds and our niece were growing up. I think part of that has to do with his narcissistic tendencies, however. Doing something small, such as picking up a bill for dinner, isn’t likely to be noticed enough for his tastes. He gave both ds and niece generous checks for Christmas. However, it was done in a very grandiose, look-at-me way. To the point of announcing - “You might want to film this,” before allowing them to open their envelopes. These cash gifts, unlike those in the past, were given directly to the “children” (granted our ds is 18 and niece is 23) rather than to my dh and his sister. Unfortunately, there is a considerable difference in means between our family and that of my husband’s sister (mother of the niece). Thus, when the checks were “presented,” fil said (out loud in front of everyone!!!), “Granddaughter - you can use that money for your college (she dropped ot for while). Grandson, since your college is taken care of, you can use yours for whatever you want.” He tried to back peddle later and say granddaughter could use hers for whatever she wanted, but the damage was already done. My sil was already embarrassed and hurt and had said to me, “He doesn’t think she can finish if he doesn’t help her.” Which is not true.
I know I sound like an ingrate given the fact that fil has contributed to college funds. It’s just the way in which it has been done that makes it hard to stomach. It’s all about recognition and control.
Ugh! My ILs have given my kids significant cash gifts, but discreetly, not with a big show!
It is interesting that after years of FIL picking up the tab for us for dinner, it’s reversed and H now feels he should be the picker-upper.
At D’s graduation, though, we were taking everyone (on both sides - mine and H’s) out to lunch after the graduation, fully expecting that we as the parents would pay ( it was 12 people) - and FIL insisted on paying, which was sweet, gracious and unexpected.
Hoggirl’s story reminds me that the giving should be done for the sake of the recipient, not the giver.
I guess we are now the inlaws fighting for the bill! We are scheduled to take a ski trip in a few weeks, and we are leaving a few days before DS#1 and his wife, due to DH’s schedule. I booked the lodging for 8 days, but we are staying 5 and then DS and wife’s friends are coming in behind us for a long weekend to stay. We paid for the lodging in full, and then discovered DS has transferred $ into our account (an old checking account is still linked between DS and our account so we can still transfer $ with ease, and there is another reason these accounts stay linked but its not relevant to this discussion) to repay us for the extra days they are using the condo. They also bought me my lift pass (they took over our old, dormant family account). I could transfer the $ back into their account, but this will just end up as a game of moving the money back and forth. I guess we’ll pay for meals out when we see them. The tug-of war will continue 
^Ahh, the old preemptive attack:) My DH and my dear father have played this game for 25 years.
Its nice that DS is able to play this game with us 
@jym626 I’m available for adoption if you need any additional family members for the “transfer money” game.
@jym626, don’t worry be happy. Life is too short for that. Enjoy your trip!
My H’s grandpa used to say. “Don’t look a gift horse in the mouth” meaning just enjoy the gift without questioning it.
Well, in fairness, the DILs friends were our guests 2 yes ago. We picked up the tab for their lift tix too because we had 2 for 1 coupons and for lodging big enough for everyone. Happy to do so. They cooked. That was more than payback in my book.
I’m a grown up…and so is my husband. DH does not allow his mother to insult or badger me, or our kids…and yes, she has done both.
And yes, we have left their house abruptly. And NO we never stay with them at all anymore. There are plenty of hotels.
I can tolerate being insulted by my MIL (and she does this often). But I cannot tolerate when she insults my kids. At all.
Why do inlaws act that way ? What good could ever come of it. None.
Ugh, hoggirl, I hate when people tip like that.
In my family the “I’ll pay, you tip” works because not ripping well ( unless the service is horrendous) is unfathomable.