How to answer nosy race questions....

Parent Cafe
181

I’d never heard of that one–had to look it up!

One such term that interests me is “Canuck.” I was taught that it was an insulting term of the same type as Mick, Guinea, Frog, Limey, Polack, and so on. I was startled when I found out that it was actually the name of a Canadian hockey team.

By the way, the other day I phoned in to my local public radio station to make a contribution. The guy who answered the phone would NOT stop going on about my last name and how “difficult” it is. I ran through my usual routine: it’s pronounced exactly as spelled; lots of Finnish names are constructed that way, for example Eero Saarinen the architect, Jorma Kaukonen the guitar player, yadda, yadda yadda. He just kept on exclaiming.

182

While I understand that Jew’s Harp has absolutely nothing to do with Judaism and is native to Asia or Turkey, it doesn’t strike me as offensive the way some other terms using Jew are. I think I have mostly called it a mouth harp.

183

@greenwitch: I have no idea what you are talking about, “only being allowed to identify as black.” Who said that?

As to fair, if the St. Patrick’s Day Parades truly were understood to be a strict expression and celebration of Irish/Celtic pride, and attended, hosted and celebrated by only those of such descent, are you telling me that that group would not balk at my kids being there, raising the flag, dressed in the green?

Please answer this in a sense larger than yourself, with an eye toward historical social truths in this country, and under the conditions that I set in the example.

184

@HeartArt: I have to think that your son’s relationship to the issue of heritage and race, not to mention culture, is necessarily experienced through a different prism, one more faceted by at least one carat, than that of which I would say many speak.

Issues surrounding adoption are inclusive of issues related to the explanation of how family was constructed, why it was so, and takes care in this modern age to be free of the societally-imposed taboos of shame and abandonment, infertility and second-tier parentage. Revelation is often something that I have found to be a near-offensive tactic against criticism.

Perhaps you would not agree. This has been what I have observed.

I also did genetic testing, and while I can assure you that I have no idea what an ancestral lineage past 1897 is, I can tell you that when I travel to large cities, or when I am walking through airports, people from all over the world have openly claimed me as theirs. To see them smile as they walk to me, hoping that I speak their language, such brightness in their eyes…makes me claim the world as my family. And this I tell my children. In NYC, Lebanese, Moroccan, Dominican, Venezuelan and Haitian people know without doubt that I belong to them, and I have been scolded for not speaking Spanish and Lebanese at different times, scolded for “being ashamed,” of who I am. Such would not be the case.

The genetic testing revealed about 39% Croatian background, which seriously made me go, “Huh?” But, it is what it is. I feel no need to tell anyone anything if I am touched, poked, prodded, assailed.

The exception to that: once on a commuter bus an Irish woman (“straight-up Irish” as The Brothers would say) reached across the aisle and grabbed my face, and exclaimed in deepest accented English, “Oh, My Lord, Child…You’re Irish!” Her unplanned, visceral response was one that was, I believe, alarming to both her and me, and we were kind of stuck in the moment, as she turned my face from left to right, to examine my bones.

Considering what I’ve written about my youngest son, I was not inclined to disagree. As I gently pulled her hands from my face, and kept her in embrace, I told her I do not know for sure, but , “Yes, Ma’am, it is quite possible that I am.”

185

I once worked with a woman from Honduras who had a similar experience on a bus, @Waiting2exhale. :slight_smile: She was a medium-complected woman of African and probably European ancestry, with greenish eyes. She was quite charmed by this old woman claiming her as her own. She was a sweet person.

I have an Irish bus story for you. Many years ago, my mother and father were traveling by bus in rural Ireland, near the village from which my mother’s family came. A pair of older ladies were sitting in front of them, and–probably hearing their American accents–engaged my mother in conversation about why they were there, who they were related to, the usual thing in that place and time, where one is related in some way to everyone within 15 miles or more. :slight_smile: Having established her antecedents, they asked about her husband, and my mother told them that his parents were from Finland. One said to the other, “Look, Ma, a Finn!” And they both turned and stared at him.

186

Now I’m beginning to think there is a distinct difference in how that group of folks engages others…rather open and immediate, at least when on a bus. Good to know.

187

@waiting2exhale - something you said back on page 9 (here’s a fragment below)

indicated to me that being Black has historically been seen as being “other” and has therefore come less easily into being seen as American, and has therefore been excluded also from being seen as belonging to different ethnic groups (Irish was the example I used). It’s not what I believe but what has been ingrained in our culture. And yes, historically that group would balk at including someone they view as “other” even if those people have every genetic right to be there.

188

Also, I am part Croatian too. At least, that’s what my family history says. I haven’t had genetic testing done and since Croatia is in that part of the world that is a bridge between larger land masses - anything goes.

My great grandparents considered themselves Austrian. Because it was part of the Austro-Hungarian Empire when they left!

189

“less easily into being seen as American,”

Yes, this is my assertion. The ‘one drop’ rule bears this out.

“…excluded also from being seen as belonging to different ethnic groups …”

Yes, I would say this, but that places agency for the exclusion on those other than the Black person. So a natural follow-up would not be that Blacks can only claim to be Black, but that Blacks are easily identified as Black, and have tended to be perceived and grouped to be “only Black.”

That in itself is a raging controversy, and sometimes thinly veiled and terribly self-loathing aspect of identity in the Black community. (I may not be telling you anything you do not know.) So often in our recent history Blacks have been too happy to share that we are Black+. For a very long time, the go-to was Cherokee. We have hurt each other over proximity to a look that suggests straight from the Motherland.

Further, that idea of inquiry of “What are you?” can also be a warning, issued as inquiry, that someone suspects the taint of the Other to be present, and that therefore one’s own validity or legitimacy to speak to, own, discuss and dissect, issues of concern in the Black community may be held suspect.

My youngest son, the most likely to be carded (so to speak) has by far the greatest consciousness and… activist voice…regarding Black issues and images. It can be a bit shocking if you’re not ready for it, but Black folks are incredibly used to this as well. Look at Walter White, Adam Clayton Powell, and Thurgood Marshall.

190

re# 181
Apparently the term “Jew’s harp” is often felt to be offensive or a slur, even if it was not intended as such. http://www.jewsharpguild.org/history.html Calling it a mouth harp might be more sensitive.

191

Thought that turn of a [phrase was l ill-advised, regardless of what group it is generalizing/stereotyping.

192

A jaw harp is used in a lot of folk/Appalachian music. The other term is offensive to Jews and it’s use is ignorant.

193

Well, not exactly. The origin of the term “Jew’s harp” is obscure, but it dates back something like 400 years. It may well be a corruption of some other word (probably not “jaw”, though), or it may be intended to refer to Jews. There are also different views of whether (and why) it is pejorative toward Jews. I would say this is an example of something that so many people think is pejorative, that it makes sense to use a different name, even if it wasn’t originally pejorative at all. (Bonus question: should the Gypsy Moth be renamed?)

194

Meanings of words and language changes and evolves depending on factors such as the way they’re used, the cultural context in that period, etc.

One good example of this is how the term “Negro” was once considered a polite respectful way to describe African-Americans during the 19th century. However, by the mid-late 20th century, that term was itself regarded as a negative demeaning term through the manner in which its used and popular perceptions and thus, that term is no longer considered appropriate in polite company or civil discourse.

More recently, within the last several years, the word “thug” has increasingly been regarded in more corners of US society as a racially loaded pejorative term disproportionately used against African-Americans and thus, there’s an increasing trend in questioning its use in polite company and by extension, to regard users as tone-deaf at best and even possibly closet racists.

195

My last name doesn’t match my ethnicity. When random strangers ask why, I launch into a long, entertaining, wholly fictional, multi-generational story worthy of Neal Stephenson. There’s a princess, a missionary, multi-continent chases by imperial soldiers, trains, boats, assumed identities, and a baby.

Gotta find your amusement where you can.

196

My name is an Americanization of my Chinese name. It was very unusual (and I hated it) when I was growing up in Iowa (and already feeling Other enough). In the past several years, there are many "Jalen"s after Jalen Rose played for Michigan bball in the late 80s/early 90s. Twice (twice! how can that be?) I’ve been asked if I’m named after him.

He’s an African American male, but more importantly, he’s about fifteen years (at least) younger than me. Hmm.

197

While I understand that Jew’s Harp has absolutely nothing to do with Judaism and is native to Asia or Turkey, it doesn’t strike me as offensive the way some other terms using Jew are. I think I have mostly called it a mouth harp.>>>>>>

Is this a harmonica? I’ve never heard “Jew harp”.

198

It’s the little lyre-shaped thing that goes “boing.”

Here’s a Ted talk about it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4SpWuseQGys

199

"Thought that turn of a [phrase was l ill-advised, regardless of what group it is generalizing/stereotyping. "

Do tell me why; it is a generic as I use it.

200

"to regard users as tone-deaf at best and even possibly closet racists. "

As tone-deaf at best…like that.