If Harvey Mudd and U of San Diego had a baby...

College Search & Lists
1

Just got back from a visit to both USD and Harvey Mudd and my daughter fell in love with both of them for very different reasons.

USD - Beautiful campus, medium sized. Friendly people with a good social scene. 10 minutes away from a ton of activities (shopping, surfing, restaurants.) Great study abroad opportunities, good shot at merit scholarships. USD offers both Engineering and Business whereas Harvey Mudd is just Engineering.

Harvey Mudd - The first school she fell in love with academically. Multiple labs, underwater robotics tank, co-op programs with local tech companies, and collaborative (NOT competitive!) spirit all hit home. Also really liked that they require students to take a course in every engineering discipline for a more well rounded experience.

Her comment was if those 2 colleges had a baby it would be her perfect college and she could stop looking. Any suggestions that might fit the bill? She’s leaning heavily toward an engineering major, but also interested in business.

General stats - junior, #1 ranking, 3.99 unweighted gpa, will have completed 11 AP classes by the time she graduates, 1520 SAT, involved in school/competitive sports and volunteers for a local non-profit. We are not counting on any need based aid, so merit scholarships are a huge plus. Her goal is to go where she gets the most $, our goal is to make sure she finds the right fit and we’re willing to pay for it if needed. Thanks in advance for your help!

2

thats basically Stanford. Great academics and beautiful campus. Only thing missing/only complication is that it can be competitive at times

3

Mudd is part of the Claremont Consortium and students have access to classes and programs at all 5 colleges. Did she look at Scripps? That’s a beautiful campus as well. So is Pomona.

Mudd is a super-reach for anyone (esp. if you’re seeking merit), and is pretty hard-core academically speaking. USD is not. USD can be her safety.

You might want to look at Santa Clara as the Mudd-USD hybrid that gives merit, is a feeder school to Silicon Valley, and is a Jesuit school (USD is Catholic).

Also USC – not small, but beautiful campus with excellent programs and merit aid possibility.

4

UCSB seems to fit the bill… very strong/rigorous engineering programs (especially strong in chemical engineering, materials engineering, nanoscience), beautiful campus ON the beach, very social and friendly student body).

5

How about Loyola Marymount and Cal Poly SLO?

Is California required, or just preferred?

6

Thanks for everyone’s input so far! California is not a requirement; she’s open to just about anywhere that is in a good sized city so long as there are plenty of things to do nearby. She does love the beach though so that’s a definite plus. D is not interested in any of the large schools, but Santa Clara felt too small and quiet for her. Cal Poly is on the visit list for next time as is Loyala Marymount (that one wasn’t on our radar until after we got home.)

7

I was thinking Santa Clara or Fordham?

8

If engineering is the goal, I think (in my biased opinion since my similar stats son chose it from OOS after vetting many programs) the baby is Cal Poly. Classes are small and all professor taught, even labs and discussions. The facilities for undergraduates are vast with more than 80 labs in the college of engineering alone. They have an incubator with housing right in downtown SLO. It’s close to the beach. SoCal and the Bay are accessible, but it’s isolated enough that congestion is not an issue. As for going where she gets the most money, it’s net cost that matters. It would be hard to beat the value of CP. The biggest drawback from her priorities is that it’s not in a big city.

I’d avoid the big name engineering schools. The undergraduate experience can be pretty underwhelming, with big classes and lots of graduate instruction. In fact, a family member who is a Stanford engineering PhD, with both academic and private sector careers, told my son that he’d get a better undergrad education at Cal Poly for those very reasons.

I love the beauty of Santa Clara, but they don’t have awesome engineering facilities.

Fordham does not have engineering.

As for the more well rounded experience at Mudd, it’s true, but for better or worse, at the cost of depth, and probably why so many go on to pursue graduate degrees.

If she liked Mudd, she may want to at least vet Olin. It makes Mudd look big. It’s very small and a very niche fit, but has a very unique approach that is a hybrid of engineering, liberal arts, but with a significant entrepreneurial emphasis. It sits completely within the Babson campus, which is quite pretty, and it is close to Boston.

9

I’ve heard the same about the big name engineering schools. Smaller class sizes, professor taught, and minimal “snootiness” are all very important to her, which is why many of the big name and/or big schools, have been ruled out.

The more I read about Cal Poly the more I think it may actually be a great fit. Being a larger university, I’m surprised at how small the classes are. Looks like it’s more challenging to get into than a lot of folks think so it will probably be one of her reach schools.

Does anyone have any other schools to suggest? Trinity U, Gonzaga, U of Portland, Vanderbilt and Wash U in St Louis are all on the maybe list. We’ll visit as many as we can, but can any of those be ruled out based on what she knows she’s looking for so far?

10

Cal Poly’s admission process is pretty unique. They admit by algorithm, competitively to each major. CS, ME, and BME are really reaches for everyone as they tend to hover at 9-15%, but unlike holistic schools, this process is objective. There are some very specific things to know about the application process, one of which hangs up a handful of very qualified students every year. I’ll PM details.

My son had a similar outlook. He wanted small class size, direct admission to his major, ME, a curriculum that started engineering and not just background math and physics, freshman year, good toys (labs for UGs), and access to outdoor activities (hiking, skiing, surfing, biking, etc). Lastly, on campus visits, he was keenly aware of where students seemed happy and where they didn’t. He didn’t want anything that was really big. He didn’t want a pure tech school where the average student preferred math proofs to soccer for their free time (think MIT and Caltech). He wanted a “typical” college experience. He wouldn’t go south. We visited lots of schools and he ended up with an odd list, but every school met his criterion.

Trinity, Gonzaga, Portland…lacking toys.

Vandy and Wash U worth a look. I’m not sure about class size or their use of TAs (while on that subject, plenty of professors are bad teachers :smiley: ).

From his experience, I’d add a few schools, some he applied to, some he didn’t, but they seem to be in line with what your daughter is looking for. They are WPI, RPI, Lehigh, Case Western, and Rice.

Lastly, here’s a few we visited, that on the surface seem like they’d be good, but then had some major flaw. Dartmouth had a nice core curriculum, but in order to get an ABET accredited BS, it’s 5 years, with no possibility of merit aid. They aren’t well respected in engineering circles. Tufts students were genuinely happy, the campus is nice, and it’s in a good location. They are a bit lacking in toys. Mostly though, it was the total lack of merit combined with the fact he had stronger, more respected programs on his list that were better priced. Brown…no toys. Cornell…big lectures, lots of grad students teaching, reputation for unhappy students. Colorado School of Mines…reputation as a grind with unhappy students, very poor M:F ratio. Rose-Hulman…he didn’t like the location, and bad M:F ratio.

Lastly, I’ll save a paragraph for the “LAC Engineering Schools.” We visited them all. Lafayette, Bucknell and Union are all woefully lacking in facilities and deep broad curriculum. What a student would purportedly get in exchange, more history, arts and social sciences, isn’t a reality because of the limitations of ABET curricula. I’m sure they produce fine engineers, but it seems there are lots of better options.

It’s a fun time. Start visiting soon and enjoy the process. In the end, she’ll develop a list, safety to reach, where if vetted properly, she’d be happy at any of them.

11

Santa Clara is an excellent engineering and business school. For engineering it is very similar to Cal Poly SLO in terms of rigor and the blend of practical and theoretical teaching. SCU just got a $100million donation to their engineering school. They are about to build a new engineering center, but that will probably be a few years out. A friend of mine got a bachelors at Mudd and a PhD at SCU. He said a few classes were as intense as Mudd, but generally a fair amount less intense.

One school that comes to mind is Rice. One of the best small engineering schools with all around strong academics.

12

I second Rice. There is lots to do in the Rice Village around the campus and in the city of Houston generally. The Galveston beaches are ugly in comparison to those in Cali, but the weather is warm like California most of the year.

13

Having lived in Houston for 4 years, I can attest that Rice is a VERY cool campus, with a great housing arrangement and good engineering program. However, Houston weather is in no way like CA weather. The humidity is oppressive!

The biggest difference between CP and Santa Clara is the toys. That may change with the new addition, but it will be too late for your daughter. For lab intensive majors like ME, that may seal the deal. For something like CS or CE, it may make no difference at all.

14

I thought Harvey Mudd was already married to Rose Hulman, in which case it would be a big problem if he had a baby with someone else! :slight_smile:

15

Lol. D is leaning towards ME, so the toys definitely do make a difference. Santa Clara will no doubt have some new toys in a few years but the timing doesn’t really work for us there. That said, it’s probably worth a full tour just to give it a fair shake.

We’ll take a look at Rice (though I really, really dislike TX. We live in Colorado and the humidity there makes me feel like I’m drowning. Galveston was also my first beach experience and I recall thinking “why would anyone want to hang out on a beach if they all look like this??”)

As for Cal Poly…it sounds like you have to declare your major upfront and stick with it. That could be a deal breaker since D isn’t 100% sure and probably won’t be until she gets a bit further into her studies. Sigh. It is very appealing in almost every other aspect. On paper anyways!

16

Oh - forgot to mention.

RPI and WPI were on the list until she saw the M:F ratio.

We visited Lehigh and she felt the campus was cold and depressing and we didn’t see very many kiddos interacting with each other.

Colorado School of Mines is too close to home.

She felt Bucknell was in the middle of nowhere.

And Case is out because the recruiter they sent to our local college fair was totally unkempt, spit his granola at us while he spoke, and knew next to nothing about the school!

Tufts could be interesting. Will dig into that a bit more as well. Thank-you!!

17

I definitely agree with Rice. It seems like it meets all of your daughter’s preferences: it’s a great school for engineering, isn’t big, the campus is gorgeous, the student body is very friendly and collaborative, and it’s right in the middle of a city with lots to do. They also offer merit scholarships (though not too many) that don’t have separate applications, every applicant is automatically considered. And it’s only about an hour away from Galveston, since your daughter likes beaches (I know it isn’t the prettiest beach, but a beach is a beach :slight_smile: ) It honestly sounds like the perfect school for her.

18

This was my first thought…

Others have made good suggestions. She may do very well with merit at LMU.

19

You cannot freely move in and out of majors at Cal Poly, but you can switch. They make it a little arduous because they don’t want students backdooring into tough admits. Very qualified students coming in can move MUCH more freely than less qualified students because one of the hurdles is being evaluated to see if you’d have been admitted into the destination major out of high school in the first place. Engineering is actually the largest exporter of major changers on campus. So it is certainly possible. We met a student on our first visit who transferred from Aerospace to Econ. I mentioned that I’d heard major change can be difficult. His response, “You can switch to anything from Aerospace.” The same would be true of ME.

20

That’s because, for better or worse, Bucknell IS in the middle of nowhere. :smiley:

It’s interesting how weather, or a tour guide or any other random thing can influence a student. The day we visited Lehigh, it was a glorious spring day with all of the trees popping to bright green life.

After seeing pictures of the HMC architecture, my son said there’s no way he’d consider going there. As odd as that sounds, it’s not a rare reaction.