Including pictures of your grandchildren in your Holiday cards??? Grandson's mom says no...

Parent Cafe
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Another thought. Maybe baby parents are a little uncomfortable with having A child out of wedlock, although it’s certainly more commonplace these days. But in the chance that they are even a bit embarrassed about it, just conjecturing, perhaps they don’t want it shared with many other people just yet. Just musing.


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Could be. I was thinking kind of the opposite, that new-mom will be using her Xmas card as some sort of pseudo “wedding announcement” and doesn’t want any of the limelight diverted, but your thoughts might be possible, too.

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Aunt bea I’m so sorry you had to endure those comments! Awful!!!

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@Pizzagirl - "The hypothetical DIL now says - she wanted to be in the delivery room "

Here is what OP posted - “They haven’t gone yet to hospital. I’m pretty sure she knows I plan to be there and that I don’t care if I don’t see the actual delivery. I don’t want to SEE it at all, I would be at head if anywhere. I didn’t even want my hubby watching down there, and his arm made an awesome thing to pull on during pushing! Her mom plans to be in there for it all. I get that she wants here mom there and I don’t mind. I would like to be there so I can see him asap.”

So yes she wanted to be at the hospital when the baby was born. But I don’t think she cared if she was in there for the actual delivery. She just wanted to see the baby once it was born.

“When I was in the hospital, she decorated my condo”

I think that OP actually owns the condo and is letting them stay there.

On a side note my sisters MIL & FIL wanted to see the delivery of my niece. My sister said no way and they were super mad about it for a long time.

And for the poster(s) that are wondering about how our own relationships are with are MIL’s and how that affects our opinions . I’m not sure it really matters. My MIL has hated me since the day she met me when I was 18. She yelled at me at that first meeting and told me I wasn’t good enough for her son. Over the years the insults and yelling have gotten worse. I’ve always ignored it and I think that makes her even madder. DH always stands up for me. The kids do not have a good relationship with her because they have seen how she treats me. But they did have a good relationship with DH’s dad while he was alive.

So if anything I should be siding with the GF. However I still believe that this is really a case of a young mother and a Grandmother who are both unsure of things.

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There are many life lessons in this thread. Some people may have medical or situational things in their life, and they became a bitter, difficult person; another may have become a kind, sweet, giving person who would never intentionally hurt anyone.

Some people are so insecure that if they have some money, they act like they are better than others because of their money (and it doesn’t have to be a lot for some to have this attitude).

I cannot imagine having my privacy violated with anyone other than my H, mom or my sister while I delivered my children. Turns out only had H, as the others live away. If I had a dad or in-laws insisting on this, I would have the staff tell them the doctor is not allowing them in if H wouldn’t tell them they were not allowed in due to our wishes. My dad was a gem, and he would have been very uncomfortable in the delivery room, but if I wanted him there he would have done it for me.

Sad that some people do not understand boundaries or that they do pertain to them too - they don’t have a ‘golden ticket’ or a pass on the boundaries, no matter how ‘special’ they think they are - some of those folks live to get away with rule breaking. Some create chaos to deflect from their own inner turmoils, or other psychological needs.

Some people push others down to somehow ‘elevate’ themselves - but actually the opposite is true.

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My MIL has no filter. She talks disparingly about her other sons and DIL and grandchildren to us. I’m sure she talks about us to them in the same way. But she doesn’t get that she is doing something wrong (she’s not the brightest bulb in the package.) She also think her poor sons are under the thumbs of her DIL’s - but the reality is that the one under any thumb is my FIL. She also labels everyone - for instance my son is always “my grandson, who’s adopted,” or “my doctor, who’s Chinese ,” or cousin’s H who is ex Priest. I am “DIL, who is Jewish.” I don’t even think she knows how offensive it is.

We all just roll our eyes. Can’t teach an old dog new tricks.

Even when we do point things out it goes in one ear and out the other.

I was also in my 30’s when H and I were married so not an insecure young bride or young mom having to deal with my MIL.

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Oh gosh…my ex had a GM that did not like his mom. So he hated his GM. Kids love mom. It’s a fact of life. GM is just a relative, not on par with mom:)

I think it may be a bit of an overreaction by DIL, and a boundary issue here. But likely different personalities at play. I didn’t care about this stuff at all when my kids were born. It’s not important.

OP: send another card of the dog. Enclose a pic of the baby with a few special ones. End the issue. Let her have the first card.

I suggest you offer support and for her to call you if she wants an hour free to shower or have a phone call or whatever.

If they live in your property, she will likely always bristle bc with this comes certain strings. My SIL used to complain, but took advantage of babysitting, gifts, $, etc. Life is full of strings…

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I really don’t understand these stories of abusive behavior from inlaws over decades.

If my MIL “yelled” at me and flung insults at me, she would get one more opportunity to change her ways. I would never subject myself to that on a regular basis, and no way would my children be exposed to such inappropriate and toxic behavior. I don’t understand people who allow others to abuse them in such a manner, and expose their children to this as well. My reaction would be the same if my family members treated my DH this way. They would be given an ultimatum: behave in a civil manner to my spouse or lose the pleasure of my company and that of my children. I’m sincerely confused as to why anyone would tolerate this.

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@emilybee at least MIL ‘spreads her good cheer’ and you are not the lone target for her disparaging remarks.

When my mom was older and speaking somewhat out of line or demanding things with unreasonable attitude and approach, I could at least guide her away because at that point the parent-child relationship had changed. I was the transportation, etc.

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This thread reminds me of the OP’s becoming a grandma thread because she posts initially and then disappears while we run on for pages and pages about the topic that OP doesnt care enough about or is too embarrassed about to come back to.

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I am with @Nrdsb4 on the behavior of some of the in-laws… My heart goes out to those posters who have experienced the described abuse from in-laws. And let’s be clear - that’s what it is - emotional abuse. I personally would not be capable of engaging on any level with anyone who treated me this way. And how do we teach our children to set personal boundaries and set high standards in their expectations of others if they observe us accept such disrespect?

People who direct those sorts of comments towards family members have emotional problems of their own. I would not allow their problems to become mine.

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Since we’re sharing stories of other MILs - and I say this because I’m not directing this at the OP - the story which most shocked me was one I heard from a friend who is a nurse at a hospital. A pregnant patient showed up at the hospital to delivery her baby, and was accompanied by her husband and the husband’s mother. The MIL demanded to be allowed into the delivery room, but the mom said she only wanted her husband in the delivery room. The MIL said it was her right because it was her grandchild being born, and physically barged in. The doctor and husband tried to restrain her but she fought them. My friend had to call security to get the MIL ejected from the delivery room, all the while the mom was crying and hysterical.

Can you imagine what Thamksgiving is like with that family!?

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In February 2015, the OP posted asking questions about helping her S buy a home. She said he was buying a home on his own but they were probably going to co-sign the mortgage, since much of his income was commissions and he hadn’t been employed long enough for the bank to include commissions when calculating the amount he could borrow. His girlfriend wasn’t contributing to the purchase price and therefore her name wouldn’t be on the deed. Her S was too smart to put her name on the deed unless she contributed to the purchase. The GF was bringing her mattress and might buy a bedroom set. The OP and H were buying their S a new TV and giving him their old furniture. In September, seven months later, OP said the baby was due this week, so we know it wasn’t a preemie.

So, I suspect there is a lot more going on here. It’s probable that the GF knew she was pregnant when she moved in. Maybe she didn’t share the news with dad to be, wanting at least a little time of living together to see if they might “work” before telling him the news. Assuming he knew the GF was pregnant when they moved in together, it sure sounds to me as if S didn’t tell parents his GF was pregnant until he got them to cosign the mortgage. Who knows what he told his GF about his parents at the time.

I’m not casting any stones at anyone, but there may be a reason for the ill feeling here. If I had gotten pregnant and my BF’s reaction had been I’ll buy a house and you can move into it, but it will be in my name only and, BTW, I’ll need my parents to co-sign the mortgage and I don’t think they will if they know you’re pregnant so we can’t tell them right now…well…I might not have the warm and fuzzies toward him or his family.

In fact, if I were this young woman I might be thinking that I had no security at all. The house is in my BF’s name, so he can throw me out anytime he wants. If I had to start over, all I’ve got is a mattress (and maybe a bedroom set). His parents insisted on buying the nursery furniture, so if we split, I’m sure they’d insist he keep the crib and maybe even the baby clothes so they will be there when the baby spends time with him.

I’ve got to go back to work–and she may, like many new mothers feel more conflicted about that than she expected. I don’t earn enough to afford a full time nanny. My mom is employed so she can’t help me. His mom has agreed to take care of the baby when I’m at work. She already criticizes everything I do, so I’m sure she’ll just do whatever she wants when I’m not around.

I suspect that BF’s mom (and maybe even BF) would be happier if I just left and they got to keep the baby. I’m NEVER going to let that happen, but what if they fight me for custody. They’ve got a lot more money than I do and how could I ever pay for day care and attorney’s fees at the same time?

Now, I’m not saying that IS what is going on. But yes, I think the fact that the couple is unmarried and the house is in BF and his parents’ names, but not hers, and that she may be upset about having to return to work so quickly could all be factoring into this.

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Since we’ve already gotten off topic and the OP is repeating her pattern of not coming back…

A few days ago my in laws threw a fit because we’re having thanksgiving with my parents. It’s for completely logistical reasons- we have a dog, his extended family doesn’t allow dogs, and we have no where to place her. We can bring her to my parents and have thanksgiving there.

They want him to come down by himself and leave me with the dog and have thanksgiving apart. We’ve had thanksgiving apart every year but I put my foot down and said no. We’re having holidays together now that we’re married. Every year I have split holidays up whether that means we’re apart or drive ridiculous distances to see everyone.

We don’t even have kids yet but I have a feeling that when we do, it’ll be a power trip because everything with my in laws is about control.

I don’t put up with it and I don’t see them often because of it. I refuse. And Mr R knows I’ll have no problem keeping kids from them if they treat me like crap. I will not let my kids see their grandparents treat their parents like dirt. He supports me.

And no, sorry, I don’t think grandparents have a right to be involved in their grandkids lives no matter what. If they’re toxic, they lose that privilege.

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I am not sure I would expect my boyfriend to put the house in joint name unless I was contributing to down payment and mortgage. Perhaps he proposed and she declined.

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I’m still wondering who paid for the maternity coverage. The girl couldn’t be on her mom’s policy, because it didn’t cover maternity.

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My MIL was severely toxic. She was abusive to DH and wrote me letters saying she hoped DH would beat me so I couldn’t have kids. We didn’t see his parents for several years and tried to get custody of DH’s younger brother (12 years younger). By the time we had kids, she had calmed down somewhat and had a lot of health issues, but we NEVER left our kids with her or FIL. I’m not sure she ever held S2. I think I have one picture of her holding S1. When she passed away, it was just a few months after I had been diagnosed with cancer. I convinced DH to sit down with the guys (who were 10 & 11) and explain why he was not upset about her passing. I wanted the guys to know that they could feel sad or worried about me, and just because DH wasn’t upset about his mom passing away didn’t mean they had to shut down their emotions.

My parents were 650 miles away and we’d see them twice a year. Hard to develop relationships there, but at least it wasn’t an ugly, toxic scenario.

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“how do we teach our children to set personal boundaries and set high standards in their expectations of others if they observe us accept such disrespect?”

Well, at the same time, we’re trying to teach them about family and unity, which is about more than the nuclear group. It can extend to grounding and identity. DH and I spared my kids the details about my mother’s behavior, but did encourage a careful relationship. My mother was smart enough to be good when the kids were present. This wasn’t a position of weakness. In fact, we were, as someone mentioned, trying to model the right parts. As the kids got older, they saw the first signs of her challenges in their own relationships with her. We discussed boundaries, that one can love the good and still make their own best choices and set limits.

So my kids can say they love grandma, but they do have boundaries. But this relationship is entirely different than with MIL, my grandmother, a favorite great aunt on DH’s side, or my bff, who were warm and loving, not the least bit intrusive, judgmental, never sought control over the kids, just wanted to love them, dote on them. That was the real and deep bond.

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I have no idea what I would expect if I were in her situation, but it is not as if she is contributing nothing to their joint enterprise. For one thing, she was carrying and giving birth to their baby. I don’t know what’s fair in this circumstance, but there’s at least an argument that her labor is worth a little of the equity. I’d be a little miffed if someone claimed I were contributing “nothing.” (I know you didn’t say that).

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Romani, I am sorry for your thanksgiving situation. My kids are not married yet but my S presently lives with his girlfriend who I like a lot. Since they moved in together they have decided to spend holidays together and we respect that. Your in laws should respect that you are together now. And not let them bully your H into going alone.

Did he explain that your dog is what is preventing you from spending thanksgiving with them. Not that it matters but I feel that the dog is part of the family and besides what are you suppose to do with him. It’s not fair of them to want you (or just him) to come without the dog when you don’t have a place for the dog.

My D’s boyfriends parents want them for every holiday. Since they aren’t living together or married my D comes to our house for Christmas and BF comes for a few days but not the actual holiday. His parents have them on every other holiday (we live far from the kids, his parents live close). I wanted the kids to come for Memorial Day but the bf’s parents have a party every Memorial Day and that this year it will be bf’s graduation party so they can’t come then.

There is a lot more to this story that I don’t have time or inclination to go into. But it makes me really sad that if my D marries her present BF that I know there will be a lot of tension about holidays and that I think we are going to lose. Bf’s parents are very overbearing and pushy. I love the BF but there are tons of problems with his family.

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Deb, yes they’re well aware of the dog situation. They just don’t care.