Is a Campus Tour Really Necessary?

Colleges & Universities Brown University
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<p>I would like to visit Brown, but my parents have informed me that I won’t be visiting any colleges that are out-of-state. That’s partly due to financial issues. </p>

<p>They don’t see how they/I can afford Brown because it’s extremely expensive. My parents make less than $60,000 a year, so their parental contributions would be reduced, wouldn’t they? </p>

<p>A friend of mine applied to Yale and her tuition is only $4,100 a year. Is Brown that generous?</p>

<p>I’m sorry that I strayed away from my original question, but can I apply ED to Brown without visiting the campus? Is Brown the kind of school that it doesn’t matter what it looks like because it’s amazing in every other aspect?</p>

<p>Obviously, I love Brown, but if you guys have any advice/comments, please respond!</p>

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<p>I would say if possible, you should really try to visit. Nothing could be worse than (assuming you get in) completely hating the campus. Try to ask your parents if you can visit the campus if you are accepted. If it is really not possible, I am sure people at Brown could give you a fairly detailed description of the campus. Also check Campusvibe for reviews of the Brown campus.</p>

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<p>You would barely have to pay anything to go to Brown if your parents make under 60k.</p>

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<p>You definitely can apply ED without visiting, but if you have any chance at all to visit, take it. Try going to here [EFC</a> Calculator: How Much Money for College Will You Be Expected to Contribute?](<a href=“http://apps.collegeboard.com/fincalc/efc_welcome.jsp]EFC”>http://apps.collegeboard.com/fincalc/efc_welcome.jsp) to calculate roughly how much your parents will be expected to contribute to your tuition.</p>

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<p>My opinion of Brown was solidified such that I applied ED based on my tour. I would not have done so had I not visited the campus - I think checking out the feel and atmosphere of the campus/students CAN make or break your decision. There were colleges I decided not to apply to after touring them as well.</p>

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<p>Chelsea: Absolutely, without a doubt, you can apply to Brown without visiting. You live far away, and no college, including Brown, would expect a student in your circumstances to visit before applying. Trust me, it will make not one iota of a difference in your chances whether you visit or not.</p>

<p>As for finances: You need to do some very good research and collect some important data to show your parents how college financing works. Start by finding an online financial aid calculator and either having your parents complete it or having them give you the information you need to complete it. You will learn your Estimated Family Contribution. Once you have that number, talk to your parents about whether they can afford to pay that amount.</p>

<p>Then gather information to show them how some colleges treat low-income families. At some schools, low-income families will pay less money for college than if their children went to a state university. (That’s because Brown and a very select group of schools promises to cover 100% of demonstrated need. If you get into a cheaper college that won’t cover your need, it could cost you a lot more because it won’t give you aid.) </p>

<p>Doing this research will require you to leave CC and read the financial aid information on college websites, like Brown’s. Brown, like Yale, has generous financial aid for students whose parents earn less than $60,000.</p>

<p>For a student in your situation, it may not make sense to apply ED. Since you are only a sophomore, I believe, you are 18 months from having to make any serious decisions about this. If you are a strong enough student to get into Brown, you might want to apply to Brown and to schools that would give you a lot of merit aid. You also might want to apply to schools under regular decision so you can compare financial aid offers. </p>

<p>On the other hand, if you are low-income enough that you qualify for a lot of aid, then ED may still be a good option for you.</p>

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<p>Yes. Just as anecdotal evidence, my parents make like 75k, and I had no loans included in my financial aid, and am paying less than $3000 /yr to attend. Brown’s financial aid definitely makes it possible for low income students to attend</p>

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<p>Wow, thank you guys so much! All of your advice is so helpful! </p>

<p>Another reason my parents don’t want me to go to Brown (or anywhere far away, really) is because my mom teaches at a local college. She wants me to go there because I’d be able to get a discount. If I did get accepted to Brown, I bet it would cost about the same. </p>

<p>thecolororange: I’ve been looking at pictures of Brown’s campus and I’m really impressed with it. I’ve only seen the exterior of the buildings, but I’m sure the interior of the buildings are just as beautiful. Does the campus look just as good as it does in the pictures?</p>

<p>I V: That’s what I’ve been trying to explain to my parents, but they keep telling me that I’ll have to take out a loan and I’ll be in debt. </p>

<p>pleinelune: I live in a rural part of Missouri and I would love to experience everything about Brown first-hand. It is really, really far away. If you don’t mind me asking, which universities did you decide to not apply to? </p>

<p>fireandrain: I’ll definitely calculate our EFC. I think it’s a smart idea to compare financial aid offers. My friend who applied to Yale suggested that I start emailing colleges. She said that they’re impressed with that. Is that something I should do? </p>

<p>CelaPlusAimaple: So, are you paying $3,000 for tuition or are your books and your room/board included?</p>

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<p>Show your parents this page: <a href=“https://financialaid.brown.edu/Cmx_Content.aspx?cpId=333[/url]”>https://financialaid.brown.edu/Cmx_Content.aspx?cpId=333&lt;/a&gt;. According to this, if your family income is $57,000 with assets of $68,000 you would need no loans, and would have to pay a little more than $5000/year for everything.</p>

<p>Find out if the college your mom works for has reciprocal agreements with other colleges. Sometimes colleges offer discounts to family members of workers at other colleges.</p>

<p>As for sending emails – depends on what you are asking. Generic questions like “hi, I like your college tell me about it” won’t get you anywhere. Building a relationship with an admissions counselor can be a good thing. One thing you can do is check next fall to see if Brown is coming to Missouri for a college fair or an information session. Go to that, meet the rep, and start a relationship with that person.</p>

<p>There are videos on youtube about Brown, if you want to see more of the campus. To answer your questions about building interiors – some are quite nice and modern, some have old-fashioned touches, others are rundown and need renovation, and others are nondescript.</p>

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<p>Thanks a lot! </p>

<p>$5,000 a year is fine with me, but for my family, it would probably be less than that. </p>

<p>I’m so glad to hear that some colleges offer discounts, so I hope my mom’s does. </p>

<p>Going to a college fair/information session is a really good idea, so I’ll try to go. </p>

<p>I watched a few YouTube videos and I still think Brown has a gorgeous campus, which for me, is a plus.</p>

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<p>Chelsea I was like your parents. I am a parent who was unwilling to pay for what I thought were useless college visits. My thought was - let my son get into different colleges, and then we’ll visit. Based what I learned here on CC, I learned my approach was all wrong - so we visited a number of colleges. </p>

<p>WoW - that’s all I have to say. Visiting a campus while classes are in session is nothing like You Tube videos or brochures or college information web sites with information from current students. </p>

<p>For example, our Brown visit was wonderful, but there was a ton of construction going on everywhere - sidewalks blocked, lots of noise, congested feeling. It didn’t affect my son’s decision to apply, but it was nothing we would’ve seen/experienced if we didn’t visit.</p>

<p>Likewise, we thought Princeton was so beautiful and such a great school - all true. But after a visit, my son discovered it was not the right fit, again, something he would not have known if he just relied on the web.</p>

<p>Since your mother works for a college, let her know she’ll save money in the long run if you visit schools first. </p>

<p>Also check out other CC threads where students thought a school was their #1 choice w/o visiting and then got on campus and hated it. It happens. Don’t let it happen to you. Although you really can’t go wrong with Brown! Good luck getting in.</p>

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<p>Chelsea–</p>

<p>I am a parent and a Brown alum ('74). My parents were unable to help me attend college and I put myself through that school. It was not easy and I had to drop in & out a couple of times, and graduated in '78. I had a lot of help from the FA office. This was during years when Brown was not as well off endowment-wise as they are today. </p>

<p>Years later, our daughter applied to Brown EA (which they still had then) and when the aid letter came, it turned out Brown cost us just a little more per year than our state school would have. </p>

<p>Please have your parents visit not only Brown’s fin aid pages for a complete explanation of their policies (and wonderful generosity towards families like yours) and also you might want to visit Princeton’s FA page. They have an excellent explanation of not only their own practices but how the fin aid process works, overall.</p>

<p>Tell your parents, do not look at the numbers on the school’s website and think that is the real cost of the school, any school, for your family. College is not like buying cornflakes. That box of cornflakes is $3.50 whether you are Bill Gates or Joe the car mechanic. But at colleges, the price changes depending on your circumstances. There is merit aid at some schools, and there is need based aid at others, and most do both. Brown only gives need-based aid, though you can also receive merit based scholarships from outside entities and they are very happy if you do.</p>

<p>Brown and other schools who can afford to aid the students they want change the price of the school for those kids. My daughter attended at the same time as George Harrison’s son. The Harrisons & the JRZMoms did not pay the same for our kids to get Brown degrees! George paid the full ticket and when doing so, he helped my daughter attend (I always said he was my favorite Beatle).</p>

<p>Whether you could/would be accepted at Brown based on your grades, scores, etc is another matter entirely—but tell your parents, from one former student in your position to another, and from a parent whose child went to Brown, PLEASE do not close your eyes to Brown or similar schools based on misunderstandings of financial aid and the true cost of the school.</p>

<p>And, if it is at all possible, try to get to these schools for some visiting. Maybe you could come East during the summer—when we were visiting schools for our daughter, we “wrapped” some of them into a family camping trip and stayed at KOAs, to cut the costs. There are also hostels in many major cities, which are less expensive than hotels. Get a little creative and you can find a lot of ways to make this less expensive. Good luck and please give my best to your parents!</p>

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<p>JRZMom: Thank you very much! I’m sure my parents will be happy to know this. I’m definitely going to apply for every outside scholarship that I can. I’ll go look at Princeton’s FA right now. I’ll be interested in that, as well. </p>

<p>I just need to keep talking to them because they want me to get the best education possible for an affordable price and I know that Brown is definitely capable of that. I really like your cornflakes analogy, by the way. </p>

<p>I’m hoping that this coming summer I can visit. I may go to Philadelphia for a class trip, so maybe my parents and I can head up to Rhode Island on the way. That would probably be our best bet. </p>

<p>Again, I really appreciate your advice because you’ve been through it.</p>

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<p>Clffylove: My parents are thinking: why should I waste money on college visits when I could be using it to pay for tuition? </p>

<p>I’m glad that you told me all this because a college visit can make it or break it. Hopefully I’ll like Brown’s atmosphere. It seems lovely, but I’d just have to go and make sure. </p>

<p>I’m planning on applying ED, but in case I don’t get in, which universities are similar to Brown? The colleges that I’m interested in besides Brown are: Georgetown University, University of Chicago, University of Notre Dame, Vanderbilt University, UPenn and Johns Hopkins University.</p>

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<p>Chelsea - actually I don’t think any of those schools on your list are like Brown, although they are all excellent schools. I would check out the threads here on CC for each school and see what people say. B</p>

<p>ut you will have to decide what type of environment you want - cold city (Chicago, Johns Hopkins, UPenn), great research and football (Vandy), great research and football and religion (Notre Dame), great research and religion (Georgetown). </p>

<p>I think schools more like Brown are liberal arts colleges - but you have plenty of time to search.</p>

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<p>Here’s a quick list of schools I’d consider being fairly similar to Brown in some aspects:
Stanford, Harvard, Yale, Tufts, Pomona, Amherst, Swarthmore.</p>

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<p>It’s like less than $3000 for tuition + room/board + random fees, but books are not included.</p>

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<p>I must echo fireandrain’s warning. Applying ED might not be the best decision, even if you are still totally in love with the school when you apply, because you’ll want to see what financial aid you get at Brown if you get in, as well as other offers.</p>

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<p>I echo uroogla & fire&rain—ED is the rich man’s admissions system. If you need to see the financial aid letters before you can choose which school to attend, then make sure the only schools you apply early to are ones with EA options! Period.</p>

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<p>Chelsea — you should do as much visiting of colleges as you can, whenever you can. You should even start with one or two schools near you that you do not think you will apply to at all. Reason—their ease of visiting.</p>

<p>We visited many universities with our 3 kids whenever we were in the area of the schools, over the years. Several years ago we started off our last child’s college visiting experience with a stop into William & Mary because we were driving past them on our way to the entrance of Colonial Williamsburg. It opened her 8th grade eyes as to how much harder she was going to have to work to get into such a school! And the best part was that she heard it from an admissions person and not Mom & Dad. ; – ) </p>

<p>Why bother? Because if you get a few schools under the student’s belt early on, s/he gets a feeling for what to look for, what to like & not like, how to approach strange students and ask them about their college, and more. Then when you visit the schools you are much more serious about, you are way more efficient and you are not deceived by appearances or snap judgments. </p>

<p>Also you will begin to realize whether big city is as scary as it might have seemed, or whether way out in the country is what you really want, or maybe it is when you thought it wasn’t. </p>

<p>btw don’t look at those photos on schools’ websites and think the entire place looks like that. I hope you realize the universities do not post the pictures of the shortcut behind the dumpsters that all the students take on the way to the bio lab (or whatever their particular ugly spot is)!</p>

<p>When I suggested Princeton’s financial aid pages I was referring to the very good explanation they have of the financial aid process in general, and of course their own. And it is easy to find on their site, unlike some schools’. Princeton has a no loan policy. If you attend Princeton you will not graduate with any debt. The trick is getting in.</p>

<p>Other schools would like to be as generous, but do not have Princeton’s endowment.</p>