<p>Whats TIC EK?? As for leaves, the mantra of true campers is " leave no trace". I will say no more.</p>
<p>The tone of this thread is so much friendlier than others I’ve been on. To my eternal shame, I admit to being drawn into irate political arguments on CC from time to time. It’s really not that much fun in the final analysis and you certainly make no converts to your own beliefs/opinions. Much better to have a thoughtful, polite, light-hearted discussion. Thanks, jym626, for (repeatedly) steering it back in that direction!</p>
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<p>Those are manifestations.</p>
<p>If I believe that life begins at conception and is sacred, then the manifestation of that belief is that I will be against abortion. If I believe completely in the sanctity of life, especially of the innocent (and if I believe that all babies are innocent), and in consistency and am thoughtful, the manifestation of that is likely to be that I am against abortion for any reason – even incest and rape. I might (<em>might</em>) be able to make an exception for saving the life of the mother, but perhaps only if the mother’s death would also result in the baby’s death.</p>
<p>There are different kinds of conflict, and conflicts that are essentially about core beliefs – and the manifestations of those core beliefs – are rarely going to be resolved; they generally end, if the conflict is between people of good will, with an agreement to disagree. That is the best one can hope for.</p>
<p>I’m not a liberal because I happen to be pro-choice, nor am I pro-choice because I happen to be a liberal. My pro-choice stance is a manifestation of core values that I hold.</p>
<p>If you want to “noodle through” core values, have fun with it, but realize that it is extremely unlikely that you will 1.) change anyone’s mind; 2.) avoid bringing religion into the discussion; 3.) start a food fight.</p>
<p>Me? I’m going to sit here on the sidelines selling toilet paper in front of the only available portapotty. I’m not just a liberal; I’m also an opportunist. I’ve gotta build up the college fund somehow! :D</p>
<p>owlice–You’re a liberal, an opportunist, AND a capitalist. Karl Marx wouldn’t know what to make of you!</p>
<p>Yeah, yeah, what Hindoo said; couldn’t you have said that earlier and saved me the time it took to type my previous post?! Sheeeeeesh!!! That’s 10 minutes I could have used to fetch some dark chocolate instead!</p>
<p>;)</p>
<p>Oh, you just slid that right in there, Hindoo!! lol!! My timing is way off; time to find that chocolate!</p>
<p>My pleasure, Hindoo. Now I have to play the mummy game and wrap up owlice in her own supply of toilet paper so we can stay on/off track.
Anyone happen to take a quick survey of this particular thread and see what the political/social leanings are? I haven’t shared mine, but I confess, despite her steering this thread tentatively back into those murky waters, my beliefs ally in part with owlice’s (my sense of humor, too). I am probably one of those “one issue” people. I believe that a woman’s body is hers to make choices about as appropriate. I do not feel that others should dictate or legislate this. It shouldn’t be used as a form of reckless birth control, but personal choice is just that. Enough said. Not willing to discuss, debate or go 12 rounds. </p>
<p>That said, I am less “liberal” than I used to be, having seen gross abuses of entitlement programs. They say, you become more conservative when you have something to conserve. I am not a political conservative. I believe I am a moderate- a progressive thinker, as it were. Conflicted in some areas-- ie my s turned down a very lucrative job in the oil industry for a “green” alternative energy job. I admire his dream, his goal, his core beliefs. But in the back of my mind, and occasionally it slipped out of my mouth, came “forget your ideals-- take the money!!”</p>
<p>I agree with jym on the women’s rights issue, and feel very strongly about that. However, I also have to think of my own career in the corporate world and what is best for that. I am a moderate but to the right of middle. My daughter is very liberal and WildChild, believe it or not, is a staunch economic conservative.</p>
<p>“If you want to “noodle through” core values, have fun with it, but realize that it is extremely unlikely that you will 1.) change anyone’s mind; 2.) avoid bringing religion into the discussion; 3.) start a food fight.”</p>
<p>Very well put! There have been times where I’ve been figuratively stomping my foot in anger and frustration because someone on CC disagrees with me and they can’t see that they’re wrong (or not)! Much better to respect the fact that a decent, non-evil human being can have opinions opposite to yours, and discuss things in a civil manner. I’m a middle-aged woman with so much to learn. … As for the cyber food fight–how do we get started?</p>
<p>Hindoo, I’d show you, but I’m all wrapped up and can’t reach the food!</p>
<p>:: starts singing ::</p>
<p>Pleeeeeease release me, let me gooooooooo</p>
<p>(I do, after all, bring my own toilet paper.)</p>
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I have no stats. </p>
<p>4 years ago I’d say we were a left of center crowd with some remarkable exceptions who had no fear of mixing it up. Maybe 60/40. Maybe 55/45. Now it seems that among the latest posters (last year or so) it is 50/50.</p>
<p>There are plenty of conservatives but they don’t post as often. I’m a registered Republican but consider myself to be moderate/liberal on social issues.</p>
<p>Not sure if you meant it to be funny, dke but it sounded like cc has its own silent majority! Made me smile. That said, I agree that there are probably more conservative-minded folks who aren’t as frequent posters. Don’t know why this is, but I agree with you.</p>
<p>Owlice, you just crack me up! I don’t usually post in any of the political threads, but I do read them (at least until I get tired of reading the same arguments over and over again) - this is the first one I’ve been able to get through. Good job, everyone.</p>
<p>To counter DKE, I’m a registered Democrat who considers herself socially liberal, economically conservative.</p>
<p>:: is still waiting to be released from the toilet paper mummy suit so she can go… ::</p>
<p>:: legs are crossed, teeth are clenched ::</p>
<p>Just don’t use the dark chocolate, thanks.</p>
<p>Also a registered Democrat, socially liberal, economically moderate, capitalist, pro-NAFTA and other free trade, pro-tax-the-rich, pro-average-balanced-budget, and given our national debt and current deficit, I think my taxes are too low (i.e., I would rather not pass the debt to my children and grandchildren–I want to pay my own bills).</p>
<p>owlice-
don’t worry- if ya gotta go, ya gotta go. I bought the super absorbent kind. 
Next, after we unwrap you, can we watch you fight your way out of a paper bag?</p>
<p>Mammal- I’m with you on the dem/liberal/conservative spectrum (well, maybe more moderate, like vossron). I must say though, being a southern democrat is not like being a northern democrat. Southern democrats are just republicans with a shorter voting line at the polls, IMO.</p>
<p>Wow, tough crowd! :D</p>