<p>The hole in my heart has more to do with grief than any lack of self esteem on my part. (I actually think I’m pretty terrific). But I don’t dismiss the observation out of hand and will further consider the possibility. Another factor in our situation is during the time of the affair, my husband was in the middle of a serious depression that I was not completely aware of. I knew he was under a great deal of pressure at work, but I did not understand how much his mental state was affected. At that point, I think he was reaching out for anything that would make him feel better, to numb the pain. Neither he nor I consider this an excuse, but it was an important factor. And to his credit, he has worked tirelessly to make amends since that time. I truly love him and I know he loves me. Also, I did not want to break up our family so I chose to forgive. It is the hardest thing I’ve ever done and even though the pain has not gone away, I don’t regret my decision.</p>
<p>I think perfection is unrealistic. All of us are susceptible to short-term “rewards” or “solutions” that have bad long-term consequences.</p>
<p>I think what is realistic is striving to change for the better and to keep long-term happiness in mind rather than what feels good now.</p>
<p>Like eating to much, a good approach is to avoid situations where something negative can happen. Keep good foods around and don’t let the bad foods into your house.</p>
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I guess this is true, but I would also say that you can’t really be sure what anybody else will do, no matter how sure you think you are about their morals, etc.</p>
<p>The interesting question is how sure you can be about what you yourself will do in the future.</p>
<p>mini “(Full disclosure: I’m married to the same person four times, with four different anniversary dates, without a single divorce. You don’t want to know…)”</p>
<p>Yes, we DO want to know. Tell us. . . 
(I’m imagining that you married each other in 4 different types of ceremonies/cultural traditions?) </p>
<p>Yes, I think monogamy is possible. I read recently that a couple is more likely to divorce if the woman is unfaithful than if the man cheats. Reason? Men will usually cheat for sex, not for a relationship with the other person. For a woman to cheat, it is more often about the relationship. She is looking for love and an emotional connection that she doesn’t have with her husband. She’s already “gone” from the marriage when she cheats. (I realize that this isn’t always the case, but it makes sense, in general. I also think that women are more likely to stay with cheaters for the sake of the kids or because they are financially dependent on H and divorce would bring down their standard of living.)
A man who has money will always have plenty of opportunities to cheat.</p>
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Perhaps each of them was declared legally dead several times?</p>
<p>There was an article out yesterday talking about the increased longevity of marriages in the US. Wish I could recall where I saw it.</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/number-of-long-lasting-marriages-in-us-has-risen-census-bureau-reports/2011/05/18/AFO8dW6G_story.html[/url]”>http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/number-of-long-lasting-marriages-in-us-has-risen-census-bureau-reports/2011/05/18/AFO8dW6G_story.html</a></p>
<p>Divorce doesn’t shock me, though I think it is wrong. Unfaithfulness does shock me deeply. I think the marriage covenant at least deserves the respect of officially ending it if you want to taste other fruit. Two of my closest friends are trying to recover from their husbands’ infidelity. Their pain is tremendous, and each would also talk about that unhealable “hole” Damaris mentions.</p>
<p>I think monogamy is realistic, but difficult for the type of person who is never satisfied and has the attitude of “I wonder if there’s something better out there than what I already have?” This is often the same type of person who changes jobs frequently, buys new cars often, or shops a lot for new clothes and household items.</p>
<p>I don’t think monogamy is unrealistic.
However, being unfaithful isn’t the deal breaker for me that other character flaws would be.
I think we forget that our partners ( & ourselves) are human & fallible. They are also not our possessions to only act in a certain pre-ordained way.
Even if we choose to split after an infidelity we need to examine why it occurred- there is not only one reason or one person " at fault".</p>
<p>I neither think monogamy nor so-called “faithfulness” are perfection - they are both culture-bound, and put way too much weight on partners in a culture where extended family has been breaking down for almost 100 years. They are what they are.</p>
<p>As for marriage longevity - it usually goes up during bad economic times, as people can’t afford to separate. When times are good, separation and divorce rates in our culture go up. </p>
<p>We had no weddings. Pennsylvania common law is different than in other states (because of Quakers). If you live together (even for a month), and people think you are married, and you don’t disabuse them of the idea, you are married in the eyes of the state (and one partner can sue the other for divorce, etc.) So when my parents wanted a date (when my wife was pregnant, 10 years after we met, we told them Halloween. However, six years earlier, when we were living India, rather than explaining Quakers (for whom neither the state nor ministers have any role in marriages), it was easier to tell folks we were married, except they all wanted an anniversary date. June 15th was one I could remember, and I received cards for having been a beautiful bride.</p>
<p>California customs are the opposite of those in Pennsylvania, and they didn’t recognize Pennsylvania common law. But they do have something called “confidential marriage” (which allowed folks to backdate their relationships, to make "honest people’ (hmm) of the kids.) But they wouldn’t allow two “unrelated” adults to legally adopt the same child. </p>
<p>So we needed one of them there confidential marriage thingees. We found the Rev. Shalom Compost (I kid you not - he was married to Marilyn Dreampeace, who did divorce counseling - they worked both sides of the street - if you google, you can find pictures of their car online) - and when he did the marriage certificate thing, he was County Employee of the Month (this was Santa Cruz.) He looked like his name suggests. Well, when he signed the certificate, he misspelled the word “minister”, and rather than leaving it alone, he crossed it out and did it again</p>
<p>When we took it down to the County office, they wouldn’t accept it, and our (third) marriage was annulled. So we took a new certificate to the Reverend, he signed (again), we helped him with the spelling, and we were married again.</p>
<p>Hence four marriages, and four anniversary dates, to the same person, without a single divorce or a single wedding.</p>
<p>We don’t celebrate any of them.</p>
<p>(As for faithfulness - in the spirit of full disclosure, I have to admit I have on occasion had sushi when she wasn’t around.)</p>
<p>I think it is realistic with the right partner and unrealistic with the wrong one.</p>
<p>Though I also think for some people (my ex being one) that no matter who you are with if you haven’t worked through your own issues/hangups/etc you are just fooling yourself that it was your partner that was the issue. And don’t be surprised (my ex’s wife) when you marry a cheater that he’d do it again (he did).</p>
<p>Monogamy seemed more challenging to me in my 20’s and early 30’s than it does now. i don’t think my husband has ever cheated on me, we have a good way of talking to each other,and since I was born in a commune, I didn’t really come into adulthood thinking monogamy was the be-all and end-all that other people think. </p>
<p>Kindness and respect, openness, the ability to laugh at oneself, chemistry, creativity, intelligence. These things seemed more important, and still do.</p>
<p>If he were to come to me now and say that he’d had another child on the earth for the last 14 years, I’d be shocked, but I’d mainly be concerned that that child had been well taken care of and all that rigamarole. But, given I’ve been happy for the last 14 yesrs, I couldn’t complain I hadn’t been in the exact life I wanted, anyway.</p>
<p>Still, I don’t believe he’s had any affairs. It’s never seemed that way to me.</p>
<p>it’s paranoia but how do you your spouse stays monogamous? i don’t think one person could know the other completely, even in an open relationship. btw, it seems to me that women have the tendency to claim that they know, trust, understand… their partner. and guess what, they are the ones, more often than not, being cheated.</p>
<p>It’s unrealistic for a lot of people and a lot of culture. For some culture, it’s ok to have 4 wifes(Bin Laden for example). For some culture, it’s possible if people marry later after they already have time on their own. It also helps if the couple is not too wealthy or famous. Money and fame brings unwanted attention, some people can resist and some can’t.</p>
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<p>mini - I’m a native Californian and my spouse and I were California residents at the time that we married. We opted to wed in Pennsylvania because of the unique option of being able to marry without an officiant, and when researching the law discovered that it exists not because of Quakers but because of Amish. We did not have any trouble with California recognizing our Pennsylvania marriage, but we haven’t tried to adopt.</p>
<p>Oh, California recognizes Pennsylvania marriages, just not those under its common law statutes. Those were actually created by William Penn, prior to Pennsylvania became a state. Quaker marriages were not recognized by the Church of England, and in England, married Quakers were imprisoned for adultery or fornication. There were, of course, German Amish and Lutherans in Pennsylvania when Penn received the charter.</p>
<p>Hardly matters to us one way or the other. I actually believe that no state should be recognizing marriages until gay marriages are recognized (but it would be better for the states to simply recognize all as “civil unions”.)</p>
<p>In Kenya, there is widespread polygamy among Christians (though second marriages are not “sanctified” by church.) There are also what we would think of “lesbian marriages”, though sex isn’t the operant necessarily, just two women agreeing to care for each other over the long-term, and have it recognized by the community (though not a church). Sometimes the polygamy is a result of husbands having to work semi-permanently at long distance from their original wives who have already established ties in the community. It’s not really a matter of “faithfulness” or “slipping” or anything of that kind in the eyes of anyone but the churches, and they pretty much turn a blind eye. The Muslims are more particular about making sure that all wives are actually cared for.</p>
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<p>That is great to know.</p>
<p>We were also virgins in our 20’s when we were married and we have been monogamous for 23+ years. No thanks to Jesus Christ. One of us is an atheist and the other is agnostic.</p>
<p>I am not sure why we remained monogamous. Perhaps we are just boring people?</p>
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<p>I think it depends on a lot of factors: How “sexualized” a person is (I think this varies from person to person), how attractive they are to others, what opportunities arise for them to be unfaithful, and how appreciated/unappreciated they feel by their partner.</p>
<p>Movie stars seem to have a terrible time being monogamous, and this is probably mostly due to the second and third factors I listed above.</p>
<p>vicarious…I love what Jesus Christ has done for my wife and I. We have had many relationships, but chose not to “give ourself away” because our bodies are not our own. They are Jesus’. Therefore, we will obey His commands and honor His body as well as others. It is yet another way to show respect to others and worship to Him who gave us a wonderful life!! </p>
<p>I am a psychotherapist who specializes in marital counseling for 21 years. I have found that those who agree that marriage is a contract, a commitment, a covenant before God, each other, and society are the ones most apt to remain married and to have a vibrant, growing, positive relationship. When someone breaks their commitment, their vow, it shows their character, which shows up in many other situations as well. How people act gives themselves away. Their word choice even does this. For instance, what does “trying” to remain faithful look like v. stating “I will remain faithful, 'til death do us part”. “Trying” leaves room for escape from responsibility to stay true to their word. Those who do reach a deep commitment level of maturity have the opportunity to experience a love that few know. It is a commitment that will hold your loved one up until their last dying breath, only to release them into the hands of God for all eternity.</p>
<p>I think the way the youth is being brought up surrounded by sex and beauty changes their values from those of virtue and “true love”, which makes it hard for some to be monogamous.</p>