Daughter is currently a sophomore. She excels at history, English and foreign languages, is doing a special environmental science academy program, was accepted into a highly competitive foreign language summer program, is a talented cellist, and so forth. She has a 98+ average in every other class. But math just does not click for her. She struggled to get a B in honors geometry last year and now is facing a C in honors algebra 2 this year (hoping to pull off a B, but starting the block-schedule-year by missing 2 weeks of school for a concussion didn’t help matters). This is despite tremendous effort on her part, working with a tutor, etc. I strongly encouraged her to take honors algebra 2 instead of regular, and now I’m feeling some guilt over that seeing how stressful this is for her.
She is planning to take AP Stats next year, but to graduate, she does not need any further math classes and is seriously considering not taking any senior year. She really doesn’t want to, would rather take another history or science class that interests her, and also doesn’t feel like she would be capable of getting a decent grade.
So my question is, where does this leave her in the college process? Should I encourage her to take another math class senior year anyway? Can she still be competitive for college admissions, probably not for the very top schools, but for others? She is still undecided on a major but it will almost certainly be in the humanities. She has high hopes but knows that her weakness in math holds her back.
Be aware that many colleges have a math or quantitative reasoning requirement to graduate, although many of them accept a high enough AP statistics score or a similar non-calculus introductory statistics course. Knowledge of statistics is generally useful anyway.
Of the humanities, philosophy requires logical thinking that is math-adjacent.
Has she tried stats? It’s the least math-y math, in my opinion. Math was never my daughter’s strength (in part due to abysmal teaching in foundational concepts), but she did just fine in stats and sort of even enjoyed it. As ucbalumnus notes above, many colleges have a quant reasoning requirement, and so it has been for her and she was able to fulfill the req with stats.
FWIW, both of my kids were not math kids. Both started high school in algebra 1 and both took precalc (regular not honors) senior year, which is the normal progression. Your kid is already one year ahead of standard. Neither of mine took an AP math course. Both went to Pitt, graduated, and are now gainfully employed. So yes, there is hope. Maybe your kid should drop from honors to regular. A kid who considers themselves to be not good at math does not need to be in honors courses.
My daughter only made it to pre-calc by her senior year, and got into top schools (UC’s), even as a STEM (non-math) major. If her interests are in the humanities and she excels in all her other subjects, it is not going to hurt her.
If she is aiming for top schools, just make sure her junior year grades stay strong, she has good EC’s to round things out, and her senior year coursework is as rigorous as possible.
I would talk with her guidance counselor at school—many colleges (not just top 20 or even 50) require 4 years of high school math. She sounds amazing—and she’ll do completely fine in a stats class.
My brother’s son has an awful time with learning foreign languages. He applied to colleges that won’t require him to take one, although many prefer 4 years of foreign lang. in high school. He only took 2 yrs language in HS, and that was completely fine for certain schools, and not for others. I would definitely check out course sequences for various majors, and still have her take 4 yrs HS math.
My question is why would she be in any Honors math classes, let alone a second one after trouble with the first? I think it’s a symptom of a broader problem with HS education that people think that the opposite of Honors is Shameful instead of Regular.
She might not even be “not good at math” but not ready for the Honors level. Well-taught CP math classes should reach nearly every student at grade level.
Unfortunately her school guidance counselor isn’t helpful for this at all. All they do at her school is check to be sure they have the state requirements to graduate and if so, the box is checked. They don’t seem to know or care much about college requirements. We’re at a decent but not outstanding rural school.
Neither of my kids took AP Math…actually, neither took honors math. DD is great at math but since we declined to accelerate her in math in grade 8, she was unable to take the honors math courses as her school is small, and the scheduling difficult if you didn’t accelerate.
DD finished HS math with regular precalc. DS took statistics, and economics (one semester each) his senior year. Granted, they graduated from HS in 2003 and 2010, but still…they got accepted to their colleges of choice. And DD had a very math heavy major and did fine in college higher level math. But she had a very strong foundation.
Math is a sequential course of study that requires a solid foundation. Moving on to any AP math course when the previous course was difficult…might not be the best idea. What other math options are there, which perhaps would be more practical. Maybe that would be a better option?
This is of interest to me as well. My youngest is also sophomore year and is a straight-A student (well they got one A-, but close enough), but is not taking honors math. They attempted honors geometry this year, but dropped back down to regular geometry after a week and is maintaining an A in that. They just don’t like math, and it does not click at all for them.
I had assumed this is fine b/c they are interested in biology and English, which isn’t math heavy and I assume that will be fine for most colleges they will apply to.
It seems she’s doing well actually but has she been evaluated for dyscalcula? My daughter actually loved math but just couldn’t. Now we know why. She was in a lower math class that she felt was too easy for her but the higher math classes went to fast and the teacher wouldn’t adjust her test to accommodate her even with an iep. But she’s 27 in her master’s and really doesn’t miss anything in life due to it. Good luck to your daughter.
I was a terrible math student. My day of reckoning was graduate school where I had to take a remedial math class (literally started with first grade math and ended after completing Calc 1) and I discovered I loved math. The professor specialized in teaching bad math students what they needed-- so I sat with architecture students, nursing students, public health, etc. all of whom were incredibly lopsided (that’s what got them accepted to grad school) but needed to show proficiency in math through calculus to begin their program.
I think your D should take “non-AP” stats-- just a regular stats course next year, and then take whatever follows in the sequence (is there a business math type option?) She doesn’t need to be accelerated in math- but math is everywhere now, no matter what she ends up doing.
Should she get a flu shot? Should she opt for the extended warranty on the car she’s buying? Which of the four health care options her employer offers is the best and cheapest while still covering her needs? Is the fixed mortgage her credit union is offering a better deal than the variable rate mortgage she can get from her bank? Stats and algebra (some version of a word problem) will follow her all her life, and getting comfortable NOW with the math she’ll need is a gift you’ll be giving her.
There’s plenty of “hope”, she doesn’t need to get ahead of her skis! She should take math at a level that’s comfortable for her…
There are a number that I recall seeing that said 3 years, including Algebra 2, is fine. But there are also some less competitive colleges (ASU and UoA, auto admit if you meet prerequisites, spring to mind) where they require 4 years including a year beyond Algebra 2. So it is definitely a decision that needs some consideration.
That said, it’s never entirely clear to me if accelerating math in middle school meets that 4 year requirement- I have seen it said about languages. For a normal progression, algebra 2 in junior year plus stats in senior year would meet that.
BUT- the kid may need to take an econ, psych, sociology course freshman year, so having stats fresh in her mind (or another math from senior year) can only help. It’s surprising how much math there is everywhere, all at once!
That depends on the college’s policies. Some have rather detailed policies on the matter (e.g. California public universities, although their minimum is nominally 3 years including geometry and algebra 2), but many others leave potential applicants guessing on the matter, or having to ask the college directly.