It's What I've Been Doing All Along

Parent Cafe
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<p>It seems like most people who I talk to or read about are living very tight right now. They can’t pay their credit car bills, car insurance, etc.</p>

<p>Americans have been living a fantasy for awhile now. If they want something, they would charge it and pay the minimum payment. Most Americans never think about saving and live paycheck to paycheck.</p>

<p>I have always been a saver. I look for coupons, sales, clearance, rebates, etc. I look for things that I can sell on EBAY and make extra money doing that. I don’t spend $7 to see a movie very often. I went to the movie theaters 2 times last year. Most of the time, I wait until things aren’t in demand and wait till the prices go down. </p>

<p>A lot of people that I talk to don’t like using coupons. They think that they are too good for it. They need things when they first come out and don’t buy things on clearance.</p>

<p>Now, I hear these same people complaining that they don’t have enough money to make ends meet. The funny thing is that they are doing the same things as before and not changing their spending habits.</p>

<p>I know that this might sound cruel, but I don’t feel sorry for most Americans who are in debt or who can’t pay their bills. I can bet you 9 times out of 10 (you can see a lot of these people on the Suze Orman show) that these people buy 10 times the amount of things that they needed. To me, that is their own fault and they should be responsible for their own consequences.</p>

<p>It’s funny because people always tell me that if people shopped like me, stores would go out of business. This country is structured for people to overspend. Unfortunately, most Americans are gullable and buy anything and everything (eventhough they don’t need 90% of it).</p>

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<p>You are one smart cookie. :)</p>

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<p>insomniac, I agree with you 100%. I also live in a similar manner. We also never went for an adjustable rate mortgage. We never owned a fancy car. We never took European vacations. We know people who have lived beyond their means, and they make sure that their fax feeds into their home phone to avoid those nasty collections phone calls. Some people like living on the edge and they do not need to. I do feel sorry for a family with lower income who need to fill up their gas tanks to get to work, and more money to feed their families. They budget, they work hard, but incomes have just not kept up at all (especially for less skilled workers).</p>

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<p>The bummer for those of us who budget and save is that we get to pay for our kids’ college tuitions and the debtors get big financial aid.</p>

<p>Such a deal!</p>

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<p>I couldn’t even imagaine living in debt and going to extremes to covering it up.</p>

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<p>I do feel sorry for a family with lower income who need to fill up their gas tanks to get to work</p>

<p>That is especially bad in our area. Cheaper housing is away from the city- same with decent public schools. However most jobs that are not lowish paying retail jobs are in the city. Public transportation is far from efficient ( for example- in order to be able to take public transit from my urban neighborhood to the airport, I would have had to transfer three time & it would have taken me three hours).
However- this may be what the automakers need to get the american public the same cars that they are selling in Europe.
[Auto</a> sales worst in 15 years](<a href=“http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080702/BUSINESS01/807020390/1002]Auto”>http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080702/BUSINESS01/807020390/1002)</p>

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<p>$7? Movies are $10 in most places now…</p>

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<p>while we have been big savers we have spurged on travel in Europe, Hawaii and across the USA. But in day to day living we have been frugal using coupons, shopping sales and avioding all credit card debt.</p>

<p>While gross income had never approahced the $200k mark we have managed to accumulate a net worth in excess of $2.4 million of which $2 million+ is in investments. I am still not sure how we managed this other than the fact that I have stayed the course as a long range investor.</p>

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<p>The theaters in my area charge $7. I couldn’t even imagine paying $10.</p>

<p>The whole point is that it is okay to splurge from time to time, but you shouldn’t charge wants unless you can pay your credit card bill in full each month.</p>

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<p>I know I would be unhappy if I never travelled, rarely went to a movie or nice dinner out, never splurged on a beautiful item in a store that I might not really need. Obviously, not everyone feels this way, but I do and I’m not ashamed of it. To me, life is about experiences. Also, I had a 7-year ARM with a 4.75% interest rate. I saved a tremendous amount of money with that one.</p>

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<p>“I know I would be unhappy if I never travelled, rarely went to a movie or nice dinner out, never splurged on a beautiful item in a store that I might not really need. Obviously, not everyone feels this way, but I do and I’m not ashamed of it. To me, life is about experiences. Also, I had a 7-year ARM with a 4.75% interest rate. I saved a tremendous amount of money with that one.”</p>

<p>You are missing the whole point of this thread. I never said that people shouldn’t have fun and buy items that they don’t need. You should be doing those things in moderation.</p>

<p>I am talking about people who go overboard and buy 10 times the amount of things that they actually need and then go into debt.</p>

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<p>LIKE your attitude! So many people feel entitled to so much just because they exist- without a thought of how to pay for it. The Golden Age of America is coming to an end, the future generations will have less than seems to be the norm now. I sometimes don’t think the two incomes needed to support a family is valid because the accepted standard of living has risen far beyond that of the good/bad old days of my childhood when mothers had to stay home (another whole issue re women in the workforce). I could go on for hours with the things that irritate me about our society’s not living within its means, but I would be “preaching to the choir”, it is enough to know others out there agree.</p>

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<p>Your post #1 led me to believe that you were proud of the fact that you rarely went to a movie and spent a significant amount of your time finding ways to save money. I intended to convey that this is not a lifestyle that appeals to me and would not be an optimal/happy existence for me. I don’t think that makes either one of us better than the other. Just different viewpoints.</p>

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<p>“Your post #1 led me to believe that you were proud of the fact that you rarely went to a movie and spent a significant amount of your time finding ways to save money. I intended to convey that this is not a lifestyle that appeals to me and would not be an optimal/happy existence for me. I don’t think that makes either one of us better than the other. Just different viewpoints.”</p>

<p>I stated that I rarely spend $7 on a movie. I wait until the movie goes to the “cheap theaters” or to DVD. I never said I spent a significant time finding ways to save money. Clipping coupons and looking for sales doesn’t take a lot of time.</p>

<p>And yes, I am proud that I like to save money and that I am frugal.</p>

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<p>We travel, we have a good time in life, but we don’t buy what we cannot afford. I know people who spend much more than they should, and I would suffer a lot of anxiety living that way. We still eat well, and don’t deny ourselves the essentials. We also would never spend 5000/child for summer camp. I would never spend 1000 on a designer handbag, or spend $100+ on a pair of shoes (I own $100 shoes, but have bought them for $25-30). We never had a luxury car, but we drive safe working cars. We are still happy. I am sure that we would have enjoyed some of the things listed, but it isn’t worth the financial instability.</p>

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<p>You don’t feel sorry for people who don’t cut corners?</p>

<p>I’m glad that you use coupons, but I’d argue that your trading an inferior diet for it. You can’t buy “real food” with coupons! And the health of the people in my house absolutely requires real food (one had cancer, one gluten free, one had lifetime morbid obesity, one with allergies). The diet in my house is based on pure (and I do mean pure, not loaded with preservatives) meat, vegetables, fruit, dairy, and whole grains. When’s the last time you saw a coupon for a pound of apples? Have you seen how much they cost.</p>

<p>Or how about the fact that my mortgage has gone up over $150 per month in the past 9 years that we’ve lived here due to taxes and that as a result, we only have a few thousand in equity into our home as a result? Or the fact that they just reassessed my house for $18000 more than we paid for it, when we have only a few thousand in equity, which justified raising our tax bill even more?</p>

<p>What about the fact that my husband can’t just change jobs despite the fact that the price of gas has risen and that his paycheck has not risen with it, and in fact maybe his company would be justified in cutting hours to pay for it?</p>

<p>What about the fact that even though my daughter is going to a state college and that they force her to live on campus for the cost of $9000 a year? It does not cost us $9000 a year to feed and house her, that is how much NY is going to expect from us for her to share a box of a room with someone else and for them to feed her food significantly inferior to what she gets at home. So how do we save money there?</p>

<p>What about the fact that every time my husband goes to the doctor, he is given prescriptions for his lifelong asthma, allergies, cholesterol that is high despite what he eats that comprise about $100-200 per month in co-pays? Of course, part of the problem there is that what they do is just a bandaid on the problem, but should he just wheeze in the bed so he can’t go to work? </p>

<p>But anyhow, I’m glad works out well for you.</p>

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<p>Whatapainthisis : Wow, I feel for you. What you said supports what I thought, our current economy favor the wealth owners - refer to the poster who has 2.4 million net worth, the stock market grew while wages are stagnant. I have a dear friend who is in a similar situation as yours, and she uses coupons and sales religiously. Her fixed expenses - housing, car (very old cars that break down) eat up too much for her paycheck. </p>

<p>I have done well in the last few years, despite getting downsized in the last recession. Being older, I find it much harder to find similar work. But due to a combination of luck and foresight I suppose, I had made investment decisions that did well for ourselves. </p>

<p>We started by living way beneath our means, and still do. Our savings rate was something like 30% of our take home pay when we were young. In two years we scraped enough to buy our first house.</p>

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<p>whatapainthisis, I sympathize. We also have high copays, our taxes keep going up and we have high property taxes in NJ, not to mention our auto insurance and health insurance rates. We also cannot change jobs and are stuck. I agree about the coupons, but we clip for non food items: clothes when they are on clearance +additional %off, shampoos, detergents, etc. If apples are on sale at the store, I buy apples rather than spending double that amount on another fruit that is not on sale. I don’t feel for the people choosing to buy a new Mercedes/Lexus, or opting to take a 2 week vacation to Europe, and then going into a financial mess after years of spending beyond their income on luxury items. I do sympathize with responsible people who can’t buy gas or basic (healthy) food. This should not happen to hard working people.</p>

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<p>This is directed towards the last few posts by munchkin and northeastmom:</p>

<p>I hear what you are all saying. I agree about picking and choosing fruits and veggies based on what is on sale. Here in NY, I already do the only thing that I know of to save money on food and still eat naturally/healthfully – I go to a local farmers market 3x a week in the summer to get produce. I shop at BJs wholesale club for many items, including large discounted packages of lean ground turkey. </p>

<p>Now, one thing that I did was read the papers of the local grocery stores to see who had meat and produce on sale. There is a small store about 5 miles away that I like that has things like chicken breast, old world made chicken sausage with no msg, red peppers, and zuchinni at a very substantial savings compared to the store closest to me. Before these gas prices were insane, it was worth it to make the trip. Now, I’m not so sure.</p>

<p>There is something very wrong in this society when it costs more money to buy an unadulterated pure food item, for example paying more money for unbleached coffee filters than bleached. For example, if my kids want cold breakfast cereal, I will pay the extra money to buy Koala Krisp, an organic version of cocoa crispies without corn syrup and crap. If my kids would like pancakes and syrup, I will buy them a whole grain pancake mix, and I will buy real syrup, not Aunt Jemima made with corn syrup. I feel that these choices are necessary for the health of my family, but it does hurt our wallet severely.</p>

<p>I suppose that someone might suggest “Sell your house and go rent.” But this is our home. We are lucky we still have it, because when my husband got cancer at age 32 and then his plant shut down at age 35, he was lucky to be alive, get a job, and to keep our house after our credit was trashed from the illness. Who the hell has the pocketbook to plan for cancer and a plant shutdown in their early 30s when they have two young kids? I’d consider trading our house down for a cheaper one, but nobody would give us credit to do that because of those past circumstances. And there is a lifestyle difference between having your own home (mortgaged or not) and listening to a landlord. Not to mention that it is actually the same or cheaper to own in my neighborhood than it is to rent. </p>

<p>So I guess I’ll be staying here and just keep taking things one day at a time until it gets easier or we get booted out and end up on the homeless thread :slight_smile: I’ve done without before, I could do it again, but who the hell wants to!!!</p>

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<p>whatapainthisis, </p>

<p>Your post probably more accurately exemplifies the reasons that people find themselves in financial straits as opposed to the assumptions made in this thread (That is, because they bought a new Mercedes and failed to clip coupons.)</p>

<p>This thread struck me as sanctimonious and offensive, because I believe that most people do not intentionally make poor financial decisions. Rather, it is more likely a series of events in their lives and deceptive marketing practices that leads them to make poor choices, and often they are “locked in” to those choices by contract or penalty. None of the high schools I am familiar with have offer any sort of basic financial planning courses.</p>

<p>These people have my sympathy, not my derision.</p>