Kid thrown off team

Parent Cafe
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<p>Kid has been on H.S. debate team for 3.5 years, granted not the most enthusiastic member, mostly due to involvement in other activities, but certainly bringing in a fair share of trophies. Coach hates kid because kid is talented and wins without working hard. Coach has always singled out kid with snide remarks . Coach has had a few talks with kid regarding showing team spirit (?) and handing in paperwork on time. Mind you, this is unimportant paperwork, irrelevant to tournaments. Kid has never missed tournaments or meetings ever. </p>

<p>So last week, kid shows up to practice without having the requisite cases prepared. (second time in 3.5 years, and also right on the heels of 2 first-place trophies). Coach says “I’m through with you. This is it. You don’t belong on this team, please leave”. </p>

<p>Kid comes home, not unhappy that he does not have to see this person again, but mad at the very arbitrary and summary dismissal; and no real reason for being kicked out.</p>

<p>Okay, so I am prepared, at kid’s request, to not do anything, as kid is done with the insults of 3 years, and would rather not be on the team. But today, an e-mail was sent by coach, to kid, me, viceprincipal, and GC, noting the dismissal, and explaining that they are being notified because kid is a Senior.</p>

<p>Now I am disturbed. Coach is the type of person that might want this on kid’s mid-term report, and try to affect college admissions. Am I being paranoid, to be worried, or should I leave it alone. This is not a person I would pick up the phone and call to chat with. This is a person quite widely disliked, and even disrespected by kids and parents alike, but tolerated because of the amazing activity that is controlled by him. This is a person who is capable of being vengeful and childish.</p>

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<p>Leave it alone. Technically, I’d say the coach probably has the ability to justify kicking him off the team, whether or not it’s the full truth. Even if the midterm report notes that he is no longer on the team, colleges will likely assume it’s because he wants to concentrate on his classes or another activity.</p>

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<p>Personally, if I believed my child was treated unfairly, I would NOT just let it lie. I would at least follow-up the coach’s email with a similar email to the VP and GC providing your son’s side of the story (in the most mature and diplomatic way possible).</p>

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<p>Oh, I know the coach will win any argument. He’s not the debate coach for nothing. Plus he is a scary person as far as justice, fairness etc. goes. I kind of think he wanted to make an example of my kid, to get the other members to repect him more. I just don’t want it reported on midterm report in a way that indicates a lack of responsibility/committment etc. Rumor has it that a couple of years ago the coach actually made a phonecall to a student’s ED school after the kid was accepted and dropped the debate activity, to inform them that they had admitted an irresponsible student!!! I’m not sure if it’s true. But I am tracking down the parents of that kid to verify. Also know that the student still matriculated to that Ivy.</p>

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<p>dufusmom~</p>

<p>I can only imagine your frustration with what appears to be VERY unfair treatment of your son by the school’s debate coach. My son was very much like yours–he could accomplish much with little effort, and though he had an outstanding relationship with his debate coach, there were some teachers who resented this greatly, so I do understand how you and your son must feel. </p>

<p>Since the coach saw fit to put out something in writing, I would issue a written response. Make sure EVERYTHING is well documented with specifics like dates given whenever possible. The schools readily dismiss verbal complaints, but they tend to pay much more attention when situations are well documented and presented in a calm, rational manner. </p>

<p>I would make it VERY clear that you do NOT want this to appear on any reports given to the colleges. There is no reason for it to be. If the coach wants to exert his obvious influence to treat your son like this in h.s., there is NO reason why this treatment should in ANY way impact his college-related stuff.</p>

<p>I do not think you are being paranoid to worry about this. You were prepared to leave it alone until HE issued the written statement and sent it around. Now, it is time to ensure that this man’s vindictiveness does not cost your son more than it has already.</p>

<p>~berurah</p>

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<p>dufusmom,</p>

<p>That is exactly why I would do a follow-up email. Not because you want to win any argument, but because his GC is going to have to write his rec, and you want the GC to have all the info. It might even be an opportunity in disguise for your son to show his GC some of his good qualities.</p>

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<p>I would NOT respond by e-mail. I would make an appointment to discuss with GC face-to-face.</p>

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<p>Dufusmom, I would suggest that you simply send a private email to the GC and ask whether you need to be concerned about this showing up in the midterm report (assuming your son is o.k. with you doing that – if not, suggest to son that he contact the GC and ask directly). If, as you say, the coach is widely disliked and known to be arbitrary and vengeful, it is likely that the vice principal and GC are used to his tantrums and already skilled in the art of ignoring him.</p>

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<p>Yes, talk to the counselor. Don’t talk to the coach directly, and don’t just let it lie.</p>

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<p>I think Calmom hit the nail on the head!
Good luck to your son, dufusmom.</p>

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<p>Honor your kids’s wishes to stay out of it. You sound like you know the whole story from all 3 sides, your S, the coach and the truth, but you do not.
The coach had to officially let everyone know what happened for the record. Your kid is going to college soon and needs to deal with many things on his own. He sounds like he has his life together, so honor his request
Do not worry about the report, because if his future school (s) does not let him attend because of his departure from the debate team, why would he want to go there?</p>

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<p>I think the kid (not parent, as it sounds like the kid is pretty savvy) should be doing a face to face with the GC AND (depending on how that goes) submitting a short written statement.</p>

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<p>

Agreed. But the e-mail is rather lame and vague, and does not really give strong reasons, using terms like “negligent committment” and “dignity of the team” .So there is not much truth to be known.</p>

<p>The mid-year report for the common app does ask for Ratings on Academics and ECs, and whether the GC has changed opinions on previously submitted recommendations. Needless to say, in our huge public school, GCs do not know the students at all except for a 30-minute meeting last year.</p>

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<p>I would think that the trophies your son has garnered would be more important than the hissy fit the coach may throw. I don’t know about midterm reports. Our high school only reports on academics. Furthermore, the colleges only want transcriipts, not the kind of reports that say things like “participates well in class; a pleasure to have in class; is always well prepared” or similar.
I doubt very much that disagreement with a coach will make or break your son’s application. But I would ask your son to have a talk with his GC to find out what will go into the GC’s report.</p>

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<p>Imagine being a college and a debate or any coach called up and whined like that…would he be taken seriouslly? would any decent college, go oh yeah, because of the rantings of some weird guy on the phone, lets reject that kid…if he is like this in person, it will come through in letters, emails, etc. and his contacting the college like that, fo rthe other student, seems to be crosses the line, and probablly p)#*%#d off the GC for going over their head</p>

<p>I would document what happened and I would suggest strongly to son to talk to GC…so if the idjet coach does try and cross that line again, the GC is prepared…I am surprised the coach didn’t get a bit of grief for making that call, if he did…trying to sabotage a student like that is unwarranted and immature, and I am sure the HS is aware of his personality, and will handle it, after all, they want their good kids to get into good colleges, makes everyong look good</p>

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<p>That’s pretty ridiculous. It sounds like you’re kid is an excellent debater, and his coach is splitting hairs.</p>

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<p>As a former college advisor of an EC, I’d like to hear the coach’s side of the story.</p>

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<p>Agree your son should meet with GC and give his side of the story for the very reason that his mid-term report could be affected. You don’t know that this coach is not also bad-mouthing your S to the GC in the teacher’s lounge, not just in a formal email, and may be blowing the reasons for the dismissal way out of proportion. The GC needs to hear from your son. Then after they meet, if it were me, I would write a note to the counselor thanking him/her for taking time to meet with son and hearing his side yada, yada, and then go on to point out all the positive contributions S has made to the debate team. (Some kids just are not very good at blowing their own horns.)</p>

<p>I don’t see how this coach could sabotage an acceptance by contacting the school — how would he even know where your son applied and where he got accepted? If you’re really concerned about that, maybe you should ask the GC to keep that information confidential, should anyone ask. </p>

<p>It’s a shame that someone who doesn’t sound like they’re particularly good at working with teenagers is in a position like this. At our school, we had a similar incident happen with a boy and the band director. The kid had been moody and mouthed off a couple times one week and then got into an argument with the director, an egotistical and volatile sort. During class, the director just said, “You’re out. Leave. Go tell your GC to reassign your classes.” He then sent emails to everyone in administration and even to the marching band and jazz band booster clubs to say this kid was no longer in the band. Later, the kid tried to apologize because being in band was one of the few reasons he even came to school, but the director wouldn’t listen and wouldn’t budge. Luckily, the parents appealed to the principal, who agreed the kid deserved a second chance. Also, the principal said that according to school policy, the director cannot just kick a kid out of such a program — kick him out of all instrumental music essentially — without due process. There would need to be warnings, previous consequences, written documentation that warnings were ignored, and an administrative hearing involving the principal. Not just “you’re out because I say so.” </p>

<p>Maybe you should contact the vice principal and just ask for his/her advice and how to minimize any impact on your S’s college applications.</p>

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<p>I like the idea of contacting the GC. I think email is fine; it lets you re-read your statement before sending, and gives you a documentation of your contact. Just make sure it is brief and to the point. “As you may imagine, we have a different view of the recent situation with debate. We have decided to let it lie, rather than pursue an activity where S is obviously unwelcome. However, I want to be sure that our silence is not interpreted as agreement. I would also like to ensure that S’s mid-year report is not in anyway affected, and that his college applications are not jeapordized.”</p>

<p>Don’t get into coach-bashing, defense, etc. But do document. We had a difficulty my S’s junior year of HS - his language arts teacher was also the debate coach. Long story, but I realized after the first conversation that this teacher did not “converse,” she debated. The purpose of every interaction was not to solve a problem, but to win. After that, I only communicated with email, and when I had to escalate the situation by involving the principal, I was able to copy direct quotes.</p>

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There is simply no substitute for the power of the written word! :)</p>