Kid vs. Coach (HS Division) - parental role?

Parent Cafe
1

<p>I need the sage counsel of CC parental units. My D is being treated unfairly (IMO) by her HS coach, with respect to playing time. She has seen no time on the field in 5 of 9 games, and minimal time in the remainder. This is not because there is an abundance of players; 1/4 of the team is injured and there are only 3 subs (who generally are not played). She is not a star but she is not so bad that the starting 11 deserve 90 minutes of play and she deserves 0. Last year as JV captain she played most of every game.</p>

<p>She has tried to talk with the coach about this and ended up dissolving into tears,and getting no useful feedback. Now she does not want to speak with her again, nor take the matter to someone else. She forbids me from speaking either to the coach or the AD. Even discussing the topic with her just reinforces her unhappiness.</p>

<p>I don’t know what to do. I want to respect her wishes (its her life) but I cannot stand idly by while an incompetent and insensitive coach humiliates her in front of her teammates and ruins her senior varsity experience. (Incompetent is not just my opinion - team is 2-5-2 despite being evenly match skills-wise with opposition. Players generally run out of gas by the end of the game. Several goals against were scored in the last minutes of play.) Do I bring it up with the AD now,while something can be done? Or let the season play out, after which I will certainly make my opinion known to both the coach and the AD?</p>

2

<p>You need to leave it alone. And say nothing to the coach or the AD until your D graduates, if then.</p>

<p>I’ve been there as the parent of a kid with little playing time. It’s hard to watch. But we have to be the adults - support the team, cheer them on, bond with the other parents (whether of high playing time kids or not).</p>

<p>It hurts, I know it hurts. But it is not the end of the world. My guess (it’s only a guess) is that by the time she graduates, this will not loom so large in your bouquet of heartaches.</p>

<p>Just my opinion, but I’ve been there, too.</p>

<p>PS Good for her for speaking to the coach about it (or trying). This is the kind of life skill (addressing concerns directly and to the right person, even if not successful) which will serve her well in the future.</p>

3

<p>As a former (varsity) coach I and current teacher, there is never an excuse to humiliate a kid. At the same time I don’t think that at the varsity level kids are owed playing time. I always expected my JV coaches to play all their players unless their was a disciplinary reason. I didn’t necessarily think every kid should play an equal amount of time in every game but by season’s end playing time should have balanced out. Playing in game situations is how kids grow and develop as players. At the varsity level however, the reality is that winning and losing takes on greater importance. That still doesn’t give any coach the right to humiliate or embarrass a player. There are ways to make kids feel valued regardless of their lack of playing time. (a lesson I learned over the years, sometimes the hard way) </p>

<p>I probably wouldn’t intervene over playing time. That’s the coach’s decision and at it’s heart is based upon opinion. I would however definitely address the issue of how your daughter is talked to/treated with the coach. Whether you like them or not, you owe it to the coach to talk to her first. If you are not satisfied with her response, then you can go to the A.D. or ask that the A.D. be a part of your conference with the coach, just don’t go over the coach’s head. It’s not fair to them whether you agree, disagree with them.</p>

<p>I think you also have to respect your daughter’s wishes as well. She has learned a valuable life lesson by trying to talk to the coach herself.</p>

4

<p>

I almost added this coda to my previous post. My S’ coach had this skill. I didn’t really know it until the EOY banquet when he spoke of each player and his role on the team. It was clear that he had, from the beginning, let each player - including the benchwarmers - know of their key role on the team. Even if that key role was playing the starters <em>hard</em> in practice. I think this helped my S a lot in coping with his limited playing time. The coach’s praise of and appreciation for each player, no matter the relative skill level, was obvious and genuine.</p>

<p>If there is any message drb might want to discuss with the AD after the year is over, this might be it. I don’t think that parental input on how to manage playing time, how much better the team might have performed if the starters were rested more… is ever very valued. Especially if it comes from a bench sitter parent. Now, if the parents of the starters and stars want to agitate for a little more relief from the subs… :).</p>

5

<p>I don’t have a lot of experience with difficult coaches, although the rec league coach a few years ago, didn’t play my daughter as much as she would have liked, she wasn’t a strong player, but IMO that is how you learn, by getting playing time. The last game of the season, he barely put her in at all, despite her eagerness to play, which was noticed by her teammates- to their credit they were practically as upset as she was.
In her case though, this coach didn’t return the next year- and the coach she had , had before, returned, who plays everyone as much as they want- because he thinks that is also how you get better, and ironically they are in the top division.
I realize kids rarely want parents to step in.
However, look at it this way- this coach goes unchallenged, she goes on to treat subsequent players this way. Even if she isn’t a strong player, humiliation, is not a way to motivate players to do better. Especially since she is a strong player- there is no reason to risk some girls getting injured and overtired, while the others watch.
My D is just in a rec league, but they don’t have subs, every girl is considered an equal member of team, and they are switched out, when injured or they need a rest.This isn’t professional sports- its kids!
I would tell my D I was going to the athletic director, and I understood that she didn’t want that, but that sometimes parents have to make a judgement to step in despite their childs wishes when the situation warrants it. ( you might also play the guilt card, that by telling you of the situation, but not allowing you to do anything about it, is unfair- but thats your call)</p>

<p>I think it is important for the team and the girls development that they have good coaches- and unless parents and students go to the AD, they may not be aware of a problem</p>

<p>I notice my opinion is different than the other posters
D is on high school teams that are more individual- swimming and track- so varsity /JV and playing time don’t come into it as it would on a high school soccer team.
I am not familar with the pressures that varsity players and their coaches may be under. I still feel however, that a good coach can make an amazing difference, and it is hard to watch if your kids are on a team with a weak coach.I will bow to others expereince re playing time, but I still don’t think humiliation has a place on the field. If that treatment was recieved in a classroom, I am sure that the principal would be notified immediately, I don’t think a coach should get special handling.</p>

6

<p>At our HS, sports parents were invited to a meeting at the start of the year, hosted by the AD and attended by all the coaches. We were told that the right chain is student>coach, then parent>coach, then parent>AD. If she is being humiliated and has tried dealing with the coach, but has asked you not to talk with the coach, she may fear further retribution. I’d talk with the coach first. Not in an accusatory way, just asking what could be done to improve communication between D and coach. You might mention that your D is worried about you sharing these concerns: I suspect it won’t be the first time the coach hears that. Give the coach a try first, but if your D is dissolving in tears when she tries to talk with the coach and is being humiliated in front of her teammates (and you can verify this), I think the AD needs to know at some point. That’s not what the HS athletic experience is about, and I think the AD would need to know that. I would talk to the coach and would probably talk to the AD before the end of the season, myself.</p>

7

<p>I interpreted the OP’s statement that the D is being “humiliated in front of her peers” as the embarrassment of little playing time, not actual direct humiliating of the girl. If I am wrong, then I retract my post above. I certainly think that the embarrassment of little play is also real, but something one needs to learn to cope with in life. There will be venues in which you stand out, venues in which you are invisible and venues in which you suffer in comparison to the stand-outs who are not you. Life as we know it.</p>

8

<p>Ahh drb - same scenario playing out at our hs (sigh). New coach comes with his freshman son and a bunch of friends who coach groomed since first grade. Guess who starts and plays 99% of every varsity game? Seniors who’ve been bustin’ their butts for 4 years sitting on the bench while freshmen continue to lose every game. Coach’s letter at the beginning of the season said “I DO NOT TALK TO PARENTS!” Now I know why, and even though I’ve never even been tempted to talk to a coach in the past, I sure would like to give this one a piece of my mind. The problem is he won’t talk to the kids either - they just can’t do anything right. H and I have resigned ourselves to self-pity and several glasses of wine after every game. This season may just make me an alcoholic! The seniors just shake their heads and keep hoping to play the next game. All in all a big bummer.</p>

9

<p>jmmom- I guess I took it more literally- since I have heard of coaches who think that demeaning the players is the way to get them angry enough to work harder
But if the humilation is just that she isn’t treated equally- then I agree, playing time at the varsity level is the coaches call- and like in my daughters case- she wasn’t humilated in front of her teammates- even though they were stronger players at the time, they felt that the team- came before always winning & that if she wanted to play, then she should play.</p>

<p>Varsity is much more stressful, my D didn’t even try out for her school team, even though her coaches daughter plays on both the school and the rec league team, because the school team is very competitive . At schools like this, just making the team, is a judgement that you are good, but some of the girls on Ds rec team, although they are really good, chose to stay on the rec team rather than going for the school team, precisely because playing time was more important to them , than being on the next level of competitiveness</p>

10

<p>jmmom is correct; it is the humiliation of little playing time. Were it a more active humilitation, the case for intervention would be pretty clear. However, it is, nonetheless, humiliation: the actions of the coach imply to her teammates that my kid’s mere presence on the field jeopardizes their chances of success.</p>

<p>It is true that in “life as we know it” we will not all be stars. However, one does hope for at the least the opportunity to prove oneself.</p>

11

<p>drb - I personally find myself thinking that these hs coaches should get their heads on straight. That this not the NFL, NHL, MLB, MLS or whatever! That developing kids’ athletic skills, giving them a chance, thinking of their spirits as well as their athletic abilities is important. But I also know that many many people think hs varsity athletics is about playing your best team and winning. I’m not one of them. And I hear you that your coach isn’t even winning with his strategy. </p>

<p>I know how it gets under your skin, on behalf of your daughter, but all in all, I retain my opinion that is not something to intervene in. Hard as that is. Backfin’s coping mechanism may be the order of the day. Stopping short of alcoholism, of course.</p>

<p>Your daughter is gaining strength that you might not be able to see through this season. Learning, the hard way, how to handle disappointment and embarrassment. We’d like to spare our kids these emotions, truly we would. But it’s not always the best thing.</p>

<p>A wise cc parent once told me that kids who have been through this kind of thing have a big head start on college life. Many kids arrive at college never having suffered a disappointment, never having been second string… They can’t handle it. Your D has gained something important, which compensates for the hurt and embarrassment. You can’t see it now, but you will.</p>

12

<p>from what I have heard though- it isn’t uncommon on high school varsity teams for there to be very competitive tryouts, but then no assurance of playing time- which is why some kids opt for rec or select teams rather than high school teams.</p>

13

<p>What about your daughter’s team captain(s)? Maybe they could talk to coach and explain that it would boost team morale and cohesiveness if all the girls could rotate in for minutes of play—the amount depending on the play of the game. It’s hard to believe that in any game time cannot be found to sub and rest the starters.</p>

14

<p>Been there. I would not talk to the coach, particularly since D already has. If D is getting practice time during scrimmages on an equal basis with other teammates, then the coach has ample time to see D’s skills and playing
style. I’d encourage D to make an appointment with the coach so they can talk one-on-one.</p>

<p>My S has spent many hours riding the pine. We’ve always told him to bide his time and that his day will come. We’ve encouraged him to talk to the coach about playing time or positions on practice days, not during a game. </p>

<p>On game day we’ve made the assumption that the coach has a game plan and a plan for managing players, so it’s not a good time for players to make requests. Bad coaches don’t always have a plan, but we’ve instilled that player reponse in our son. We tell him to always be ready in case his team needs him. Some years, especially when he’s moved up a division, he’s kept the bench nice and warm!</p>

<p>Sports has taught him that life and coaches are not always fair. It’s a tough lesson, but he’s stuck to the high road. Sometimes it takes another year and another coach.</p>

15

<p>If D is breaking down when trying to talk to the coach, I suggest you can help her with some skills so that she can have a productive discussion. D needs to try to park the emotions at the door, and have a rational discussion with the coach. You might want to try some role playing (eg you be the coach). From what was posted, D has no idea as to what the coach’s approach to game time is or why she is not playing. A simple ‘I want to get play time, so what do I need to improve to do it?’ would go a long way.</p>

<p>I am in agreement that dealing with coaches provides a useful life skill; one that your D can go on to use with professors and managers.</p>

<p>I am always impressed with the kids on the team who don’t get much, or any, play time but are a part of the team. This shows an inspiring level of perseverence and dedication.</p>

<p>Good luck</p>

16

<p>I must add that if you heard the coach-bashing post-game conversations between H and I over the years, you’d question everything I said above! We are human afterall. :)</p>

<p>Perhaps the coach is inexperienced. Any parent who has ever coached a team knows how difficult it is to get it all right. It takes a big heart and a strong head to manage a team and the team parents.</p>

17

<p>If she’s actually good enough to play on that team, not the “shes my daughter good,” but literally good, then yes you should say something. </p>

<p>However, evaluate the situation clearly. Would having her play embarras her? Is she really good enough to hack it on the varsity team, or would she be outclassed by the other players? That could be why she doesn’t play.</p>

<p>But if you can objectively say she’s good enough to be out there, go say something. remember, its high school, and sometimes these coaches/teachers have these big egos that need to be broken down by a parent, especially one who curses a lot. Just remember, the team sucks - so he shouldn’t have much of a leg to stand on.</p>

18

<p>“Just remember, the team sucks - so he shouldn’t have much of a leg to stand on.”</p>

<p>But how do you make a rational argument if the coach doesn’t seem to care if they lose? In our case, (and I think drb’s sounds the same) the coach is happy with the way the kids on the field are playing. He likes their style (haha-he’s coached them since they were 6) and only seems to care about getting them experience and playing time. Last years V starters who won games have not been on the field. He’s looking to the future and doesn’t give a rats a@@ about the seniors or this season. At least in our case there’s a whole group that can console each other and blow it off - I feel bad for drb’s D going it alone. If somebody has an agenda nothing you say will make a difference, so we found it best to stay out of it and just count the days till the end of the season.</p>

19

<p>My S’s current soccer coach had this to say about winning matches:</p>

<p>“I tell the kids that we always play to win. We may not always win, but we’ll play as a team.”</p>

<p>The kids and parents love this guy!</p>

20

<p>hmmmm, having had a couple of really bad coaches (and leaving the teams) with my Ds as middle school age, and been a coach, I have seen this from all sides</p>

<p>How much of the season is left, and does your D have fun on the team outside of the game time? Does she enjoy the team bodning stuff, the road trips, the overnights? If yes, then have D focus on that stuff, play the “it looks good on apps” card, and that its just a few more weeks, show you are tough and that jerk can’t beat you down…what ever it takes to get through it</p>

<p>In middle school, we had a teacher who ALWAYS, and I mean ALWAYS picked her faves, for lead in plays, academics teams, etc., it was the most frustrating thing, and what helped my D get through was seeing the end goal- getting into a good HS, and to not let that witch with a B make my D doubt herself, and to just keep working hard, keep trying, cheer for her friends, realize that this too shall pass…</p>

<p>but, you can be doing something…at each game, note the time of play- kind of track what is going on, so that when season is over, you can give to AD, the teams record will speak for itself, and perhaps the coach will get a bit of a talking to</p>

<p>so my advise is to redirect Ds focus- her friends on the team, getting in shape, holding on for just a bit longer, and showing that jerky coach (and use those words in private, it helps to vent- we called the teacher Cruella Deville behind her back) that she is stronger than that, and that your D has some class, even though the coach doesn;t</p>