As I mentioned earlier, I don’t believe that all LAC’s with engineering are created equal, and Swarthmore appears to be the exception to the rule. Because it offers a general engineering degree only, without specialization, the workload is far less demanding than would be the case at Lafayette, Union, etc., where the degree is specialized and a significantly greater number of credits are required for completion. Swarthmore seems to be the one program that really does keep its liberal arts character.</p>
<p>As for the schools in contention, none are the so-called “tech” schools, and all of them offer a vast array of opportunities outside the engineering program. The only question is whether he’d be able to take advantage of those opportunities if he decides to stick with engineering. The “tunnel vision” required to successfully complete an engineering program is going to limit his exploration outside that field. Not bar, but limit.</p>
<p>My bias is towards doing the liberal arts program now, while he has the chance. He can always get a professional degree later, but he can’t go back to college. Obviously, that may not be the most cost-effective approach. And it may not be the preferred route for a teenager who really wants to believe that he already has his whole life figured out.</p>
<p>By the way, regarding math and physics, the kid enjoys math. Did not enjoy physics so much because he found it quite difficult. He still scored a 4 on the physics AP test, though, so perhaps not all is lost. ;)</p>
<p>More on physics and engineering, from what I have observed.</p>
<p>At the high school level I think physics, at least AP Physics with calculus, is the first time most high school students have encountered a science where a relatively high level of mathematics is essential. While biology and chemistry may get to a more mathematical representation of the subject area at the university level, its generally not so at the high school level. Figuring out how to model the phenomenon in question, choosing the right mathematical technique to represent the system, and then using that math to predict the behavior of that system under an arbitrary set of conditions, is the key to calculus based mechanics and much of engineering.</p>
<p>So it may be useful for your son to do some introspection and figure out why physics was so difficult. In my case regular high school physics was not easy but AP physics taken concurrently with AP calculus was fabulous. But as in many subjects being good at something in high school and enjoying it does not necessarily translate into being successful at the university level. After starting out as a physics major I switched to mathematics and ended up with an economics major and math minor. </p>
<p>In addition to differential and integral calculus of a single variable, multi variate calculus, linear algebra and differential equations are all going to be key for engineering (as they are for physics). For physics and intro engineering it takes both the mathematical horsepower to solve the math of the problem, but also the imagination/intuition/creativity or whatever to translate the physical problem into the correct mathematical framework.</p>
<p>Instead of generalizing, perhaps you and he should start going through course catalogs of each school to determine exactly what the degree requirements are for each major under consideration, and how much schedule space there is for out-of-major interests (such schedule space may come from free elective space, H/SS breadth space for H/SS interests, or even in-major electives for science/engineering interests).</p>
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<p>Depending on the specific areas of engineering of interest, this may be more or less feasable. Since you have not named them, it is hard for others to give specific information. For example, if the interest is civil engineering, it really makes the most sense to do an ABET-accredited civil engineering major, since PE licensing is most important in civil engineering. But for industrial engineering, it may be more possible to enter parts of the job market with a degree in math or statistics, if the school offers, and the student takes, applicable courses in linear programming, operations research, decision analysis, etc…</p>
<p>Swarthmore is a wonderful school if that is one of the options. My son looked at this school. For him, getting the 2nd degree he was looking at had the same number of courses as Lafayette. Yes, there are 6 fewer math/science/engineering courses. If you want to be an engineer this may or may not be the best idea. The average course load at Swarthmore for engineers is less, and my son had fewer AP credits at Swarthmore than Lafayette. Additionally, the distribution requirements are greater at Swarthmore. My son is exploring his significant interest in three very different fields. At Swarthmore, if you get a second major, you cannot get a minor.</p>
<p>Swarthmore is wonderful, but not the only place to explore multiple areas of interest as available at a LAC.</p>
<p>If he really wants to be a physician, the single most important thing he can do as an undergraduate is maintain stellar grades. I’m not an engineer, but my understanding is that engineering grades have not experienced the grade inflation rampant in other fields. I served on Med School Admission Committee, and we did not even look at apps with low grades or MCATs–regardless of field of study, school name, etc etc. </p>
<p>However, many of the people who would be good at engineering at science would find studying humanities at a high level to be quite difficult to get A grades in (as opposed to B grades, which are too low for pre-med purposes).</p>
<p>To some extent, it may be “harder” to get a pre-med-worthy GPA in engineering because there is less non-major elective space to cherry-pick “easy A” courses in than for other majors.</p>
<p>Any chance we could get an update? I am very interested in what was decided. We are building the list of schools to see so this thread has been of much interest to me. </p>
<p>Caltech, Columbia University, & RPI, also issue engineering degrees concurrent with a liberal arts college.
Three years @ Reed, then two years at the above schools.</p>
<p>Caltech, Columbia University, & RPI, also issue engineering degrees concurrent with a liberal arts college.
Three years @ Reed, then two years at one of the above schools.</p>
<p>I didnt mean to bump it.
It didnt look like the post went through the first time.
I seem to have that problem more often since the " improvements".</p>