Actually, you need the date of death value, which could be the same as present value or it could be higher or lower, depending on the market. You also need to know what the purchase price was, plus the cost of any improvements. Since the house is worth less than $50K, per Creekland, it doesn’t sound like capital gains will be a huge issue. For 2018, it’s still 15% of the sales price minus the basis. Of course, it only has to be paid now if a house is sold, If you hold on to either house, the date of death value becomes the stepped up basis and that will be used to compute any capital gains when it’s sold, unless of course it becomes a primary residence and is excluded.
In NYS, my H always gets an appraiser for his client’s houses. Some realtors are qualified but he will never hire the same one to whom the listing is given.
My main concern is why this first attorney has been so unresponsive to her client’s needs and requests. This really doesn’t sound like a complicated proceeding.
I sure hope the next lawyer is more helpful for us. Thanks a ton for the info everyone. We’ll see about getting both places appraised. I sure hope the appraiser can see through the Hoarder cwap ('cause nephew has inherited those genes too and his place is also horrific). Sis claims she has cleaned dad’s up a bit (though her version of clean would probably differ from the majority). I’ll find out soon.
FWIW my parents hired an attorney to write their wills. After they died, my siblings and I went to meet the attorney. He stated that he wasn’t sure what to do next as this was the first time any of his clients had died. His suggestion was to do probate ourselves and call him with any questions. Which we did. It was a semi-complicated estate (properties, multiple bank and stock accounts in various names and siblings around the globe). What saved us was that we all did (and still do) got along and trusted that whoever was taking care of what was doing the best job possible. Good luck.
Radio lawyer show today with several callers not getting a response from their lawyers. Bottom line, per this guy, “Get a new lawyer.” That you have a right to a response and the lawyer has a duty.
Just a coincidence but makes me wonder why? Too many incompetents trying to scrape a dollar together?
Best to you, Creekland.
I regularly edit a column about risk management for lawyers, written by an employee of a company that provides professional liability insurance for lawyers. One of his regular refrains is that lawyers should not “dabble,” that is, do work in areas in which they have little experience. He also advises lawyers against taking on every potential client who walks through the door. Some lawyers have a tendency to do both – dabble and take every case – because they need the money.
And some states don’t require lawyers to specialize. Ugh.
Just an aside, the lawyer who drew up my papers also has financial experience and was highly recommended by both my CPA and financial guy, who use him (so not just a professional referral.) But when the time comes, I do want him to work with those two others. Together, they can put the whole story together. 95% of my details will be covered and anything not is small.
Does any state require a lawyer to specialize? Every state bar exam tests on everything, and anyone with a license can take any case. A few states to require experience before taking a capital case.
A problem a few of my friends have had is that their parents used a lawyer for the will, and as the parents aged, so did the lawyer. One friend had parents who owned a farm/ranch that was worth a lot. The father died, mother continued to use the old, small town lawyer. Friend asked me a few questions and I knew it was beyond my pay grade so referred her to a friend just to ask questions. She called back an hour later and said “We’re switching to Ed!” Ed is a tax attorney and probably saved her thousands as it was an estate approaching the limit.
Many people stick to their original lawyer or doctor or car mechanic because it is easier than switching.
First task to give to the next lawyer is to get the original will out of the lawyer you are dissatisfied with. From what you describe, everything that is waiting to be done is waiting on that.
@ucbalumnus Having come to NY today and talking with my sister in person tonight, the new lawyer told her it would be quicker (and cheaper) if we could get the file ourselves than if he had to send her a letter and wait for her response. Sis does not want to take the extra time nor pay the expense. I asked her what it would cost and she just told me “a lot.” I interpret that to mean she didn’t ask. Time will tell what sis gets tomorrow.
H and I are going to the courthouse tomorrow to see what we can find - both with this and with dad’s debts (what liens he has filed against him). Should be fun (yes, read that with sarcasm). I’m not holding my breath that lawyer 1 will have what my sister has requested, but time will tell.
Just read an email response from lawyer 1 questioning the personal check. Seems they accept them for folks doing it themselves and not via a lawyer so that answers that question. Then she went on to berate me quite a bit for interfering in the process and will not give me a copy of the itemized bill, only my sister.
Way to win friends and influence people. Well, TBH, she is influencing me… (and sis) and I will keep the email should anyone we talk with IRL care to read it.
I am not responding. I asked about the personal check and got my answer. I’d also asked for a copy of the itemized bill, but sis will share that with me so no big deal. I look forward to dealing with someone who knows what they are doing, will actually do it instead of making empty promises, and hopefully has a much more personable personality.
Would it really be quicker to do it yourself, given that you and your sister have made no progress so far doing it yourself?
Seems like the first lawyer knows that she has all of the power over you and your sister by holding the will as a hostage, so she has no incentive to be cooperative. It may take a letter from another lawyer to get any cooperation.
In personal injury cases, when a client wants to change attorneys, they can get a consent to change attorney form, which is just a document signed by the client and the new attorney and sent/given to the old attorney, who signs it. They are supposed to surrender the file. I know lawyer 1 wants to be paid. How about paying her, having her sign a consent (that lawyer 2 can prepare, it’s literally 2 paragraphs), getting the file and then suing her in small claims court for the return of unearned fees?
I am curious about what the court tells you about personal checks. Are you upstate?
Unfortunately, none of us are qualified to give legal advice. You’ll need to take the paperwork to a lawyer you can trust and ask what that they can do to fix this issue. It’s not a good idea to come here for that.
I’m confused. Has a probate case been filed yet? If not, then what will be “at the courthouse?” If so, then I would think the will should be on file.
This really doesn’t have to be all that complicated. You file for probate. That starts a time line. Notice goes out. A few hearings take place. Then everything can transfer. In the meantime, all non-probate assets are taken care of. Yes it can take 6-12 months because of the required time line. But in uncontested cases, it should be relatively simple.
Who is the client of lawyer 1? You, your sister, the estate, or both of you as individuals (conflicts explained and waved)? Only the client can fire their counsel.
@BunsenBurner Considering no contract has been signed, who knows? We all assumed it would be my sister though.
@yourmomma We just returned from the courthouse looking up judgments against dad (his debts) and stopped by Surrogate’s Court afterward. Nothing at all has been filed with Surrogate’s Court as of noon today. He died Aug 26th… and the lawyer was contacted the following day. A meeting was held between her, my sister, and my uncle in early Sept. That was supposed to get the process going. All seemed terrific at that point.
At this point, I want to file for probate - or let a new attorney do it. My sister wants a new attorney to do it and has been in contact with him as well as requesting the file from lawyer 1. None of us can do a thing until we get the original will which lawyer 1 has.
My sister has a certified check in the amount she was told for lawyer 1. She’s called the lawyer’s office twice so far today and gotten voice mail both times. No return call. What a surprise (sarcasm abounds). Not even the secretary is answering.
I’m with @ucbalumnus thinking we just need to let the new lawyer handle it, but sis feels certain we can save $$ by getting it from lawyer 1 still (sigh). I’m seriously contemplating just washing my hands of the whole thing. Let them take 10 years getting this done.
@coolguy40 You are incredibly wrong with this situation. I’ve learned a ton from starting this thread. It was super worth it. No one is giving legal advice - they are giving advice for me to be able to get something done. Folks who have BTDT esp in the state involved are super helpful.
As an aside, Chief Staff Weenie noticed lawyer 1 put the wrong initial for my dad in the Waiver forms. I suppose this means those need to be redone, but who knows.
The client is the estate with the Sister representing the estate. The lawyer need not acknowledge the existence of other family members. However, many with with the permission of the estate representative.
@Creekland The court will only show you judgments against your dad – issues that went to trial or settled after a court filing. It will show nothing about his everyday debts. Your sis will need to contact all known creditors and publish a notice for unknown creditors. They then have a few months to file claims against the estate. As part of the probate, the estate settles claims and then anything further is bared.
But yeah, you’re still at square one. Get the will, get an attorney and file a probate case. Good luck.
@yourmomma We already have the debts figured out. Fortunately there are no credit cards or similar. It’s the judgments we needed (and back taxes, but an accountant is working on those). Dad and his court cases (sigh).
Needless to say, the lawyer didn’t have anything for sis today. It’s now promised for tomorrow. Sis believes her. I feel like the movie Groundhog Day.
The other really irritating thing is the lawyer’s bill at $900+ is right in a sweet spot for her. It takes a minimum of $1000 to dispute a fee via arbitration and $3000 to require a contract ahead of time. She’s maxed out what she could and not get in any sort of trouble. Why am I not surprised?
I looked at @Jugulator20 's link about client’s rights and we’ve had essentially none met except for #10 with not being discriminated against - yet we get charged in excess of $900 with no recourse. .