Legal advice: consumer rights/contracts

Parent Cafe
1

<p>OK with all of the brillant CCers here–
advice please</p>

<p>About 5 years ago, we contracted with and alarm company to monitor and existing alarm system (residential). The fine print on the back included that after the inital term (3 yrs) the contract renewed automatically unless cancelled in writing sevral months before “automatic renewl”.</p>

<p>In May of 2009 we received a notice that our alarm service was raising our rates…and we could “lock in” existing rates…this was outside of a normal renewl period/notice. Excuse me–the original contract and terms were set as was the fee.</p>

<p>I called and told the alarm company (our account had long since been sold to an “umbrella company” called “Alarm Center” in PA ) that we would not be continuing as a client under the new terms. We sent a letter within the 10 days (as per the fine print of the original contract) and have proof of receipt.</p>

<p>About 45 days later we resent all of the copies of the first letter etc as we got a “reminder” of the increase in fee and how we could “lock in” our old rates…Our correspondence was again sent proof of receipt within the 10 days (per fine print)</p>

<p>The company ceased monitoring us and ceased billing us all sumemr and into the fall. Mid fall we got a couple of sales flyers telling us we should have an alarm company etc…to protect our property…and never heard from them again.</p>

<p>We know the company was no longer monitoring the property because when trouble lights came on - on the panel–we never heard from them. Since we had not been monitored nor billed for more than 5 months- we have since removed all of the old equipment (we owned it).</p>

<p>We are now receiving a mailing that this contract/debt was assigned to collections…the envelope has no post mark and no proof of delivery. It says if we do not respond within 30 days of receipt…blah blah…</p>

<p>Internet research of the collections company finds: (company and employee name deleted) [employee] made part of his earlier career in “customer retention” for alarm companies. For those that don’t know–“Customer” rentention is the division where the employees aargue and harass and try and convince/bully etc customers that they "can’t " leave an alarm company…</p>

<p>I contend: </p>

<p>1- alarm company invalidated existing contract by changing terms and raising rate</p>

<p>2- we sent in writing within the 10 day required period notice of cancellation…and have proof of receipt</p>

<p>3- we re-sent notice of cancellation with proof of receipt etc…</p>

<p>4-alarm company ceased montoring and ceased billing</p>

<p>So what to do as this is now harassment. Internet research finds tons of consumers complaining … How do I get them to leave me and my credit alone and can this be a class action lawsuit? I have to believe after reading so many internet complaints that this companies practices are unfair and illegal. Which state agencies can help with this? Should I just go to the local news consumer advocate?</p>

<p>My spouse would rather just pay the severla hundre dollars to make the go away–and I on principle do not want to be bullied when we did the right thing.</p>

2

<p>Really no lawyers here?
No one with a smiliar situation or an idea about which agency to report this to etc?</p>

<p>sigh</p>

<p>Guess I will contact the local news consumer advocate. The last time I had an issue with falsified billing from a long distance telephone company—that helped.</p>

3

<p>The federal agency to contact is the [Federal</a> Trade Commission](<a href=“http://ftc.gov/]Federal”>http://ftc.gov/). You could also try [your</a> state’s Attorney General’s office](<a href=“Making government services easier to find | USAGov”>Making government services easier to find | USAGov).</p>

<p>Paying hundreds of dollars to make them go away is just crazy.</p>

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<p>I have tried googling to figure out the where and the who in our state …</p>

<p>I may have to blanket a few dept.s with letters to hit the right desk…</p>

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<p>[This</a> link](<a href=“Making government services easier to find | USAGov”>Making government services easier to find | USAGov) should give you the where and who in your state.</p>

6

<p>Hey, fogfog</p>

<p>I’m with you. I get so self righteous when treated this way. How about composing a letter to the State Attorney General and send a copy of that to the “Alarm Company” along with copies of all correspondence. Tell the Attorney General that you are interested in a class action lawsuit. Maybe seeing the letter will make them back off.</p>

<p>Good Luck</p>

7

<p>Thanks for the page with the state info.</p>

<p>I think I will write a nice “love” letter about this and cc every state office–and of course the “alarm company” and collecttions business.</p>

<p>I just hate that this business is so unscrupulous…Internet searches find tons of complaints…
you have to read the fine print (printed in pale grey on the back of the contract is very tiny print) see that under one of the allowances–a consumer can opt out–and since the company negated the contract by trying to raise the rates
and “offered to lock us into old rates” (guess how!)…they opend the door for us to walk.</p>

<p>What business says “oh yeah we are raising your rates”–and when you walk says–“oh no we wont do that now and you HAVE to stay…” pullleeease</p>

8

<p>I had a 3 years of dispute with T-Mobile on the cancellation fee. They send me to collection agency(s) and reported it to credit monitoring companies. It brought my credit score down by 100 points. They harrassed me day and night, and no matter what I did I couldn’t get the negative item off my credit report. People told me that I needed a lawyer or just pay them ($500) to get them off my back. As the last resort, I contacted the Better Business Bureau online. Within a week, I heard from T-Mobile to let me know that they have agreed with my terms (pay off the balance, but not the cancellation fee, and take the negative report off my credit report). It didn’t cost me a penny. I would suggest for you to file a complaint online with BBB.</p>

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<p>You might try clarkhoward.com, he is all over those alarm companies, there may be ideas on the message boards</p>

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<p>Here’s the story. You pay them monthly. So when the contract “renewed,” it renewed monthly. I’ve never seen a court enforce a contract automatically renewing for 3 years. I’ve never seen a company try to argue that because it’s so clearly not going to win. </p>

<p>Take a look at leases. They often have renewal clauses but the rule generally is that the lease renews according to the period of payment, which is almost always monthly. </p>

<p>Further, if the original contract has expired as you say, then it’s quite possible that any notice requirements longer than the period of payment (a month) are reduced to that period. In other words, the contract becomes month to month with a month’s notice required.</p>

<p>I had something exactly like this happen when I cancelled an alarm monitoring contract. The company sent me a bill for the rest of 2 years or so. I sent them a letter telling them their bill was entirely illegal and that they’d better apologize or I was referring them to the attorney general. They called immediately to rescind the bill. </p>

<p>The basic rule is that once a contract has expired it continues as a terminable contract according to the payment period. So if you pay weekly, the contract renews week to week and you give a week’s notice to end it. The rule is generally that the longest period allowed is a month, but that’s usually not important because people usually pay at least once a month.</p>

11

<p>Writing the Attorney General’s office worked for us when we had a similar problem, but it should be the Attorney General in the state where the business operates, not your state. (you mentioned that the business had been transfered to a PA company.)<br>
A letter to the company and to the collection agency stating that you’re not paying, and why, along with a copy of the letter you sent to the PA Attorney General may do the trick.</p>

12

<p>OK</p>

<p>so called AG in our state and spoke to them</p>

<p>Referred to BBB in state and then referred to website.
Filed complaint in state on web site.
Called Dept of Business and Prof Reg in state and registered call re complaint.</p>

<p>Called PA AG office and referred to Media PA offices.
Spoke with office and I am crafting letter to go with forms/back up materials.</p>

<p>Will send via fax (bakcup mail) materials and also send copies to AG in home state.</p>

<p>Will call TX AG office to find out which office/district handles the area where collections company is working.</p>

<p>Owner of collections agency is in Utah–do I have to file in Utah as well?</p>

<p>Is anyone here and attorney and willing to take a gander at this letter and suggest changes?</p>

13

<p>For remediation I am asking for fraudulent bill to be recinded, for collections to be recalled and for proof in writing from</p>

<p>Alarm Center
collections comp in Tx
and all credit agencies</p>

<p>… that there is no hit on my credit score/history and all is ok</p>

<p>Anything I have forgotten?</p>

14

<p>Just be sure a copy of the letter to the PA AG are in the letter you send to the alarm company so they know you’re not fooling around. That should do it. Good luck, and what a pain, huh?! </p>

<p>No need to respond to the collections company. Go direct to the Alarm Center, as you are doing.
I would try to find out the name of the President of the company so you can address it to him/her.</p>

<p>When we did this, we sent it to the company President registered mail with return receipt requested. I wanted to make sure they got it.</p>

15

<p>The “contract” says it rolls overe every 3 yrs for 3 yr renewable terms unless in writing they are contacted 60 days beforehand AND that I only have 10 days to respond in writing to NOT want to pay new fees…</p>

<p>I am guessing then the contract isn’t legal to renew this way since we were then paying monthly (and changed to quarterly for our “benefit/convenience”</p>

<p>This is going to be a pain in the neck…</p>

<p>can anyone steer me toward what common contract law is and where to find the info so I can point out this contract is illegal…</p>

16

<p>18 pages faxed to AG in PA
same fax w cover sheet faxed to my state AG</p>

<p>SHORT fax to Alarm Center telling them I filing registered complains in the 3 states
SHORT fax to the Hillcrest-Davidson with copy of Fax to Alarm Center</p>

<p>Evidently only LA is not a Common Law state with respect to terminable contracts…</p>

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<p>I was contacted by T-Mobile within 2 weeks after I filed a complaint with BBB. They agreed to the term I outlined inthe complaint.h</p>

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<p>Dunno, I’m a baker but I wouldn’t give you a loaf of bread for free.</p>

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<p>^^^ yeah that’s “cute”, real generous are ya huh.</p>

<p>OK so the letters and supporting stuff is faxed/18 pages.</p>

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<p>In Ohio for property lease(similar, not exact comparison) at the end of a long lease, it automatically renews on a month-to-month UNLESS the contract dictates otherwise. So a year long contract will renew for a yr, if the contract says so(and of course neither party cancels).
If the lease contract doesn’t mention about renewing, then it renews on a month to month.</p>

<p>Let’s remember rents of property are often a yr long lease, but paid monthly. In Ohio, how they are paid doesn’t dictate how they can renew. The contract does.</p>