<p>Yes, I completely agree with that, sooz. Let the professionals familiar with the actual case assist with placements and treatment options.</p>
<p>We are here for you, though. I’m sure you are exhuasted. I was sure you were exhuasted months ago. good luck.</p>
<p>“The doctor and therapist were thrown by this aspect of her life for a long time. She does very well in terms of holding jobs but blows other things off. She has a fear of being broke and that is probably what keeps the jobs going.”</p>
<p>FWIW, that is a GREAT area to have strength in, as hopefully it means she will at least have health insurance and maybe mental health benefits. Also, kudos to you and her therapist for not going too far down the “bipolar” path, which is easier to get coverage for, but in my experience, not a lot easier to treat,at least in the long run.</p>
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</p>
<p>Yes and no. Vast majority of psychiatrists and psychologists are not ‘specialists’ in BPD per se. Therefore, they are often not familiar with some/many options out there. The concerned parent who has spent much time looking at, and perhaps has direct experience with, various options and treatment programs available in different parts of the country can often be much more knowledgeable than the local doctor who only spends small portion of his time dealing with BPD.</p>
<p>We had this experience where our family therapist was at her wits end and asked other people at a meeting about what they knew, and someone there told her about a small but very effective program they knew about that ended up being a life saver for us. Not lay people, but you get the idea.</p>
<p>I am speaking as a physician, although not a psychiatrist.</p>
<p>The BIG issue is that she has to want treatment and it is not at all clear that she does. Most Borderlines are in their comfort zone and not wanting to move out of it. Although, I have to say, some of her behaviors sound beyond BPD.</p>
<p>However, you bring up a good example. To my knowledge, a therapist or psychiatrist would consult with others in their field to find an option for the young woman if they themselves were not well versed on them. Of course it doesn’t hurt for a parent to become well informed too. Still, I think asking for a treatment facility would be best served by asking professionals in the area (I think the OP lives in a major metropolitan area and not in the sticks). I don’t even know if the doctor is recommending an inpatient treatment. The D would have to be willing to attend.</p>
<p>I am beyond leaving anything completely up to her Dr and therapist. In my opinion this should have been diagnosed long ago since her behavior was so so out there. I will investigate any and all types of therapy and treatment that are out there that I think will help her. I no longer have the trust in her therapist who by the way is not the first or second one she has been to. She has fooled them all and is very good at fooling everyone other than her immediate family. My daughters mental illness has had a terrible effect on everyone and yet she manages to somehow function with one aspect of her life which is work. I can’t figure it out especially since she is in jobs where she is dealing with the public. Could someone just turn on and off when they want to? I am not really asking questions as much as just being confused that this kid has managed to go on three years like this and I have aged 10 years in the past three years. I am so afraid of what will happen to her when I am not here to take care of her. She is in the worst state I have ever seen her…she almost looks like a homeless person except she works.</p>
<p>Try Menningers clinic which I believe is in Texas. Also behavioraltech.org is a source for DBT therapists. Your daughter sounds depressed which is one of the may co-occurring conditions. Sometimes when it rains it pours.</p>
<p>Borderlines are very good at manipulating, and therefore, often have no problems holding down a job.</p>
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</p>
<p>It’s not a matter of turning it on or off. It’s different behaviors in different situations to achieve their end. They are very good at it.</p>
<p>I second the advice above to read “I hate you, don’t leave me.” I have a sister with BPD and after reading that book, I had a much clearer understanding of why she behaves the way she does. And with that knowledge, I was able to do what I needed to do that was best for both of us, which was to complete disengage. My mother has not been able to do that with her, and it continues to be a source of drama and major angst. I would add that all my mother’s attempts have had no effect on my sister whatsoever and that my sister does just fine when out of touch with the family. Realizing that she does fine otherwise is what made me stop trying to ‘help’ her along with the realization that deep inside, she does not want any of our help as she has no inclination or incentive to change.</p>
<p>I was looking for information on a program in Milwaukee that a friend attended for families dealing with BPD in family members. My friend found this invaluable in learning to deal with her D without being excessively jerked around. Didn’t find it, however did find this:</p>
<p>[Borderline</a> Personality Disorder Research/Treatment](<a href=“http://www.palace.net/~llama/psych/programs.html]Borderline”>http://www.palace.net/~llama/psych/programs.html) which lists research and treatment programs. </p>
<p>My sympathies, to all who are dealing with BPD. My sister has it, though I have no clue as to her formal diagnoses. I’m sure there is more than one, and depression has been a big part of her life. However she has held down a job for years, derives great meaning from her work, though is very dysfunctional in other parts of her life. Meds have helped her keep it together. I’d never have predicted her success years ago. </p>
<p>Regarding the turning it off and on, as well as seasonal variation that you see. My impression is that attention being focused on anyone besides the person with BPD makes them insecure, and then events unfold so all eyes are on the borderline. The program my friend attended placed a lot of attention on validating the person with BPD, as it is calms that innate lack of self worth. But as observed above, you may be dealing with more than one diagnosis. My sister turned off her outbursts when with my dad, as he wouldn’t tolerate them. And turned them back on full force when with my long suffering, and understanding mom.</p>
<p>I want to commend you for continuing to look for a solution.</p>
<p>I also want to say that sometimes mental illnesses can’t actually be “fixed.” True mental illness will respond to certain treatments and there may be certain periods which are free from overt issues, but it’s not like something getting fixed. It is chronic and there will be relapses and times when things are better.</p>
<p>For you I would recomend familiarizing yourself with the stages of grieving and loss. I’m very sorry for this situation and I hope you are able to find peace for yourself within all of this, though it is, obviously, very challenging.</p>
<p>again, best wishes for you and your family as you move forward with this. Your frustration with things not being “fixed” might have to be mitigated by an understanding that they might not be completely fixable, which can be very hard to accept and understand.</p>
<p>I second the “Walking on Eggshells” book - it was a lifeline for a friend of mine whose daughter (who is about 17) has this issue. She (meaning the daughter) is currently in a therapeutic boarding school in either Idaho or Montana - not sure which one, but it’s incredibly remote. They were a good family, two older sons, stable home, did everything right - and the daughter just didn’t have any coping skills, began high-risk behaviors. They tried everything, including intensive family counseling. Finally they contracted with the school to, essentially “kidnap” her out of their home, bring her to the airport, and take her to this school. While it’s too soon to tell (the daughter has been there only about 8 months), my understanding is that the daughter is making progress. </p>
<p>Best of luck to you and your family.</p>
<p>Edit: The name of this facility is Turning Winds in Montana.</p>
<p>^^ Your friend’s daughter is probably at Montana Academy. Excellent program.</p>
<p>I’m just wondering about the suggestions above of Turning Winds or Montana Academy because momma-three’s daughter is 20 or 21 I believe (just finished junior year?). Aren’t some of these residential programs for teens?</p>
<p>I honestly don’t know – I’m just passing on what I have heard, which is of course second-hand and limited to what my friend is in the mood to tell me about. They may very well be just for high-school-agers. Even so, I wonder if the people at those places might have suggestions.</p>
<p>I’m not recommending any places as I don’t have any experience with such treatment facilities. But upon some online research, I found some residential treatment facilities to consider exploring. I realize this is not nearly as good as a referral…</p>
<p>[Borderline</a> Personality Disorder Treatment Center - Residential Treatment - Timberline Knolls](<a href=“http://www.timberlineknolls.com/mood-personality/borderline-personality]Borderline”>BPD Treatment Center for Females | Timberline Knolls Residential Rehab)</p>
<p>[McLean</a> Hospital | Patient Care : Adult<a href=“for%20residential%20treatment,%20women%20must%20be%20at%20least%2021”>/url</a></p>
<p>[url=<a href=“http://www.menningerclinic.com/p-hope/index.htm]The”>http://www.menningerclinic.com/p-hope/index.htm]The</a> Hope Adult Program at The Menninger Clinic, Houston, Texas, serves adults ages 18 to mid-60s with psychiatric and psychotic disorders, PTSD, schizophrenia, schizoaffective disorder, mood disorders, manic depression and bipolar disorder, and perso](<a href=“http://www.mclean.harvard.edu/patient/adult/bpd.php]McLean”>Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD) - McLean is here to help.)</p>
<p>[Dialectical</a> Behavior Therapy (DBT) programs at Silver Hill Hospital](<a href=“http://www.silverhillhospital.org/dbt-programs.htm?gclid=CK7T4YPzrJoCFQZqswoddk06cg]Dialectical”>http://www.silverhillhospital.org/dbt-programs.htm?gclid=CK7T4YPzrJoCFQZqswoddk06cg)
[Residential</a> Dialectical Behavior(DBT) programs at Silver Hill Hospital](<a href=“http://www.silverhillhospital.org/dbt-programs-residential.htm]Residential”>Dialectical Behavior Therapy CT | Silver Hill Hospital)</p>
<p>[Lifeskills</a> Of South Florida Residential Treatment, Dialectical Behavioral Therapy, Dual Diagnosis in South Florida](<a href=“http://www.lifeskillssouthflorida.com/]Lifeskills”>http://www.lifeskillssouthflorida.com/)</p>
<p>[Welcome</a> to Meehl](<a href=“http://www.meehlfoundation.org/transitional-residential-group-home-for-bipolar-treatment.html]Welcome”>http://www.meehlfoundation.org/transitional-residential-group-home-for-bipolar-treatment.html)</p>
<p>[Women’s</a> Treatment Center for BPD, Depression, Bipolar, Anxiety & Psychiatric Disorders | Clearview Women’s Center for Emotional Regulation](<a href=“http://www.clearviewwomenscenter.com%5DWomen’s”>http://www.clearviewwomenscenter.com)</p>
<p>[The</a> Angry Heart Therapy Center for BPD](<a href=“http://slshealth.com/angryheart/theangryheartbpdcenter.asp?kp=12002&lp=3&gclid=COqE3q_lgJ0CFQ7Gsgod8GCsbg]The”>http://slshealth.com/angryheart/theangryheartbpdcenter.asp?kp=12002&lp=3&gclid=COqE3q_lgJ0CFQ7Gsgod8GCsbg)</p>
<p>[url=<a href=“http://www.devereux.org/site/PageServer?pagename=ma_dbt]Devereux:”>http://www.devereux.org/site/PageServer?pagename=ma_dbt]Devereux:</a> Girls DBT Program<a href=“maximum%20age%20is%2021”>/url</a></p>
<p>[url=<a href=“http://www.karynhallphd.com%5DWelcome”>http://www.karynhallphd.com]Welcome</a> to KarynHallPhd<a href=“name%20is%20Dialetical%20Behavior%20Therapy%20Center”>/url</a></p>
<p>I will add that in my quick perusal reading, I found out that BPD is typically treated on an outpatient basis and residential treatment is often reserved for those patients who are considered a danger to themselves or others.</p>
<p>Hope this is helpful.</p>
<p>Hugs, momma-three. I remember your previous threads and was hoping no news was good news.</p>
<p>I don’t think it’s a bad idea to ask around and get advice. There is a lot of good advice here, and googling around to see what is out there is usually my first course of action. </p>
<p>I gather she is out of the house, so I hope your family has some semblance of peace. As others have said, Borderline Personality Disorder is typically very tough to treat, and your D has to want to be helped and be committed to her treatment.</p>
<p>She is supporting herself, which is a good thing, and if she won’t step up for treatment, you can continue to offer support, but be sure to stay strong and not let her draw you and your family into the drama or allow her manipulative behavior.</p>
<p>When my son was in high school, there was a stage where if there was something I thought he should consider doing, I knew I could not suggest it because he would dismiss it out of hand. What I would do instead was ask a person he respected to suggest it, and the idea was often embraced. Manipulative on my part, perhaps, but he wasn’t exactly being mature at that point either. So perhaps there’s someone in your D’s life that she might listen to?</p>
<p>Was going t mention McLean- a very well respected hospital (James Taylor was treated there). Everyone is right-- she has to WANT to go and WANT the help. I fear she will resist because she’ll say she will lose her jobs. I am not saying this is a rational argument-- I am just saying it would not be unexpected.</p>
<p>Borderlines are masters at splitting people, meaning getting people to fight against each other over issues related to her. Like when you/your husband disagreed on how to manage her. It is very important that you and your DH get into therapy so that you can do your best to be on the same page and not let her engage in splitting.</p>
<p>^ The good news is that we are on the same page now. We know what she is capable of doing to us and anyone who loves her. You are absolutely right that she is afraid of losing her jobs and has missed several of her regular therapy appointments. I have met with her therapist to fill her in on my daughters behaviors these past couple months which have escalated to scary proportions. She is the greatest manipulator which is by far the scariest aspect of her personality.</p>
<p>Thanks for those sites Soozievt—I will investigate them further. The dialectical therapy seems like the only real way to go. Her Dr recommended a program at the hospital which involves all day treatment but she would go home to have dinner and sleep. I think it is time to investigate a different therapy based on this diagnosis.</p>
<p>Oh, Momma-three - I, too, hoped the situation was improving.</p>
<p>My heart goes out to you. You are doing the best you can. Please take care of yourself, and your relationship with hubby.</p>
<p>I agree about getting support for you and your husband to weather this storm. That TARA organization has a family course which I think runs 8 to 12 weeks and teaches family members how to interact with the BPD patient. Apparently validation is key. We have not attended but interestingly enough I found another mom on CC who is dealing with a BPD daughter and she and her husband have attended. Not sure if this is doable for you but I thought I remember your being somewhere near the city. Anyway, just as with many other diagnoses, your reactions/responses/behavior are of the utmost importance in whether things start to change in your family and with your daughter. I only this past year began to see how much of a part we were playing in enabling my daughter’s problems. I hope you find a path towards a solution. I wouldn’t wish this on anyone.</p>
<p>Here’s an online support group. It looks to be very helpful. [Borderline</a> personality Message board](<a href=“http://www.bpdfamily.com/index2.htm]Borderline”>http://www.bpdfamily.com/index2.htm) I cannot stress enough how important it is to be a unified team and not let the Borderline’s chaos become your chaos. That site has a lot of what look like very good articles. You can’t control her but you can control how you respond to her. This includes modelling healthy behavior for her – asking for and following help and guidance, not lashing out at those who make suggestions that seem to go contrary to your wishes, etc. This is tough sutff. Good luck.</p>