NYC is full of them, young men who work for financial firms (making I assume good money), who are very impressed with themselves, who when they drink get very loud and act like jerks, who go around calling each other ‘dude’ or who often can be obnoxious to any young women in the area and to be honest, also are immature, one step above the stupid things teenage boys can do. Think the wolf of wall Street , maybe not quite that bad, and you got it… there are enough of this type that you can say they are a type. Are all finance guys like this? Traders used to be like this, but these days traders are kind of a shade of what they used to be, algo trading and the rise of the quants has kind of put a damper there :). Quants we all know are geeks, when they aren’t writing the algo trading programs, they are playing with their star wars action figures and playing D and D lol (and obviously, folks, the latter is written totally tongue in cheek…they are into marvel figurines, star wars is passe…)
I think that desired heights and incomes are relative.
For instance, if a person earns $30k/year, they might want someone who earns at least as much as they do or more, because there is not a lot of disposable income there to maintain their current quality of life. If that same person earning $30k/year gets promotions and raises and now earns $100k/year, they might be fine with someone earning $50k/year even though it’s substantially less than their current income, as there is more disposable income to maintain a quality of life.
Similarly, a female who is short (say, 5’1") might not want a partner who is shorter than her, but if that female miraculously grew to 5’10", she might not care if she was dating someone who was 5’7". I suspect that some of the height aspect might be a consideration with respect to whether the man appears to have sufficient physical presence/strength to serve as a deterrent, regardless of whether it is a nature/nurture fed desire. A man shorter than 5’1" might not serve as much of a deterrent whereas a man of 5’7" likely would.
That’s not what the research says:
Women between 5’ and 5’7” think 5’11” is ideal, but women above that height prefer a man to be 6’1”. Conversely, 47% of men between 6’ and 6’3” say the ideal woman is between 5’8 and 5’11”, compared to just 26% of men who are between 5’8” and 5’11” and want a woman in the same range.
But how many of us only think in terms of our “ideal” partner? How many of us fall short of our own ideals? Whether that’s height, weight, athleticism, outside interests, academic pursuits, professional activities, community service, etc? That’s what so much of everyone’s New Year’s resolutions are about; we all far short of our ideal and we try and find a way to get closer. (And note, most New Year’s resolutions don’t make it to February.)
As the blurb of your article indicates, “only a tiny amount of the population fall outside of the ‘comfortable’ range given by either gender.” For very few people will height be a critical factor. Is it more important than the person’s values, how they treat others, how compatible they are as a partner? Most people are looking for a good fit, so if there’s a choice between someone with the ideal height who is a jerk and treats them like garbage and someone who is in the “comfortable” height range who is kind and treats them well, the vast majority of mature people are going to choose the “comfortable” height person over the ideal height one.
Well, the average height of men in the US is 5’9. In the U.K. it’s the same. Prefer what you want, but reality is just that.
The height discussion makes me giggle. My now husband told me early on that I just made his cut-off for a partner’s height. (phew!) He’s 6’4" and I’m 5’5". He preferred women that were within a foot of his height so he wouldn’t have to bend down so far to kiss them 
And now my 6’6" and 6’4" sons say the same.
Everything is relative.
What was your minimum height for male partners?
Stereotypes exist for a reason; there’s always a strong element of truth.
Never had one. Figured I could find their face to kiss no matter.
Exactly. Also, I have found height is sort of moot once you are lying down.
Besides it doesn’t matter all that much what “most women” or “most men” say is their “ideal.” It’s a bit like what we say on CC about colleges: you can only choose one. (I mean unless you are one of these self-proclaimed Alpha Males who makes a point of keeping a couple of mistresses in addition to a wife…)
A 5’3" guy friend of mine from college married a great woman who also happens to be an Ivy grad and filthy rich. She is taller than him and makes much, much more money. They seem very happy.
Looking at my son who is 21 and a senior in college and his roommates and friend group.
The vast majority have girlfriends, have done internships and the ones that have graduated have started careers.
He has other friends that did not go to college and chose other paths, Trades or Fire academy etc that are doing well
Only one friend that I can think of that fits the stereotype, video gamer online friend community mostly, and from what i can see from the outside parents make excuses and enable the lifestyle.
He will be 23 soon so as he gets older it will become harder to get back into the “real World” as someone who graduated during covid and really never reintegrated afterwards.
I saw this essay written by Steve Magness. I think he nails it. He addresses an issue without blaming women and presents some things that might help.
Excellent article.
Interesting that it wasn’t until I was almost done with this that I realized it was written by a running coach who I follow on Instagram.
Thanks for sharing the article. I think the author makes valid observations. I like his 6 suggestions in the addendum.
I have been interested in this topic for some time. Reconceptualizing masculinity to adapt to societal changes will take time and will be difficult. Unlike the messaging/perception from a certain segment (that I agree benefits from the chaos) the goal isn’t to turn men into women.
While the historical “chivalry” aspect of this is an interesting analogy, I’d note that the purpose of knights being chivalrous was to win the heart of the fair maiden 
. It wasn’t a long term career path (although back then life was short anyway).
So I don’t see how ignoring the dearth of romantic relationships is particularly helpful - it feels like displacement activity unless the unspoken point is to suggest that women will be more attracted to and willing to enter into relationships with chivalrous men.
As I mentioned in another thread, it seems some young men may be more interested in having children than young women:
I am all for romantic relationships, but I think women will be more interested if perhaps the men put in more effort. I addressed the men vs. women wanting children issue in the other thread. Guys today who are interested in having children need to step up their involvement and not expect to let a female partner carry most of the load. Not only is this beneficial to the women, it benefits the men and the children.
And following toxic influencers like Rogan is not the way to achieve this.
Toxic? Why? Not your cup of tea evidently.
Masculinity is not toxic. Some individuals are.
It would depend on how you define masculinity…the point of the article.
Does the same hold for femininity? I’m not sure if I’ve read any articles on toxic femininity.