<p>Are not those who mess with tradition simply rebels, when it comes to honoring their husband’s name? The blatant disrespect absolutely disgusts me. Woman need to bless their men in any way they can. If you love 'em up, they usually will do far more than what you did for them.</p>
<p>Most of the women sound so confusing and messed up in this thread. Comments sound so random, illogical, and chaotic. I love the rational stability, strength and structure of men.</p>
<p>I love the rational stability, strength and structure of men.</p>
<p>No fair- you gotta warn people when they are sipping 15 yr old scotch- it * burns* .</p>
<p>But just to show no hard feelings, I was watching a movie tonight you might enjoy.
Very French and very romantic.
La cage aux folles.
I especially recommend the scene invoking John Wayne.</p>
<p>Bet you like John’s swagga!</p>
<p>I’ve heard of couples sitting down and choosing an entirely new surname for the both of them, which sounds like a fun idea if you can come up with something you both like. With some names you could probably do a “blend” of both names that sounds good. (Black + Smith = Blacksmith?)</p>
<p>How about no name? Really. You are so old fashioned if you are remotely interested in fashioning a tangle of letters that have no significance whatsoever. Nomenclature at any level is oh so yesterday. Where are the feminists when I need them?!!</p>
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<p>WOW, now that is a new one!! Yeesh!</p>
<p>What about people (I know this is off topic) who mid-life decide to change their FIRST name? I find I never get used to the new first name, especially if I’ve known them for years with the old first name.</p>
<p>^^^</p>
<p>This happened in high school. A girl named Cathy decided to start going by Bridgett at the beginning of senior year. No one got used to it. Weird!</p>
<p>Back to topic…</p>
<p>So, it looks like that in more recent years/decades the tradition has changed a bit to include: the woman often bringing the subject up first, the couple then talking about it for awhile, the man having to “come around” to the idea, then the man finally picks a time to propose. (and, of course, some variants of that).</p>
<p>I wonder if woman tend to bring the subject up when their bio clocks are ticking and they would prefer to be married while bearing children? And men, who can be clueless about the whole bio clock issue (my H sure was), need to be reminded? </p>
<p>Rutgers did a multi-year study, I think it was called The Marriage Project, and what bothered me was how some men were quoted as saying that they didn’t care that a girlfriend’s bio clock was ticking because that was “her problem.” I guess these men felt that they would delay marriage as long as they could, and if their present girlfriends were then too old to have kids, they would be discarded for younger models. That bothered me.</p>
<p>Whether women keep their names depends on lots of things, including culture (Chinese women always do, according to my daughter’s Chinese friends), the sounds or spellings of the names, and when you get married.</p>
<p>I got married two days after graduating from college. I had not yet accomplished anything professionally, and I didn’t like my maiden name because it had an apostrophe in it, and I was tired of always having to ask people how to put my name on forms properly. So I took my husband’s name. If my husband and I were to get divorced, I would probably keep his name, because I have had it most of my life and all my professional history is in that name (and I still don’t like the apostrophe). </p>
<p>But many of my friends married later, when they already had considerable accomplishments (such as scientific publications) in their maiden names. They do not use their married names professionally, and some don’t use their husbands’ names at all.</p>
<p>My mother was married three times and divorced three times. During each marriage, she took her husband’s name. But after her divorces, she always reverted to her first husband’s name because that was the last name her children had, and it seemed easier for her to use that last name as well.</p>
<p>As for children’s names, I think they should have their father’s last name, even if the woman herself does not use that name. This is the way in which a woman announces to the world that this man is the father of her child.</p>
<p>Is the point that genders are the same? They are not the same, thanks goodness and it makes both of them stronger. Is that important who poposes to whom and what names are kept. These are not laws, everybody is doing what they feel like for their personal reasons or without, just because they feel like it at the moment.</p>
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<p>I’ve been thinking about the “Why buy the cow when you get the milk for free?” (the “milk” typically refering to sex.) All I can say is if the only reason your guy wants to commit to a lifetime together is for some hot under-the-covers action . . . then your relationship has some much deeper problems than getting married vs not.</p>
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As for children’s names, I think they should have their father’s last name, even if the woman herself does not use that name. This is the way in which a woman announces to the world that this man is the father of her child.*</p>
<p>I do like it when children’s last names match their parents. Whether the family decides to use his name or her name, I don’t care. But, I do like it when the whole family has the same last name. To me, it just sounds odd to have 3-4 members using one name and one person using another. </p>
<p>And, yes, it does kind of announce to the world, that this child is the child of this man. </p>
<p>I’ve been thinking about the “Why buy the cow when you get the milk for free?” (the “milk” typically refering to sex.) All I can say is if the only reason your guy wants to commit to a lifetime together is for some hot under-the-covers action </p>
<p>I don’t think that is what Atomom is suggesting at ALL. I think what she’s saying is that if two people have enough in common that they could have a happy marriage, the man may still not feel motivated to marry if he’s not really gaining anything by doing so. Men can be very “status quo” kind of people…they sometimes need a motivation to make a big change. </p>
<p>My theory is this…if a man and a woman believe that they are “right for each other”, then he will much more likely propose in a timely manner if they weren’t having sex.</p>
<p>My parents were virgins when they married. My dad proposed after 5 months, and they married several months later. Obviously, he had a bit of a “motivation” not to delay proposing…LOL</p>
<p>They’ve been married for 56 years. :)</p>
<p>I was impressed–some 30 years ago–when my friends made up a new last name for themselves. Think of the movie, The Fockers, and his name was along that line. Her last name and his middle name were almost identical, so new name born. No doubt their children appreciated the change.</p>
<p>It seems I’m the only poster who gave my son my name. My FA’s name has Biblical roots, and my parents were critical in raising my son. I chose to honor the grandparents rather than the nonsupportive, bio-FA.</p>
<p>JHS–never stop posting. You are a wealth of info and humor.</p>
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<p>It may not have been what she meant, but that is what the “milk for free” quote originally meant.</p>
<p>Maybe what she meant is that if a couple is already living happily together, they aren’t as anxious to get married. I can agree with that.</p>
<p>BTW, I disagree with the feeling in this discussion that men have to be “convinced” or “coerced” into marriage. Yes, there are some men who would rather gnaw off their arms rather than get married, but in most of the young couples I know, the man is excited to be able to spend the rest of his life with a “cool” girl he not only loves, but is also friends with. When marriage doesn’t come on the horizon, it’s usually because NEITHER the man nor the woman feel the need for it, not because the woman wants it and the man is “dragging his feet.”</p>
<p>I have the feeling this difference (from “convince the man to get married”) is a generational thing.</p>
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<p>LOL . . . When people have names like that, I always wonder why they haven’t already changed them–for their own sake!!</p>
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<p>I think women should do what makes them comfortable and happy, regardless of whether it seems old fashioned or trendy.</p>
<p>I took my husband’s name because I knew we were going to be a family at some point. We wanted our family to all have the same last name, basically as a symbol of unity. His name was easier to say and spell than my last name. I don’t know what my daughters will do someday if they marry and have children. That will be up to them.</p>
<p>The hyphenating of names only works for a generation or two; then you’ve got what, 20 last names?</p>
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I believe that a man who is reluctant to propose marriage is a man who is not in love. Why waste years and years living with a man who does not love you? </p>
<p>I once worked with a man whose last name was Smith and his wife’s name was Johnson. When they got married they both took the name Smith-Johnson.</p>
<p>It’s hard to let any discussion of unfortunate names and odd naming configurations pass without referring to the following:</p>
<p>I had classmates at college named Timber Dick (actually, Timber Dick IV) and Richard Swett, who went by Dick. They were among the few Mormons in our class, and were friends. They were both perversely proud of their names, and had learned early how to take a teasing and hold their heads up. Tim (who died recently in a car crash) and Dick married sisters, both daughters of Silicon Valley Congressman Tom Lantos. Swett was a U.S. Representative from New Hampshire, and later an ambassador. Tim and his wife had 10 kids, none of them named Timber. Tim’s wife (but not her sister) had used her mother’s name as her last name, and she and the kids all use the name Tilleman-Dick.</p>
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<p>Not necessarily. A man can be in love, yet not feel ready to totally commit to a woman. I know a woman who was dating a man and was just certain he was the “one.” He kept telling her he loved her, but wasn’t ready for marriage. He had a job loading soft drinks onto a truck, but had dreams of being a famous singer. They got engaged, but he kept stalling.</p>
<p>I think they may have broken up a time or two between all of the fall starts. Eventually, though, they did marry. He did indeed become the lead singer for a very successful band. He writes some beautiful love songs for his wife; if you listen to Country and Western, you will have heard some of them. He writes lovely, emotional tributes to his wife on their CD covers. They now have 3 children, an incredible home and property near Nashville, and appear to be quite happy and committed.</p>
<p>Some guys just need a little time to be ready to marry the woman they love.</p>
<p>True Nrdsb4, but I’m really talking about the couple who have lived together for “years and years” and there is no financial or career or any other reason for them not to marry, just the guy saying I’m not ready to commit. That to me translates as “I like you, and it’s ok living with you and all, but I’m waiting to see if someone else might come along who I like better.”</p>