See, to me, this is a classic teenager freakout about “stuff” getting real. He’s super stressing about it, and you are a very convenient target. He knows he can blat at you and nothing really terrible will happen.
If it were me, I wouldn’t bring it up again unless he did, and if he did, I’d go with the great advice you’ve received above-tell him that until everything’s in, that there’s no sense in making decisions. And then try your best not to talk about it. I’ve found the dog has a willing ear to every college comment I can’t make to the kids or the hubby…
@MotherOfDragons Bingo. Actually he is pretty positive this morning. We made it clear last night this was one piece of the puzzle.
As far as his uncle is concerned, to those who made a point of mentioning him, he is a practicing expert in the field, NY Times, Denver Post, Associated Press, so everyone in the family respects his opinion, and he conveyed it objectively.
Yes but the uncle’s narrower focus on journalism may or may not fit in April. So just leave some room for your son to change his mind about this major, or allow him to consider schools he loves that have lesser or even no journalism programs, because there are many paths to that career. I think location, size, academics and “vibe” are all important (and cost, for many of us) and your son should look a several factors. Gut reactions can be very valid.
Did the uncle himself get a degree in journalism? Such career oriented majors weren’t as common back in the dark age of the 70’s for instance : )
I would be concerned that your son may ultimately need to make a tough decision, and might be too timid to “cross” your uncle’s opinions. Your son might feel more comfortable at a “lesser” journalism school, but could feel conflicted and unable to choose somewhere that doesn’t hold up to his uncle’s opinions.
Please, please in your conversations give him permission to make his own choice for college. “Although it is great that we have Uncle John to give us his professional opinion, it isn’t Uncle John that has to attend this college for 4 years. This is YOUR journey, and we want you to feel comfortable making the choice that works best for you.”
Has Uncle John visited all these campuses with your son? Has Uncle John sat in on classes with the professors? Has Uncle John spent the night in a dorm recently? Has he hung out in the school cafeteria to people watch and get a feel for the types of students who attend there? What is Uncle John able to contribute besides a general feel for the REPUTATION of a journalism dept? If your son is miserable with the rest of the general education classes, hates his dorm situation, and can’t stand the extreme weather/distance from home/urban vs rural location etc, how will he be able to thrive in his journalism degree?
Making the decision on where to attend college is one of the first major decisions a high school student makes. There is already so much pressure from peers, family, teachers, etc. And pressure the student adds on to himself. Imagine if you are 17 or 18 and trying to form such a decision, and you have this “expert” telling you where you should go. How dare you question this man…he has journalism credentials!! He knows best. How in the world can a young person have the courage to spit in Uncle John’s face and choose other than Uncle John’s first choice?
I know you find comfort in your BIL’s opinions. And it is great that BIL has helped to shape the list of colleges to apply to. Please, please push BIL to the side now. Let your son take center stage. Let your son feel confident enough to choose what works for him, not what your BIL thinks will work best.
His uncle went to NYU for his masters in Journalism. He approached giving his recommendation based on an insider’s view of preparation, not what a lay person would think.
This school’s students have won 20% of the awards given by a California Foundation for excellence in writing. That is pretty impressive given it is clear across the country and the school in second place has won half as many awards.
We told our kids that we had A specific amount of money we could contribute toward their 4 year education. For some schools the amount would cover all costs and for others it is not enough. We then ran spread sheets on all of his choices showing costs for 4 years with an assumption of 5% tuition increases at the schools that did not lock in tuition. We then sat down and discussed. We told them the could go to any school they choose but anything over that amount was on them. With University of Missouri we ran the spread as 4 years out of state or as establishing residency after one year which is not too difficult to do. We also ran spreads with the merit scholarships and what the cost would be if scholarships were lost. It was a great exercise for us and them. Made them think about the costs and what ultimately it might cost them.
It is great that you have a family resource in terms of helping select the programs…but unless he is paying the bills…that is where it should end…advice only.
There are some excellent journalism programs. Here where I live, the program at Syracuse is extremely highly regarded. St. Bonnie’s is not on the same league at all. But whatever.
As long as your son is happy with his eventual matriculation decision, that is what matters. Fact is…the vast majority of college students change majors multiple times while in college.
And your son might go the masters route too. Solid journalists, the best of them, have deep backgrounds in the fields they analyze and write about. Not simply journalism classes, the name on the diploma, and some experience on the school paper. They aren’t simply observers and recorders.
The uncle may be looking at this from such an adult, professional perspective, which other journalists he respects went to what schools, what profs he may have met.
In contrast, your son isn’t even at bat yet. No one is ready to hire him, his resume seems to be about the high school world. Let him have the chance to grow (as an individual) and test himself in the right environment for him and build some subject expertise. It seems he will have choices.
Then maybe uncle can get him internships and work.
For certain fields, I think that one should be very cautious about accepting insiders’ views of preparation for careers, because those fields are in the midst of such dynamic and unsettling change. I’ll use my undergrad and professional areas as examples: journalism and law. I like the New York Times, but who knows if it will exist in 10 years? And my advice to anyone considering law school is don’t go, unless the person will incur zero debt or will be attending a top 5 or 10 school and knows for sure that he or she will be in the top 10 percent of the class. I love journalism and law, but people considering going into them need the advice of brutally honest individuals who are aware of what works now, not what worked 15 or 20 years ago.
I have attorneys and journalists in my family, and I tend to agree with @rosered55 . Both areas are experiencing some fundamental changes, and not for the better, in many cases. I don’t know if I would advise against majoring in either law or journalism, but the career satisfaction in both of those fields has changed substantially in the past few years.
The uncle will be a good connection, though. That’s where the true value is going to lie for the kid if he becomes a journalist. However, it’s also got to be hard on him having the 800 lb Pulitzer prizewinning gorilla’s shoes to fill. That’s one tall shadow.
I think @rosered55 is spot-on. And I’m married to a career journalist and have a BIL who’s an attorney. But I believe that thought process could apply to any field. Today’s journalism grads won’t have the earning power to pay off big debt from NYU, Northwestern, or the like.
I will amend my comment, because I realize I misspoke: insiders who look at their fields clearly and honestly and aren’t wearing blinders can be good sources of advice; insiders who say “this is what worked for me 20 years ago and so this is what you should do, too” are probably less reliable. I am a lawyer; I am well aware of the very high unemployment rate for new lawyers and the crushing debt many of them have incurred. And it doesn’t take being an insider to see what is happening to journalism. (Although I do think the New York Times will probably be around in 10 years, but with how many paid staff? who knows.)
OP, among those of us responding, we don’t just go by rankings or what anyone else thinks is a better program. We’ve learned our kids can be inspired and propelled in different ways and by different opportunities. Some need to be a small fish in a big pond, to be inspired and stretch, some need a more challenging program itself, to be pulled to meet those higher standards. Some need to be the big fish in a littler pond. And some are plain old stifled by being the big fish and then working with a limited range of others and their capabilities.
You need to look at more than rep: the actual opportunities during the four years. And that’s not just who thinks what of some program. This is about your kid’s match.
Former journalist here. I find St. B an odd choice but whatever.
This is for those who aren’t quite at this point in the search, learn from this poster … 1) Have the money talk up front. 2) Don’t set a dollar amount and then object when your student finds a school that fits that parameter but you want him/her to take a cheaper option. In fact, better to not set a dollar amount at all if you are going to change the playing field when a cheaper alternative comes in. Say to your kid, “We can afford UP TO $XXXX, but let’s look at all your options when the numbers come in and make a choice as a family.”
So how would this group of very helpful parents explain the fact that out of about 30 “top” journalism schools invited by this California Foundation, 12 of the 60, awards have gone to students of this school. USC is second with 6 Awards. Clearly, the school has writing chops.
What am I basing my info on? Employable folks. Around here (New England) the Syracuse program is highly regarded in journalism. Sorry…but I think being actually hired for a job is more important than the US News rankings…or awards students receive.
I agree with @rosered55 also. The field of journalism has changed exponentially. Print journalism, in particular, has undergone a huge change in the last 20 years. But broadcast journalism has changed as well.
The OP mentions writing, which makes me think that print journalism is what this student is interested in pursuing. The jobs in print journalism have decreased a lot with the huge closings of print newspapers country wide…as well as news magazines that no longer exist.
And the remaining jobs don’t exactly pay a huge amount. And in addition, a lot of part timers are used by many newspapers.
I agree that the uncle might be a helpful resource in targeting good internships (hopefully paid ones) when the time comes.
I don’t know anything about the California Foundation. I’ve never heard of it. Can you provide a link?
But, knowing nothing about it, I’ll answer with a story … We have a local science fair competition. Most awards are won by one HS. If I were to look at only this one competition, I might say, “I have a science-minded kid. I want her to go to THAT school because of its apparently strong science program.” But the school my kids did attend didn’t even compete in that particular contest and so, nope, didn’t win. The kids at their school were doing Intel, which, trust me, is a more rigorous contest than the local competition. So, my only response, not knowing the California Foundation, is … Is that really the best measure of a program?
My DS was recently offered a full tuition scholarship. When we crafted his college list, I purposefully had him include schools where he might receive large merit awards as our income makes us close to full pay at all schools. He really wants to attend college on the East Coast and get out of TX for a while.
My DS was very flattered and somewhat shocked to receive the full tuition offer. He thinks this school and its location would provide him great opportunities, But I’m going to be cautious about over talking this scholarship and will wait patiently until we have all of the results. We will need to weigh COA, fit, GPA requirements, potential tuition increases, flexibility of programs, etc.
My advice is to just drop the subject for now and enjoy the holidays. Congrats to your son for receiving a large scholarship!
OP, I hear ya. Since I have a better concept of money than my 17-year-old, I have a lot more joy over big-time money being handed over. I think my D’s reaction can be summed-up as “I don’t care to belong to any club that will have me as a member.” Sigh. I believe it will all work out in the end, but the journey isn’t always pleasant.