Most students Apply to 4 or fewer schools

Parents Forum
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<p>I wrote about this today on my personal website — can’t paste it here in full as it is copyrighted material, but wanted to share one highlight that might suprise some here in the land of high stakes admissions hysteria:</p>

<p>73.9% of incoming freshmen applied to 4 or fewer colleges last year. Yet, 69.8 report that they are currently attending their first choice school, with 21.2% reporting they are at their second choice school.</p>

<p>The source is the annual National Freshman Survey, conducted annually by the Cooperative Institutional Research Project conducted by the Higher Education Research Institute (HERI) at UCLA. This year, over 263,000 incoming freshmen were surveyed. </p>

<p>Food for thought: If your child has a well-targeted list that includes at least one solid safe bet, there’s no need to apply to 12+ colleges, nor worry excessively that they won’t get into a college they like. In fact, chances are that if they have a well-targeted list, they’ll be going to their first choice school next year. Some may say that it is different for kids aiming at elite schools — but I stick to my guns on this one: If your child has a WELL-TARGETED list that includes AT LEAST ONE solid safe bet that ranks high in their minds, they have a solid foundation and there is no need for excessive panic.</p>

<p>Source: <a href=“http://www.gseis.ucla.edu/heri/norms05.html[/url]”>www.gseis.ucla.edu/heri/norms05.html</a></p>

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The other 9% applied to HYP.;)</p>

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<p>Again great advice from Carolyn :slight_smile:
My D applied to 4 schools- senior year- was accepted to all.
Took a year off- reapplied next year and added a financial & academic reach just for the heck of it- because she really liked it.
didn’t dare to hope that she would get in- but she would have been happy with her 2nd choice.
She will be graduating this spring from her top choice school, & I believe because she was focused enough to have realistic and appropriate choices, that it made a difference.
It could also just mean that she has excellent karma.</p>

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<p>I am relieved to read this. It’s so easy to get caught up in the hype. My daughter’s school limits each student to seven applications. I’m thinking that this is more than enough if the list is chosen carefully!</p>

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<p>I would keep the ever increasing popularity of Early Decision in mind when looking at those stats! S only applied to 3 schools(2 were rolling admissions and one was his ED choice), but would have applied to more had he been deferred or rejected from his ED school.</p>

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<p>Carolyn, I think for those not fighting the Merit Wars your advice is on target but I would never advise those dependent on school specific, extremely limited in number, competitive merit scholarships to apply to only seven schools. Of the six schools she has listed on the acceptance thread, none of them would be affordable without at least $15k-$25K a year in merit aid. As such she applied to schools where that number was likely, and greater numbers were possible. </p>

<p>My kid’s decision to apply to 14 :eek: is admittedly excessive, but that’s because she wanted the pleasure of getting rejected from 3 need-only schools and one program that takes 10 kids a year, too. LOL. For those engaged in the same egg hunt we are in, 10 is a realistic number of apps if those ten schools and their scholarship opportunities are incredibly well researched.</p>

<p>So far, the plan is unfolding perfectly. (Where is some wood to knock-on? And where is my salt shaker? Voodoo Headress?)</p>

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<p>I <em>think</em> my D got in to her #2 school. We’ve never really talked about what choice she would have made if she had gotten into her EA school. But the most relevant mini-stat is that she’s extremely happy where she is and wouldn’t trade for anywhere else.</p>

<p>MacNYC, my D applied to seven as well, but I think her list met Carolyn’s criteria of well-targeted, both in terms of specific qualities and in terms of One Safety, Three Reaches, Three Matches. Best thing that ever happened to her may have been not getting into any of her Reaches.</p>

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<p>We were prepared to launch a dozen apps, but after one rolling admit and 2 EA admits, all from the top of the list, we were done! :slight_smile: Now for S#2…</p>

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<p>This FULLY explains why the FAFSA has space for only 6 schools. MOST students only need that many slots.</p>

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<p>My D whittled her list down to four, with no ED/EA.</p>

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<p>Aspiring performing arts majors also have to play the numbers game. With 90% or more of their admission decision hanging on a 10 - 15 minute audition, even “safety” schools are not a very safe bet. Daughter wound up applying to six, but we had four more ready to go had she not been accepted to #2 fairly early in the process.</p>

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<p>I only applied to two schools - got accepted to both - and went to my first choice.</p>

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<p>Carolyn, this is a helpful link, which keeps the admissions process in persepective. For most kids, 4 schools should be sufficient. But I agree with Curmudgeon that if a student is either seeking a significant merit award or applying to the most selective reach schools, 4 is probably not enough. But a carefully thought out list should cover all bases. I also wonder if there is a geographic element here? We live in the northeast where most kids seem to apply to a lot more than 4 schools. Of course, many of these kids would like to stay in the northeast, which has some of the most competitive colleges in the country, so that may have something to do with it.</p>

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<p>As usual Carolyn is a teeasure trove of information. People who reside here are exposed to a very nontypical community of families and as a result get a very unusual view of the college admission process. Most families, including mine, have progeny attending hs’s where 30-50% attend the local community college and a majority of the remainder choose to attend one of the in-state public colleges and universities.</p>

<p>Like Crudge’s daughter, our son was on an exploration to search out mucho merit aid. Fortunately he was able to keep his application to 6 or 7. He successfully negotiated the jungles of the process and, with one exception(Obie), bagged merit aid ranging from $15k/yr to $25k/yr. Crudge, at 14 apps I hope your dear daughter took advantage of the Common Application a number of times!!</p>

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<p>Agreeing with the above, I would guess the reality is that saying that 73.9% apply to “4 or fewer colleges” is itself a bit misleading because the majority or more of those are probably applying to only 1 or 2 schools. From high schools in our area, including those considered among your better state schools, the general consensus is that the vast majority of graduates going to a 4 year college are going to a state university and most of the rest to a private university in-state. Annually, certain newspapers here publish where valedictorians, salutatorians are headed to college and the list is interesting to see for the lack of any or very few going out-of-state to any eastern or western US high ranked college, and the choices of colleges, though including UIUC, Northwestern, and University of Chicago (your three Illinois heavy weights), always include places like Loyola Chicago, Illinois State, DePaul, Knox, and other in-state, and when out-of-state the most mentioned one is often Wisconsin.</p>

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<p>A finaid person at a university (personal friend) said this IS a regional thing. Students from the northeast AND students from California tend to apply to more than 6 schools, in her experience. Students from other parts of the country, on average, tend to apply to less. I asked this when DS (Bassdad, he’s the music performer) had 7 schools and I was dealing with the 6 school FAFSA limit. She candidly said that the vast majority of college students apply to less than 6 schools. In the NE where many top students are looking at private schools, the number is higher. Keep in mind also that some of these states in the NE have a flagship University, and some state colleges, that were former teacher’s colleges. Not saying these are bad, but they certainly don’t measure up to the quality public universities found in the midwest, CA (the reason many CA kids apply to multiples is there is apparently one ap for the UC system for multiple schools), or even in places like FL where there are things like Bright Scholars to assist state residents with college expenses. I’m sorry to say, the New England students’ public college choices have taken a back seat to the growth and development, and status, of the privates in the region (not just the Ivies, but also schools like Bates, Amherst, Williams, Tufts, BC, BU, etc). It’s an expensive place to go to college if you don’t happen to want to go to the flagship U in your state.</p>

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<p>I could not disagree with this more!!! </p>

<p>Those applying to 4 or fewer schools are likely applying to local schools with low to moderate selectivity. Plus you have to factor in the ED/EA applicants into this number.</p>

<p>Carolyn assumes with a well targeted list of a few schools one will likely find the right fit, be happy, and save themselves the “stress” of applying to many schools. I can assure you the stress is well worth it. </p>

<p>1) Remember at the top level the schools are choosing you, not the other way around. With admissions rates of 10-20% for the top schools, you need to apply to multiple schools even with perfect stats! Long gone are the days when a certain SAT score and GPA meant admission at certain schools.
2) Top schools have much more in common with each other than with other schools - most importantly the caliber of the students. I loved Dartmouth, but would much rather attend Columbia (the opposite in many ways) over a place like Ohio University simply because a great part of the college experience is the quality of students you are around. Not to mention the grad placement, job opportunities, etc.
3) The ability to negotiate financial aid offers. With tuition costing as much as it does, for those needing aid the savings in cost coming from the ability to compare offers is often ten times the short term savings in application fees.
4) Its hard to know a school until “days on campus” after you are admitted, tours are rarely enough. Having choices at this stage is critical. You can read all the guidebooks you want, but until you spend a night on campus you won’t know what you really want. For those applying ED, most have spent some time (a weekend or day) at these schools.
5) With the Internet and common application it is much easier to apply to multiple schools with not much additional effort.
6) The admissions difficulty of schools is perhaps a step funtion with different buckets, but there are many more buckets than four to six. If you only apply to four schools and get unlucky with your third school you are in trouble. I don’t think most top kids would be happy at any “safety.”
7) If protecting your child from stress is the critical point here, ever consider how stressful it might be for them to end up at a place where they feel they could have done better than? </p>

<p>Here’s an anecdotal story.</p>

<p>My roommate (valedictorian of his high school) applied to Princeton, Amherst, Colby, Middlebury, and Skidmore, fully expecting to get into Amherst. Well, he didn’t get into Amherst or Princeton, and then the Middlebury rejection came. He thought he had done his research and found schools that fit him. When he visted Colby for acceptance weekend and all the other kids had choices, he felt like he had sold himself short. He hated Colby and felt like he wasn’t being challenged. Luckily he got a 4.0, applyed to a bunch of schools as a transfer (Cornell, Brown, Dartmouth, Penn, Amherst). He ended up choosing Dartmouth, a school he hadn’t even considered initially. He loved Dartmouth. </p>

<p>Yup, applying to schools takes work. Suck it up. If you don’t want to put in a couple extra weekends of work to send in a few extra applications be warned, the next four years could be affected by your decision. Not to mention that these are potentially some of the best four years of your life. I think your advice is meant to be helpful but I equate it to overfeeding your dog out of kindness.</p>

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Thanks for the info and the stats certainly make sence … the vast majority of kids going to college want to go to a school near home whose admissions are not ultra-competitive. </p>

<p>I disagree where you stuck to your guns … for kids targeting schools with very low admit rates having a very short list of schools (4 schools) greatly increases the odds that they do not get into any of the tough to get into schools (very similar to Crumudegons concerns for those shooting for merit aid) … I’ll seldom buy a strategy of few applicantions where the focus in on low percentage applications (not low because of the student but low because it’s low for everyone even if the app is well targeted).</p>

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<p>In sum: Following Carolyn’s advice is a sure-fire way to risk ending up at your safety.</p>

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<p>I remember having the jitters when my D applied to only one private ( not an HYPD or 7 sisters type ) college with it on the top of FAFSA , followed by three state "safeties " but the private match or did better than the State offered in financial aid and we have no regrets .</p>