<p>I have read this thread, mostly in its entirety, and have a different take. The OP came on here to ask a legal question. Yes, he has a traumatic past (no matter what his relationship was with his father, his father died just as he was in the midst of a huge transition period in his life), and he vented, but his original intention was that he wanted some sort of assurance that this was one more worry he could take off his list, that his mother could sue him and successfully win. I think he provided background on his mother in order to give us a clear picture of her past behavior, not because he expected anyone here to throw him a pity party. But yes, many posters answered his questions regarding possible legal implications. </p>
<p>I think the OP has shown that, in the midst of adversity, he has risen to the occasion, and is capable of being responsible for himself. I think any young twenty-something who was faced with a possible lawsuit from a parent would panic, no matter how self-sufficient they are. </p>
<p>I have quite the complicated dental history myself and I was lucky enough to have parents who did their best to make sure I was treated properly as a child/teenager (I have a cleft palate). However, despite braces three times on my upper teeth, I will always have issues with my mouth that can be tied directly to my birth defect. You can bet that every time I go to the dentist (even for routine cleanings), the thought still crosses my mind, “I wonder what it’s like for people who don’t have the problems I do, to go to the dentist,” at age 50. It is part of who I am and what I will always have to deal with. I suspect that the OP might be grieving in the same sort of way; what would it have been like had I had parents who put my health needs above their own pleasures? Hopefully once he takes care of the cavities and wisdom teeth (this stuff takes time to schedule) he won’t have any lingering issues that can’t be addressed, but one thing I’ve learned over time is that oral issues can have a domino effect. Yes, even something as simple as wisdom teeth.</p>
<p>He’s faced a lot of adversity and trauma in his life and just wanted reassurance that this was one less crisis he needed to worry about. Let him grieve the losses he has. It doesn’t seem to have made him stuck in life as he has accomplished so much.</p>
<p>lookingforward - exactly what constitutes baby steps here? Given he basically had no emotional support, much less financial support from his parents, I would not define his success as baby steps. He is fully self-sufficient at a very young age in a very tough market. He is not using this crisis as an opportunity to sit back and do nothing. He is seeking out resources and is not stuck.</p>
<p>oldfort: That is my most chilling fear – I want very badly to raise a proper family someday and I worry that these issues are going to hold me back from being well-equipped to start one when the time comes. I don’t want to bring kids into this world unless I’ve figured out how to cope with my past, nor would I want to if I would be unable to afford to give them what they deserve.</p>
<p>teriwtt: Thanks for that. I did not start this thread with the intent on making it a pity party (it just starts to come across that way because many of these issues are financially and emotionally intertwined, perhaps). Regarding your experience though, how did you find you were able to move on, if possible?</p>
<p>Legally, there is no claim. Parents have a legal obligation to provide basic needs for their children, and that obligation is not contingent on the child’s behavior (absent a petition to family court to have the child declared “incorrigible,” which would require more than simply showing that the child was ungrateful).</p>
<p>As for the alleged “loan” of $85k, based on these facts any court would see the mother’s payments as a gift, or “nudum pactum,” that did not carry an obligation to repay, even if the money was spent on non-necessities, or was provided to an adult child.</p>
<p>LOM - please do not confuse having money with success at bringing kids into the world. H and I started our family when he was still working on his Ph.D. and we lived way below poverty level. But they had what they needed, parents who loved them and spent quality time with them, as well as adequate food and shelter and good health care. Our first few places were so small that we had no room for all the bells and whistles that many infants, toddlers and preschoolers have these days when their parents wait until they have the money to provide. And if I can say so, our kids turned out pretty well. </p>
<p>As long as you love a kid, want to spend time with them (sometimes I think our lack of the ‘big’ toys was a benefit to our kids - books were small - so we always had lots of them - and always provided lots of parent/child time so they were reading pretty proficiently by age 4) and can provide adequate health care and food, what else do they need? Yes, other things are nice, but plenty of kids thrive in life as long as they have the basic necessities and are loved.</p>
<p>LOM, an old boyfriend of mine was in much the same situation as yours. The family had money to do things, but spent it on luxuries while he went without proper clothing, shoes, medical care … and his father took his flavor-of-the-week girlfriend on round the world cruises, bought her diamonds and furs while not giving his son anything towards the top 20 college that he was able to get into. He worked his butt off to stay there, much as you did at Penn, against often insurmountable odds. I have a lot of sympathy for you, I think it’s admirable you’re opening up even to us, a message board society, and I concur that BOTW is not showing a lot of charity towards a difficult situation. You can’t just say man up and expect things to change. It’s a long, difficult process. Best of luck to you.</p>
<p>Sounds like you are moving forward on taking care of your dental needs, and we are all proud of you. Also glad to hear that you and your mother are at a place where the immediate conflict has abated and there is no imminent threat fromher to worry about. It is truly sad that you do not have the hind of parent-child relationship that you have every right to want. But for whatever reason,she is clearly not capable of offering that to you, at least not at the present time. She is who and what she is. Accepting her limitations is part of your process in healing your emotional scars. We are all rooting for you.</p>
<p>Jym, that’s an interesting article about medical credit cards. I (and one other) did mention Care Credit. Had no problems with it and it worked as it was supposed to-paid everything off before I knew any interest would start kicking in. Of course, I was dealing with a reputable, well established dental practice who mentioned it as a possibility in paying for crowns not covered by my insurance. No interest for about 18 months as opposed to having to pay interest right away if I used my regular credit card.The terms and conditions were clearly outlined . Like any credit card, you have to clearly look at the percentage rates, payment terms,etc. A card like this is clearly not for everyone. Like using/purchasing anything ,it is always buyer beware.</p>
<p>Worked his butt off at a top 20 school, incurring lots of debt in the process, but always proud of himself that he had done so versus go to his state school (not particularly renowned in his particular field of expertise). Went on to gainful employment, got his MBA (probably paid for by his firm, but this was also in the 1990’s), married, 2 kids, vowed he’d never do that to his kids, doesn’t have a lot of ties to his family. Currently has a college freshman and a high schooler.</p>
<p>I don’t think you need to worry YET, though, about wanting to build a family and what your background means. You’re young, you have plenty of time to work that through.</p>
<p>Thanks, sevmom. At one time my office associate and I had considered suggesting the medical credit cards to potential clients who wanted evaluations but were unable to afford the cost. Most doctors offices really can’t take on the role of being a loan agency/creditor (which is what happens if someone is paying small payments over time) and, more importantly, there was (is??) something called the “Red Flag Rule” that the government was telling doctors offices that if they did take on the role as “creditor” they were potentially subject to compliance with federal banking regulations. It all sounded scary and complicated to me, so we were looking into ways to help patients explore other resources for them. It did not look like those credit cards covered our services (apparently the brochures we saw showed limited kinds of medical services) so we dint lookany further.</p>
<p>Max, since you have asked about how people got from nothing to more financially secure, I will volunteer a bit of my past. I graduated from grad school with loans and not much more. I was lucky and had a job waiting for me which paid fairly well. After rent, loans, taxes etc. I had some money left over, but at first it was not too much. One thing I have always done is save something from each paycheck. I put it in an account and never (and I mean never) touch it, until it is ready for the goal (i.e. downpayment on a house/apt. etc.). You don’t raid it one month due to an “emergency” and later think you will pay yourself back. When I could put money in a 401K, I put that in too. That is harder to get to in terms of the legal restrictions on withdrawal. Without salary increases due to promotions, I probably would have had to continue to live quite frugally, but when you are young, opportunities to move up can be found in time. I paid for all my loans, and I supported myself completely. It is many years since I was a newly minted wage earner, and it took a long time to save up for the first down payment. My first real estate investment was a bust (RE crashed and I did loose most of the downpayment), but that was also one of life’s lessons.</p>
<p>On the other hand, some young people that I know, spend every penny, and I think however much they make it will never be enough. As an example, my H and I kind of agonized over buying a flat screen tv recently, when we had one of those old heavy square tube tv sets that still worked. We bought one, but not top of the line. We went to see our young friends, who always complain that they are broke, and though newly married they had a better tv than we had. Along with that they had designer dishes, luggage, and big diamonds. Well no wonder they were broke (and their parents can never give them enough to satisfy them). They also had “real” furniture (not Ikea or pottery barn). I don’t think they will ever save a penny. Oh, and I don’t think they are current on the student loans either. I do not admire this type of lifestyle.</p>
<p>jym626, For me, I really just used it for convenience. Could have paid cash or used another credit card with interest but when I was told I could have thousands of dollars of work done with no interest for at least a year and a half, I decided to go ahead and do that(when I was told how much things would cost, I kind of said,wow,that’s alot money,more than I expected-that’s how the subject came up about Care Credit from the office staff).It was a big help to be able to go ahead and have lots of work done without worrying about the interest. I use credit cards really for convenience-we always pay off charges every month. This kind of thing may be less appealing to someone who may be worried about being able to pay off the bill before interest kicks in. Max has a good income so thought maybe it would work for him if he was careful about paying off the bill before interest came into play. It seems though now that we know he has good insurance or is possibly going to use a dental school, he probably will not need to use a credit card.Like anything, he or anyone else should do their due diligence when considering any kind of credit card. I think the article you site is important since it does point out how cautious we all need to be about these kinds of things.Good luck to Max with finding a way to get this dental work done as soon as possible!</p>
<p>Max, I think an occasional harsh post jars us but it also makes us think about what we are doing. You have been through a great deal…the part about being physically abused just made me want to scream and than reach out to hug you. How are you doing with those loan payments…it must be hard without any help at all from your mom. I think most of the parents on this thread would agree that we help our kids more than we might admit to. Heck if we don’t help our kids we can’t take it with us. I am sorry that your mom has enjoyed spending while she knew that you were doing without. However, you will need to find a way of letting go and forgiving her (it does not mean that you will have a mom and son relationship but you will let go of the anger. You deserve that Max because you have done what very few people your age have done even if you don’t hear it here from every poster. Be proud and be strong and appreciate the girlfriend you have, the job you have, and the life you are building…you have come a long way. Have you called your insurance carrier to see what they will cover for your teeth? The same goes for your hand…take care of all of these things. What alot of parents may forget is that we do alot of this trouble shooting for our kids and they learn how to do these things for themselves only after we have taught them how to handle them. You have had to navigate on your own…but you are doing it. I think you are so very strong and yet I still see where you need the guidance. Please listen to the wonderful advice you are being given. The parents on this thread have embrassed you because we see that strength that has gotton you this far. Your nextstep is to take care of the physical and emotional pain…This part should be the easy part (I know it is hard when money is an issue) but find someone in your plan and any out of pocket cost could be put on a payment plan.</p>
<p>Teri, Max is NOT saying he is self-sufficient. He is saying he has not been able to afford to take care of himself. Hence, everyone’s suggestions about how he can achieve dental care. </p>
<p>Max is saying old wounds made (and make) it hard to proceed. His question about the lawsuit was embedded in a description of the past that haunts him and the medical/dental issues that continue. His responses have included more about the depth and breadth of the wounds. In response to one of my posts, he did write that he has dental options he would pursue. It would be great to know he has now made some calls.</p>
<p>Under normal circumstances, by the time someone reaches his mid-twenties, there have been other, strong influences (peers, teachers, girlfriend, media, etc) which point a young adult in the direction he needs to go. Eg, the college has a health center. Did he take advantage of that? Peers or coworkers might notice an issue with one’s hand and suggest a solution. You ride the bus in NYC and see ads for dental care options. Etc. </p>
<p>Folks shouldn’t be too harsh at posters they feel are harsh. We’d all love to get a post from Max telling us some little progress he has made. “Baby steps” are those small efforts we make to try to move forward- a phone number looked up, a call placed, a plan considered- even further questions to clarify the advice given.</p>
<p>Some posters clearly feel Max has some work to do.</p>
<p>I think we’re talking about two different issues here. I’m talking about him being self-sufficient in his life overall, while you’re talking about one specific issue of his teeth and hand. </p>
<p>My 24-year old daughter, who has been on her own for a year now, still consults with us regarding her health care plan, especially when it came to open enrollment and her FSA. I see that she is still trying to figure out the health care system (she is in a new state and has had to find new physicians/dentists/eye doctors in a time where who is in what network or not changes constantly it seems). There are things I think she should do differently (for instance, making more of an effort to find a primary care physician that she likes), but when she reaches a point that this is a priority for her (likely getting sick and really needing something beyond a Minute-Clinic), she will learn from her lessons and take care of it. The point is, it takes time for many people to figure out the health care system (I work in health care and I can tell you the number of much older adults who cannot figure it out - it’s really scary). It’s time consuming and can feel hopeless at times. </p>
<p>We don’t know what the OP would be doing about his health care issues had this not been hi-jacked from his wish to find information about a possible lawsuit. It may have been on his list of things to follow up, but sometimes we can only deal with a couple of issues at a time and with his mother’s threat, perhaps that became his priority for a few days. We don’t know that next week, or next month he was not going to make some phone calls, or ask around at work or in his HR department. </p>
<p>So maybe he is just taking baby steps with the health care issues he will eventually need to address, but look at his history of facing obstacles… I’m not too worried that he will get stuck and not do anything. He seems pretty bright and capable (as well as motivated).</p>