<p>While I agree with the consensus here for your D to take the arts classes, I thought I’d suggest a possible alternative. Does your state offer AP classes online? I know they do in Florida where I live, and lots of kids choose to take some APs online when they can’t get scheduled to take them in school. </p>
<p>how would one find out how to take an Ap class online? I’ve never heard of anyone around here doing that, but I haven’t done any research on that either.</p>
<p>If D could do AP US Hist on line, hopefully it’d also meet the requirements for D to take the IB Global studies test next year too.</p>
<p>(There are several other online art history courses, but they aren’t “AP,” if that is what is desired. University of Nebraska onlined h.s., Univ. of Missouri, etc. offer non-AP Art history.)</p>
<p>That’s too bad the history teacher won’t be more flexible. It doesn’t seem like it’d be that much extra work for them.</p>
<p>Also, regarding math, has she taken AP Statistics yet? If not, then this is another math class she could get in if she wants. Note - my D also exhausted all of the offered math classes including AP Calc and AP Stats by the time she was a junior so she didn’t take any math class as a senior. </p>
<p>I’ll opine that this is a light academic transcript for UCLA: only 17 total academic classes over four years, when the average for UCLA is 19 honors/AP/IB courses alone; many acceptees without extenuating circumstances, take 5-6 academic classes each year. But, then again, what will get her accepted is her passion…</p>
<p>Fortunately, the UC’s don’t care about intended major (at least in Letters & Science). Definitely add the self-study AP Euro score.</p>
<p>Is D light with her classes with just 17 academic courses that she is taking during the school year? (that averages 4 - 5 a year) For both freshman and soph year, PE is also a required course so that take 1 slot right there. </p>
<p>Hmm. . . I didn’t think so, as D is pretty much taking what her older sister did --and older sister got into all 12 colleges she applied to including UCLA, UCB, USC, Duke and UNC Chapel Hill, most with scholarships. Even though older daughter had straight As and less fine arts, the academic courseload would be the same, except for Jr D not being able to take Ap US Hist this year because of scheduling conflicts.</p>
<p>I don’t know if I already mentioned that she has taken more courses in summer school too – eg. Econ H in Summer school, Health in summer school ( a school requirement, not sure if health is a state requirement), took computer in middle school and passed the required high school computer competency test. She also took high school level Algebra and Geom in 7th and 8th grade. </p>
<p>So actually D does have about 20 academic classes --she just won’t get a grade credit for the 2 math courses she took in middle school because the high school will only give her a “pass” grade.</p>
<p>UCCP does not offer art history as an elective at the present moment. They continue to add solids & electives each year; it’s just that there’s nothing in the art history area at the moment.</p>
<p>One does not need to take “California” online courses in order for them to be credited by U.C. or any other CA college/U. The 3 sources I named above, as well as Brigham Young University online options (both their high-school level & their University-level) are commonly accepted by U.C. & other colleges. If one is concerned, it’s best naturally to check specifically with regard to a particular course or an institution offering the course.</p>
<p>The OP is taking about taking AP US History - not AP Art History. The UCCP does offer AP US History. I agree that there are other choices but the UCCP appears to be a good choice since it’s sanctioned by the UC system where the OP’s D wants to go. Note - my D took a BYU course online to satisfy the ‘practical arts’ UC requirement since she couldn’t fit it in with her schedule. The BYU course was reasonably priced and quite easy to sign up for and take.</p>
It’s not all that important for the private’s either, if there is a reason and that is explained to the colleges. My daughter had barely more than the minimum academic course work to graduate – she had 4 academic classes in 9th grade; 5 in 10th; studied abroad during fall semester of 11th, then took 4 academic classes in the spring; with 4 academic courses fall of 12th grade and 5 in the spring. The reasons were because her arts magnet only allowed a maximum of 4 academic courses in 9th grade & 5 per year after that; & she had scheduling issues limiting options after she returned from her foreign exchange and also had to fit in the health class. (I think health is mandated state wide, but it is not a recognized academic course for UC admission). </p>
<p>The important thing for the private colleges is simply that my daughter explained the circumstances. The gc wrote a detailed explanation of the arts high school requirements (the students must have 2 periods a day in arts classes, 3 periods during 9th grade). My d also included a short statement with her apps that briefly explained her decision to study abroad and how it impacted course scheduling – the basic thrust was to explain how her decision to live abroad was also a way of challenging herself. </p>
<p>As far as the UC’s are concerned: </p>
<p>Most arts classes ARE considered by the UC’s, listed either under the F/Fine Arts or the G/other elective category. So those are not ignored – they do show up on the grid and the admissions department can see what was done with the time. </p>
<p>Actually, you may want to go online to the Pathways site to check the list of UC approved courses for your school. You can do that on this page:
<a href=“https://pathways.ucop.edu/doorways/list/[/url]”>https://pathways.ucop.edu/doorways/list/</a>
Just enter your school name and all the courses will show up on a grid showing how they are categorized, including which qualify for weighted credit.</p>
<p>I’m actually one of the defenders of the faith when it comes to choosing arts courses even at the expense of core academics. I sincerely believe, and my son is a prime example, that art related activities can be significant hooks at selective colleges – no matter what the student intends to major in. This is particularly true at LACs where a small student body needs to participate in all of the musical ensembles, theater and dance offerings and studio arts showings but even middle to large size schools NEED artists, actors, musicians, dancers and writers. It’s part of what makes a liberal arts education so dynamic.</p>
<p>My son and I nearly came to blows over his senior year schedule. I had read all the college requirements/recommendations and I feared for his chances should he not continue with laboratory science, math, three years of a single language. In retrospect I think his art studio and creative writing classes and the related greades, recommendations, awards and achievements did a lot more for him than another B- (or godforbid C) in chemistry or calculus. </p>
<p>The irony of all is that now here he is a senior majoring in art history / art studio and what is he faced with as a graduate school requirement? Calculus!</p>
<p>I agree completely that the arts can be a hook – I just don’t think it necessarily will be, which is why I am both a lover of the arts and a believer in the concept of art for art’s sake. There simply is no guarantee that arts will ever pay off, whether in college admissions or in terms of financial gain from employment – even though there are many situations where the payoff is great. I’m sure you are delighted to see your son as an art major, but at the same time if he had asked you which major would get him the highest paying job at graduation… you might have urged something more, er, practical. One of my college classmates is an art major who pursued his love through a masters degree, and some of his works sell for as much as $30,000… but I don’t know whether that gives him a steady income or a lot of ups and downs. </p>
<p>Given the choice, I’d rather see my kids eking out a minimal income while pursuing their passions, then doing something they hate for the money – but those of us who choose the less financially secure paths, also need to be flexible with our other goals in life. So the kid who pursues the art may find he has a hook to a top school – or not – and if he can be as happy with his safety college as long as the art program is good, then he’ll be fine. Some of the best arts oriented programs in the country are actually at colleges that are not particularly prestigious or highly selective, simply because art programs do not always go hand in hand with strong core academics. I certainly know with dance that very few top, highly selective college have strong programs – except for a handful of elites (such as Tisch or Julliard), prospective dance majors are better off looking way beyond the US News top 100. </p>
<p>You and I are both fortunate because our kids “won” the admissions game - pursued their arts and got into top colleges. But I think of Andison - who seems to have amazing talent as a pianist, but lost out the year of his graduation because he seemed to have targetted schools that either didn’t care, or were full up on their quota for pianists that year. So it just is one of those life strategies that’s like rolling the dice… wonderful for those who feel that their love for what they are doing is its own reward.</p>
<p>Mom of 4:
How frustrating to aspire to both academics and arts and have to choose between advanced ensembe and ap us!!!
My d, also an arts h.s. grad in the o.c., got into both ucla and berkeley. She did college classes in addition to aps. She is going to UCLA in 2 weeks (her dream school). I can share some info we collected with you:</p>
<p>One thing I listened to at the berkeley admissions presentation and later found out was true at UCLA too was that they are most definitely looking for the number of semesters of ap/IB/certified honors units grades 10-12. Not all honors classes count, only those designed for 11-12th grades. Here’s what I am guessing you’ll find will count as certified honors semesters when you look up your h.s.'s certified list:
Bio H, Chem H, Pre Calc H, Calc H
Eng 3 H, Eng 4 H
IB Spanish 4
IB Global studies
and Physics H
= 18 semesters certified honors units
Frankly, this is 2-4 semesters less than I think the published UCLA admittee average # of semesters. I don’t know about the euro his ap test without the class. Here are some thoughts:</p>
<ol>
<li><p>Berkeley admissions rep said to make sure one of the app essays mentioned that because of arts program participation, d had limited options to take additional ap/ib classes. She did this on one of the shorter writings. She also talked about what she had done academically outside of school (college classes).</p></li>
<li><p>Your d is taking what UCLA said was the hardest AP they look for, Calc. Taking the tests for AP/IB classes is important to UCLA-- you get something better than if you take the class but not the test.</p></li>
<li><p>re: IB requirement for Global Studies to take the AP US Hist this year would this be waived if she went to the local JC during the school year or over the summer and took us history? Classes taken the summer after jr year count into uc gpa as full year weighted courses. Therefore, if she took 2 courses next summer, she would have 22 honors/ap/ib semesters. </p></li>
<li><p>Sustained participation in the arts is definitely a possible hook, and pay special attention for her to gain opportunities to compete or get awards at the regional, state and national level. Performing as a soloist or having a lead in a play is scored highly also. These are scored on the apps as major awards.</p></li>
<li><p>I hear repeatedly that UCLA is a crapshoot, but at d’s school, it was very logical. That is, they say that the app is scored in 3 categories and those in d’s class who applied were in top 20, had strong curriculum of aps and college classes, had strong leadership/ecs/community service. In fact, at UCLA welcome day, they said 92% of admittees had comm service. The announcement today that UCLA will be making admissions even more comprehensive than before and studying how Cal is doing it makes the Berkeley Hout report on Berkeley admissions even more important. Put into your browser “berkeley comprehensive admissions” and you will get a link to the pdf of this report, which is full of specific info on how apps are scored. Look specifically at the last 10 pages for definitions of app scoring. </p></li>
<li><p>Has your d heard about the World Arts nad Cultures Dance major at UCLA? You must audition and they take a very low number. However, we know some dancers who have been accepted with lower academic records for that major, which is in the school of arts and architecture. Acceptance here seems to be kinda like school of theater acceptances-- talent is first, academics second. </p></li>
</ol>
<p>I am getting more help and advice than I had originally asked for and I am grateful. Trying to mesh Ap/IB/honors courses with a daughter who is active in fine arts is definitely a challenge. </p>
<p>I was also active in fine arts while in high school, did not major in the arts, and my interest in fine arts is still sustained even today. So even though D will not major in anything fine arts related, I know that doing music/dance/theatre/choir now will enrich her life in the future. </p>
<p>I esp appreciate the advice to let colleges know via essay why D may be a little “short” on Honors courses as compared to other students (eg. because D has chosen to spend a 1/3 of her school day, and countless other hours outside of school to be active in the performing arts). </p>
<p>For colleges, it may help that she has sung a couple of solos and was chosen to be in S. Calif honor choir as a frosh. D also tutors kids at our local library for the last 2 years, is active at our church, and has part time job ushering for a local performing arts auditorium. All in all, very full days as most of all of our high school kids have.</p>
<p>when I first read the OP’s post, I saw three planned academic classes (english, spanish, and global studies), and MAYBE a science. IMO, threes classess is a slacker schedule for senior year. At UCLA, a student would be expected to take TWELVE classes in the first year; three academic classes is not exactly great preparation for the transition.</p>
<p>BlueB.-
That is an excellent point, and one that the admissions tour included as a consideration. They are looking for level of difficulty to increase, and it can really hurt an app to slack off. Average published for Ucla admits for sr year honors/ap semesters is 10-12 I believe. I remember in the Berkeley report there is a score given to the strength of the senior year courseload, and to the trend (stronger vs. easier).</p>
<p>One poster (was it Cal Mom?) mentioned that you can pull up what courses satisfy UC requirements for each individual high school. So I pulled up D’s high school today. . .And guess what, D’s High school is offering for the first time this year, “Ap Euro History”. </p>
<p>So I was thinking that D might be able to switch her schedule around and take Euro this year to satisfy the IB Global Study" apparent course requirement that students have to take at least 220 hours of Honors History courses (which means taking an honors history class in Jr year) in order to sit for the IB Test. She wouldn’t retake the AP Euro test since she already took it and passed it last spring, but maybe this is a way to be able to take the IB test next year – eg taking AP Euro in lieu of AP US history this year because of the scheduling conflicts (she will still sit for the AP US Hist test even though she couldn’t take AP US Hist). D plans to ask the IB Coordinator and AP Euro instructor on Monday whether this will work.</p>
<p>Thanks Blue Bayou and OCMom for your insights, and letting me know of the importance of D taking as many honor courses that D can fit along with her fine arts courses. I had already realized that, but it is hard to mesh the Honor courses with the Choir, dance stuff. Since the fine arts stuff is usually only offered during one set period, it definitely causes scheduling conflicts with the honor courses which are also only offered one or two periods. </p>
<p>For next year (D’s Sr year). . .at D’s high school, sometimes AP stats is offered and sometimes not --based on whether enough students want to take the course or not (last year not enough students did). At this point , D is planning to take Physics H or AP Stats next year as a senior --or maybe both. Again it will depend on what fits with her fine arts commitments. </p>
<p>There are not much else honor courses that D can take at her school than she has already taken or is planning to take. So I guess if she doesn’t have the 19 - 20 honors courses that most UCLA applicants have, oh well, it will have to do.</p>
<p>mom of four – I don’t want to disappoint you, but the list on the UC site is of courses that have been submitted for approval by the high schools - it does not necessarily mean the courses are currently offered. I think the problem is that the process for course submission is something that takes place at an earlier time and separate from the process of actually scheduling classes and assigning teachers to them. So all the list means is that the high school had plans to offer the course (maybe) at the time the paperwork was submitted – or that it offered the course in the past. </p>
<p>For example, my daughter’s high school lists AP Calculus, but it has never offered the course except to allow some students to take it on line. One year they decide to change the order that science were taught - instead of Bio-Chem-Physics they decided they would teach Chem before Bio – and that year they fired the biology teacher – and everyone just took chemistry. But Biology 1-2 shows up on the UC list for that year. </p>
<p>There are also sometimes courses given that aren’t on the approved list. For example, my son’s high school had an integrated science program but started offering regular science courses my son’s senior year, so he took both chemistry and physics that year - but those courses didn’t show up on the pre-approved list. The approved list didn’t catch up to the actual course offerings until 2 years down the line.</p>
<p>So you should definitely ask about the AP Euro as a possibility, but don’t be surprised if you are told that it is not being offered this year.</p>
<p>Civics/govt is a Calif state graduation requirement; most kids take it senior year at least for public schools - not sure if true for privates). You might check to see if IB global studies satisfies that requirement.</p>
<p>So true about “planned” courses, calmom. Our school lists a class that they haven’t offered for four years – I pointed this out (repeatedly) to the head honcho, and he told me go pound sand.</p>
<p>The UC list of particular HS A-G courses doesn’t mean that the HS is necessarily offering those courses. Some HS will change course offerings year to year and not update the list on the UC website. In the case of my D’s school, AP Art History was listed even though they hadn’t offered this course for at least 3 years. The UC A-G HS course listing s/b used to determine what courses UC will accept ‘assuming’ your HS actually offers them while your kid is attending.</p>