New Details in the Zimmerman-Martin Controversy

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<p>Florida is making me feel good about living in Texas. :)</p>

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<p>Nobody messes with your guns in Texas!</p>

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<p>Hold on there just a minute, Youndon’t Say!!! I love you compadre but I’ve got to remind you of the Lenell Jeter case in Texas circa 1980. The poor guy got racially profiled, railroaded by an inept sheriff, convicted in a ‘by the numbers’ prosecution, and languished in jail because those same prosecutors steadfastly refused to admit their mistake. Lenell Jeter wore a suit to work everyday and had many white co-workers in his office vouch for his integrity when he was falsely accused of a crime. Those collegues provided a rock-solid alibi for Mr. Jeter, but alas, he came to the attention of the police only because of a laughably ambiguous call to the police describing him as ‘suspicious.’ Imagine, a Black man sitting on a park bench in Texas reading a book during his lunch hour!</p>

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<p>If I understand the law correctly, either Trayvon or Zimmerman could have killed the other with impunity. Trayvon is walking home, minding his business, talking with his girlfriend. At some point he notices a large white man trailing him, first in a car and then on foot. He may notice that the man has a holster and gun (was the gun visible? reports are that Zimmerman was on his way to the grocery store; did he really arm himself for such errands?) He is afraid and punches Z in the nose, gets him on the ground, slams his head into the pavement and kills him before the gun can be drawn. Wouldn’t the law protect Trayvon in this case? If Trayvon does not manage to kill Z before Z draws his gun and shoots, then Trayvon is killed. (This is Z’s story.) So, the law protects the survivor. Except that I suspect that in the first scenario, Trayvon would be charged.</p>

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<p>Perhaps some of you are not aware that anglos are now a racial minority in Texas. </p>

<p>Mr. Jeter was convicted in Greenville, Texas where my father grew up. The town slogan on the City offices’ stationary and on a large sign hung by the town across the main street of the town until 1965 was “The Blackest Land and the Whitest People.” </p>

<p>But, we do love our guns. We shoot at everyone and even to protect our hubcaps and someone else’s bicycle. You really need to read this article to put it in perspective. [‘Castle</a> law’ arms Texas homeowners with right to shoot - Texas Outdoor News - TexasHuntFish.com - TexasHuntFish.com (TX)](<a href=“http://www.texashuntfish.com/app/view/Post/17437/-Castle-law-arms-Texas-homeowners-with-right-to-shoot]'Castle”>http://www.texashuntfish.com/app/view/Post/17437/-Castle-law-arms-Texas-homeowners-with-right-to-shoot)</p>

<p>But, then again, in Texas Bobby Baltazar (the black Bronx Dad who chased the 17 yo and shot him in the back with the 17 yo’s own gun) would NEVER have been charged either.</p>

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<p>I’m going to defend the police on this one, big time. The police knew from the first minute that Smith was lying. They only went along with her story because they wanted her to keep talking, knowing that her lies would catch up with her. If they told her up front she was lying, she’d clam up, and they couldn’t have proved anything.</p>

<p>Smith she said she’d stopped at a red light when a black man jumped her car, threw her out, and took off with her two kids in the back seat. She said there were no witnesses. The police knew at once that was all a lie, because the light was triggered only by another car being at the intersection. Since she herself said there were no cars around, the light for her side would never have turned red. Also, she had no wounds, and as the police chief later said, no innocent mother would let someone take her children without some kind of physical injury from fighting, grabbing the car, running after it, etc.</p>

<p>The police played it perfectly. They told her how sympathetic they were and went along with her story until she kept talking and eventually tripped herself up. She should have realized they didn’t believe her because unlike the Boston officers, the South Carolina police never bothered the black community by looking for any mythical black kidnapper.</p>

<p>The Susan Smith case is a perfect example of the police looking at facts, and only facts, and investigating accordingly. Hats off to them.</p>

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<p>Oh, that’s what I get for making a joke and then running to the grocery store (unarmed, BTW). I would never make the case that Texas is more progressive than anywhere when it comes to just about anything.</p>

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<p>Ex H carried a gun to the grocery. I think many people who carry do so whenever they go out into public.</p>

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<p>A reasonably competent police department would investigate to see whether the homicide actually did fit under the justifiable force provisions, or whether the survivor initially provoked the use of force against himself (in which case the justifiable force provisions do not protect him legally).</p>

<p>[Statutes</a> & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine](<a href=“Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine”>Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine)</p>

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<p>Hayden, my point about Susan Smith is that she chose that particular lie because she believed it would fly, and for a time it did. I remember having admiration for that South Carolina sheriff who broke her story and got her to confess that she murdered her own children. Unfortunately, we the public didn’t know (and perhaps couldn’t know) that the police doubted her story from the beginning.</p>

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<p>There were other high profile cases where the police let the media run off with theories about who the suspect was, even though they knew who the prime suspect was and was just waiting until s/he slipped up and incriminated himself/herself. Of course, they do not get inflamed or remembered as much when race and racism do not get injected into the incident (which has a tendency to cause people to take sides by race, rather than actual details about the case).</p>

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<p>Perhaps that is why Nancy Grace has been fairly quite–she’s white and this involves black and hispanic.</p>

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<p>Zimmerman hardly looks like a “large white man” to me. He is darker than some blacks and very much Hispanic/black looking. Compare to Cory Booker</p>

<p>[Redirect</a> Notice](<a href=“http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.maggiesnotebook.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/George_Zimmerman_5.jpeg&imgrefurl=http://www.maggiesnotebook.com/2012/03/trayvon-martin-second-eye-witness-saw-zimmerman-on-ground-moaning-crying-for-help-zimmerman-martin-tried-to-take-his-gun/&h=478&w=477&sz=19&tbnid=WWXNdT-EeB3SiM:&tbnh=186&tbnw=185&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dzimmerman%2Bphotos%26tbm%3Disch%26tbo%3Du&zoom=1&q=zimmerman+photos&docid=DdmiKX7T7IY8pM&hl=en&sa=X&ei=by5yT-nRFuLm2gWz9o2ADw&ved=0CDYQ9QEwAA&dur=1139]Redirect”>http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.maggiesnotebook.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/George_Zimmerman_5.jpeg&imgrefurl=http://www.maggiesnotebook.com/2012/03/trayvon-martin-second-eye-witness-saw-zimmerman-on-ground-moaning-crying-for-help-zimmerman-martin-tried-to-take-his-gun/&h=478&w=477&sz=19&tbnid=WWXNdT-EeB3SiM:&tbnh=186&tbnw=185&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dzimmerman%2Bphotos%26tbm%3Disch%26tbo%3Du&zoom=1&q=zimmerman+photos&docid=DdmiKX7T7IY8pM&hl=en&sa=X&ei=by5yT-nRFuLm2gWz9o2ADw&ved=0CDYQ9QEwAA&dur=1139)</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.ci.newark.nj.us/userimages/booker.jpg[/url]”>http://www.ci.newark.nj.us/userimages/booker.jpg&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

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<p>Here’s a new development, the lead investigator actually WANTED to arrest Zimmerman and get him for Manslaughter, but the State attorney’s office said no.</p>

<p>[Report:</a> Lead investigator wanted to arrest Zimmerman for shooting unarmed teen Trayvon Martin](<a href=“http://www.abcactionnews.com/dpp/news/state/report--lead-investigator-wanted-to-arrest-zimmerman-for-shooting-unarmed-teen]Report:”>http://www.abcactionnews.com/dpp/news/state/report--lead-investigator-wanted-to-arrest-zimmerman-for-shooting-unarmed-teen)</p>

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<p>LakeWashington, you’re right - Smith blamed a black man because she thought that was more likely to fly. Sad.</p>

<p>TheBigD - very interesting. Shows that at least some of the police didn’t buy Zimmerman’s story either.</p>

<p>What I don’t understand is why so many are jumping on the report from a “witness” who says he saw Martin beating Zimmerman, as a reason to say A HA! Zimmerman really was a victim. I put “witness” in quotes because he explains in detail who was on top and who was on the bottom of the fight, but at no time does he say he saw who hit who first, or anything about how the fight came to start. I have no idea why people think that story, by itself, changes anything at all.</p>

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<p>I saw that when I went searching for the 911 recording. Hmmmm …</p>

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<p>Didn’t one of the witnesses say that Trayvon punched Zimmerman in the face from behind? </p>

<p>I’ve been in more fights than I care to admit… it’s not possible to punch someone in the face from behind.</p>

<p>ETA: If Trayvon was behind him and then Zimmerman turned around and was punched in the face at that point, that’s different. I just thought I heard that someone said he was punched from behind. Searching the interwebz now…</p>

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<p>romanigypsyeyes - yes, someone said Martin punched Zimmerman in the face - Zimmerman said it. The witness only said he saw the fight when it was going on, not how it started. And now we have a detective saying he didn’t believe Zimmerman’s story. I’m not hearing anything exculpatory here.</p>

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<p>Do we know anything about the race of the police officers involved? It seems like there is a (unsubstantiated) presumption that they are on the shooter’s side.</p>

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<p>This presumption is understandable in light of how the Sanford police didn’t test Zimmerman for alcohol and controlled substances as they would for potential homicides, had previous instances of racial profiling/ignoring similar deaths, steadfastly refused to arrest Zimmerman due to a weird/twisted interpretation of Florida’s SYG law which doesn’t make sense after actually reading it…or from a common-sense perspective, didn’t adequately investigate the scene of the incident, and there was a delay of a month before any further action was taken by state and possibly Federal authorities. </p>

<p>From comments…there’s also the possibility that one detective who wanted to arrest was deterred by higher ups and that Zimmerman’s possible status as a former Judge’s son is serving to protect him. </p>

<p>All this combined with the legacy of Jim Crow justice in recent Southern/Floridian history would cast understandable suspicions on local law enforcement…even if the causes was mainly due to ineptitude.</p>