<p>You mean you haven’t listened to each episode twice, possibly three times? And read all pertinent threads on Reddit? And then looked up the transcripts and read them? And have daily texting conversations with your daughter debating various issues? LOL</p>
<p>Obviously I’m obsessed. It will be interesting to see what we learn in the remaining episodes.</p>
<p>Legal comment:</p>
<p>Jay’s testimony falls under the category of “accomplice” testimony – that is, testimony from someone who is a partner or participant in the crime. </p>
<p>In most states, the law is that a person cannot be convicted solely on the basis of accomplice testimony, but that the testimony has to be corroborated in some way – but slight or minimal corroboration will do. Here’s a link to an article I found specific to Maryland law:
<a href=“The Accomplice Corroboration Rule in Maryland - The Clements Firm”>http://theclementsfirm.com/the-accomplice-corroboration-rule-in-maryland/</a></p>
<p>The article is a few years old, so not influenced by the buzz over Serial. </p>
<p>I’m pretty sure that the cell phone ping at Leakin park would be enough to corroborate Jay’s testimony (as a legal determination). </p>
<p>I also am puzzled by the characterization of the evidence as weak in a case based on accomplice testimony. It’s more of a witness credibility case-- does the jury believe Jay or not? (obviously they did)</p>
<p>The other fact, besides the cell phone, is that Jay led the police to Hae’s car.</p>
<p>I’m still stuck with Adnan calling Jay “pathetic” rather than calling him a liar or something much worse. If I were framed and feel I was framed, “pathetic” wouldn’t even come close to what I’d feel or say to the person whose testimony was making me serve many, many, many years in jail. I guess I don’t really understand their dynamic and possible co-dependence. It is interesting that Jay led them to Hae’s car and I think that is very important.</p>
<p>I agree that Jay leading them to Hae’s car is very important - interesting that there has been no discussion about it so far.</p>
<p>I also found the scenario described by Chris (where Adnan found Jay at the pool hall) more plausible than the Best Buy story, but I wonder in that case why Hae’s car would have ended up where it was and how Jay would have known where it was.</p>
<p>Did anyone listen to the latest? I think it is interesting that the podcast is starting to make people come forward with more info. </p>
<p>Great episode! One of the best so far.</p>
<p>It’s interesting that Adnan is living an OK life in prison. Am glad so sad that Hae’s family is doing so poorly, especially the mom. It really makes you feel for the mom. So much happened to this young man from when he was 17 years old. It sounds like it will not necessarily come to a CONCLUSION, as sociopaths are people that we can’t KNOW about one way or another.</p>
<p>It is interesting that more people are coming forward with information. I can’t be convinced that Adnan did it. It is clear that Jay was involved somehow. I have to admit, the latest information about Best Buy, which always seemed implausible to me anyway, really shows that Jay was not being truthful. Certainly Chis’s story is more likely, but why not tell that story if indeed it is what happened? I just keep coming back to the feeling that Adnan was framed by forces bigger than Jay. </p>
<p>I’m just hoping that when all is said and done, Hae’s mom and family will have more closure that the person(s) who murdered their sweet D is punished for this brutal, horrendous crime, as well as all who were accessories to this awful crime. I’m not holding my breath that this will actually happen.</p>
<p>I feel it will be even harder for Hae’s family if Adnan is released and no one else is convicted of Hae’s murder. As a family of a crime victim, no one wants an evil person to go uncaught and unpunished. Of course, no one wants an innocent to be punished either. </p>
<p>This situation and series must be awful for Hae’s family–touching raw wounds and opening them again and again. </p>
<p>I do feel bad that I am getting entertained by someone else’s loss in a way. I guess any “true” story has the potential to do that </p>
<p>Actually, this (and other) true story exposes a LOT of current and potential losses–Hae and her family, Adnan and his family, folks who may have been involved but weren’t charged or convicted, etc. it is also a personalized expose of our current criminal justice system in one 15-year-old case. </p>
<p>very true </p>
<p>Soo has anyone listened to the latest episode? </p>
<p>It was so great to finally get a new episode! i find myself wavering back and forth on Adnan, but I am totally convinced he got shafted in the trial. The racism of everyone concerned was shocking to me!</p>
<p>Yes, I listened. Because I’ve been doing a lot of Internet searching about this case, I already knew the information that was shared in this podcast…all except the part about Adnan requesting a plea deal. Although I’m not sure I buy that. His justification for asking for a plea deal while maintaining his innocence was…suspect.</p>
<p>But it was good to hear Sarah present all this information in linear form to help me make sense of all the bits and pieces I picked up along the way. </p>
<p>I’m looking forward to the enx</p>
<p>From a legal standpoint, the lawyer’s failure to pursue a plea deal is the strongest argument for a claim of ineffective assistance of counsel. (I’m speaking from my experience as an appellate as well as trial lawyer). There’s case law to establish that’s part of a lawyer’s job, even if the client claims innocence, and even if the lawyer doesn’t think the client will take a deal. The lawyer has to at least find out what the deal would be. Especially if the lawyer is representing a teenage kid . (Summary of law: <a href=“Chemerinsky: Effective Assistance of Counsel Now a Right in Plea Bargaining”>http://www.abajournal.com/news/article/chemerinksy_effective_assistance_of_counsel_now_a_right_in_plea_bargaining/</a> )</p>
<p>The failure to interview a witness is also a big goof – but it sounds like this was a complex case with a lot of witnesses being presented, so from the viewpoint of the appeals court it would seem more like a minor error that falls short of showing the lawyer to be inadequate - especially given that witness’ later recantation. The law doesn’t promise perfect lawyers or error-free trials – but it does impose a certain standard of care on the lawyer. </p>
<p>From a pragmatic standpoint, the plea bargaining issue is more likely to result in getting relief for the defendant, because if the conviction is reversed on those grounds, the most likely outcome is a negotiated plea-- the defendant is going to be more amenable to taking a deal that would have seemed too tough at the time of his trial, and it’s a lot easier for the prosecution to agree to a reduced sentence than to re-try an old case (though Sarah Koenig has done a good job of scouting out witnesses for the prosecution, even though that wasn’t her intent). The fact that the defendant has already done 15 years in prison creates more bargaining room. </p>
<p>I haven’t actually looked at the legal pleadings in this case, but my impression is that the post-conviction relief lawyers raised both claims – the omitted witness and the plea bargain – but that the appellate court just wants to hear the plea-bargain issue…</p>
<p>I’d note that it would be gross incompetence of the appellate lawyers if they failed to raise the plea bargain issue --so of course they would argue that. It’s highly likely that somewhere along the way Adnan would have asked his trial lawyer whether there was a possibility of a deal, even though it’s also likely that his expectations at the time would likely have been unrealistic. </p>
<p>Thanks Calmom,
Just listening to Ms. Gutierrez talk rubs me the wrong way. I hate the way she talks in circles. </p>
<p>Since she had MS, it’s very possible that that her illness caused mental problems that account for the lack of focus:</p>
<p>
From <a href=“Multiple Sclerosis (MS) Symptoms and Early Warning Signs of MS”>Multiple Sclerosis (MS) Symptoms and Early Warning Signs of MS;
<p>So basically she might have been losing her own train of thought during cross-examination. </p>
<p>I am the only one who found her deterioration and subsequent death profoundly sad? </p>
<p>She died at age 52 :-(</p>
<p><a href=“Maria C. Gutierrez, 52, criminal defense lawyer”>Maria C. Gutierrez, 52, criminal defense lawyer;