<p>Exactly right, thank you lookingforward. This “buyer” hasn’t made an offer (a written offer, the only kind that really matters) and may never make an offer.</p>
<p>Dropping the price may very well attract people who are ready to put their money where their mouth is.</p>
<p>It will also send him a clear signal that the house isn’t his, yet-- if he wants it, he’d better offer! </p>
<p>Was just about to post when I saw CTmom’s post so will tweak mine a bit. I was about to say, if there have been no other house showings in 2 weeks, then you should be considering a price adjustment soon. The buyer may be waiting to see the results of the oil tank removal and soil remediation (which fortunately sounds like it will be minor) but might be having second thoughts due to the extent of the septic situation. It is possible they are looking at other properties, especially since they haven’t gone to contract in these several weeks. At this point, if it were me, I would probably not quibble over $5000. It will cost that much to hold onto the house for another few months if that happens, and we are going into a bad selling time of year. So, if it were me, I’d take the $215 if they will immediately go to contract. If you lose this offer the next could be lower, and yes, you have to disclose the known septic problem or you must fix it, which will cost $ you don’t have. Getting 86% of asking price in what sounds like a somewhat soft market is not bad. </p>
<p>Originally the buyers and their agent were seen as underhanded and slimy. I think that may have been a bit unfair.They sound like they have been bargaining in good faith. Its possible they may feel that the seller or sellers agent has not been negotiating in good faith. Not saying they do, but they might. And if they dont LOVE the house they could easily walk. Get that contract!</p>
<p>Lower the price if need be but generate more movement. Do not put all your eggs in this basket.</p>
<p>Thank you for contributing, LF and CT mom. and Tempe Mom. I just came home to an email from my realtor that she will have, from the buyer’s realtor, a precise offer and (quoting her email) “and terms (meaning the buyer will take over the repair of the septic.)” according to the buyer’s realtor, “soon.” Certainly, I am angry, frustrated and concerned that the buyer may be looking at other properties. </p>
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<p>jym626, that is certainly not true. I did use the word “slimy”–but to no one else but here–the buyer and his realtor have of course had no contact with me but only with my very good natured realtor. She is a real gift, because she is smart, knows her job well, and is a very pleasant person to be around/talk with. I wouldn’t have used the word “slimy” if I had known–as it was later explained to me by my realtor and people on the board here–that “lowball” offers are commonplace, No, absolutely not, my realtor has been negotiating pleasantly and absolutely in good faith. I am surprised that you might infer otherwise. We had the “mold-like growth” found on the cold cellar ceiling, the 6 smoke detectors and the 2 carbon monoxide detectors installed immediately after we got their inspector’s report, and they know we did that really fast. I never suggested that they were bargaining in “bad faith”-just mentioned to the board and a few friends that I was jolted by the lowball offer and frustrated by the slow replies to emails and phone calls, and I’m sure my realtor has given them no reason to think she or I conceive that they are negotiating in “bad faith.”. We have twice negotiated “down” in good faith. In contrast, when my husband and I bought our house, the seller countered our offer by lowering the price $1,000! In this negotiating process, we have offered generous reductions. </p>
<p>I agree with you, certainly we will not quibble over $5,000 and would accept $215,000 if they will not go to $220,000. They know that we chose a $4,230 tank removal/tank replacement job from a company we have been dealing with for 29 years over a $2,785 quote I got from a company whom we found through an ad in the local paper but knew nothing about. The buyer’s realtor has copies of both these proposals as proof of the proposal costs and they certainly show that we wish to bargain “in good faith.”</p>
<p>Yes, I think my realtor will agree with me that it is time to reduce the listing price on the house.</p>
<p>jym626, to answer your question a page or so ago, yes, my parents put on a quality new roof about 10 years ago. </p>
<p>Do you think lowering the price from $250,000 to $240,000 would be enough to motivate more viewings?</p>
<p>I hope you don’t think I was foolish to take the higher bid on the oil tank removal / replacement. Part of the reasoning also was that the company gave us very, very, good terms. A modest deposit when the work is done and the remaining bulk paid at the closing.</p>
<p>I believe Jym was just noting that, in the normal tangle of negotiations, each side has possible perceptions.</p>
<p>We’re just trying to follow. Mold like growth certainly got my attention, wasn’t mentioned before- but we don’t have to know each item you had to tackle, just that you heeded what the inspector raised. Then we go on to what needs our attention or where we have some expertise to share. </p>
<p>In my way of thinking, it’'s good to have hope, but good to also realize nothing is set til it’s set. Hence the suggestion to lower the listing price to possibly attract other buyers, in case. It’s common.</p>
<p>All this is really Three Bears. For you and for us: not too much detail, not too little, just the right mount. That helps everyone, we can fill in some of the right blanks for you. </p>
<p>x-posting. Yes 240 is good; get input from the agent.
I don’t think it’s foolish, not one bit, to go with the trusted oil company. Not for a 1k difference. I would be tempted to do the same.</p>
<p>But now the two nagging questions are: do you know if your parents had that oil tank put in ten years ago? You would have known, right? (If so I wonder why it wasn’t moved inside, at that point. Mine was, by prior owners, rather than just replace in-ground. But this is an example where we only need to know if you can confirm the outside tank is, in fact, only ten years old. Not why they made the decision they made.) </p>
<p>And, is he pre-approved? Because if he IS, your closing becomes smoother. It means a lender has preliminarily agreed to X dollars based on his income and assets. If not, he has the full process to go through. And, of course, if he’s approved, but for less than the sale price, he has steps to take. </p>
<p>I’m confused and it’s been a number of years since I bought real estate. This bidder has not made an offer in writing? Has he put down any earnest money?</p>
<p>Is it usual to be doing so much work, getting septic inspections and so forth before there’s a firm offer ? </p>
<p>I mean, I guess it’s prudent because whoever buys will want the same info but it just sounds unusual to be doing all this talking and negotiating with no actual offer. </p>
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Dharma,
What I am trying to explain to you is that here, in several posts, you have expressed concern about the veracity of the potential buyer and their agent. No one is saying you said anything directly to the buyer or their agent, since you would not be communicating directly with them. My point is that I am trying to show you the other potential point of view. Inasmuch as you questioned the honesty of the buyer (but in fact it sounds like they have responded with counters based on the inspection and repair estimate they were given) they might be doing the same, thinking, for example “I am offering to do all the septic repair and reduce the price by the estimated repair cost I was given, and they want to only come down $5K? They are being unreasonable”. They were going by their report, which you apparently hadnt yet seen. Each person sees the transaction from their perspective. When we sold my dad’s house they accused us at one point of trying to purposely slow down the deal. Say whaaa??? That was ridiculous! I wanted it sold ASAP. But things took time-- to get the oil tank removed – had to coordinate when they were there and when the insurance guy could also be on site simultaneously to see the status to see if it qualified to file a claim (it did). Then the weather was bad, then they ran into a water pipe they had to work around and then the ground froze, and on and on.
Again, my point was simply to show you that they might be feeling about the seller the way you were feeling about the buyer. Trying to show you the other perspective,as its often hard to see that when one is so close to the situation.
If you do not find that helpful, so be it.</p>
<p>How long has your mom been in the house? I thought you said somewhere that it was like 15 years? Am I misremembering? If so, and if your oil tank is only 10 yrs old, then she would have replaced it. thats a big job. Wouldnt she have told you about it?</p>
<p>And thank you, lookingforward, for explaining what I said. You are spot on. Dharma, you did say exactly
which was what I was referencing. This is a negotiation. Its normal. It goes back and forth. each party wants the best price. That’s normal. But its also normal for buyers to continue to look at what comes on the market. My s and his fiancee are looking at houses. they look at what comes on the market all the time. You have no reason to be angry if they are looking at other houses. Thats all part of the house buying process. It is what it is.</p>
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<p>This is a question for your agent. Have you asked her?</p>
<p>And why isn’t SHE suggesting it? When we sold Mom & Dad’s house, we originally listed it at $289K. After TWO weeks, the agent contacted US and suggested we reduce to $274K (and we got two offers at the first open house). </p>
<p>Our agent fully understood the urgency of selling quickly. She was committed to work HARD to selling quickly. She took initiative and proposed things to us, rather than us having to propose things to her. We didn’t have to be real estate experts, because we hired her.</p>
<p>So many good points, so much to answer:</p>
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<p>LF, to answer your question about the oil tank, it is very interesting. Yesterday, when I picked up the proposal at the oil company, the woman said my parents had the tank replaced 10 years ago.She was looking at the history of my parents’ account on her computer. I wondered hard, why did they have it buried? Then I visited my mother today and told her what I just told you. She said, NO, when they bought the house 15 years ago they asked the owner to replace the oil tank because they had just paid a huge amount for soil remediation on the property they were selling. The seller was kind enough to comply. So I corrected this info in an email to my realtor to communicate to the buyer’s realtor.</p>
<p>To answer your question, to my great disappointment, the buyer is NOT pre approved. This is unfortunate.</p>
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<p>I don’t know if it is usual–I suspect it is–my realtor tells me that all health and safety issues must be repaired before a closing. Not cosmetic things. Hence the smoke detectors, septic, and oil tank. About when a agreed-upon price is fixed, I can only say that in my case it is problematic because the cost of repairing the septic is unknown, can only be determined when the expert gets underground. Based on his expectation (I guess) of the repair cost, the buyer lowered his bid $15,000. My realtor countered with a price reduction for the septic repair of $10,000.</p>
<p>It might be interesting to note at this juncture that I spent the afternoon going through and sorting/organizing/disposing of documents pertaining to my mother’s care, the caregiver, and the house. For the first time, I took a good look at the “comps” the realtor had given us. Many houses marked “Sold” or “in contract” in my small village got good prices and were as nice or not as nice as my mother’s. One okay house was sold for $165,000. I fear the issue of the septic might be what’s causing the potential buyer to stall, and it would be a shame to let such a nice house go for $215,000, but we are ready because of necessity to do so. </p>
<p>jym626, thank you for your careful explanation in 626, and to listen to myself quoted back in 369 was quite embarrassing. Those words were absurd hyperbole, thoughtless and immature, and most of all and most importantly reflected IRRESPONSIBLE THINKING. You have me a quick lesson not just in writing,but in thinking carefully and with scope, thank you, really. Reading that back was worth a lot.</p>
<p>The realtor did not contact me at all today. I will call her tomorrow and say I think it is time for a price reduction.</p>
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<p>That is really disappointing. You really don’t want to put all your hopes in this person. IMO a serious buyer would seek pre-approval.</p>
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<p>Good-- hopefully this will bring some new buyers in to look at the house. When we were selling my FIL’s house, we dropped the price by $5000 after one week of no one looking at it. We had a contract on day 9. Lowering the price made all the difference. </p>
<p>Buyers limit their searches to the price ranges they deem to be affordable. A lower price will make your house affordable to a new batch of buyers. But I think buyers will want to know exactly what they are dealing with, and the sooner you know the exact cost of fixing the septic and oil problems, the sooner the house will sell.</p>
<p>You need to let the realtor do her job. If you were my sister, I’d tell you to stay out of it entirely, let her arrange what repairs are necessary and wait for her reports. But I would have told you to jump at the $15,000 reduced offer given what you have disclosed in recent posts… This house has septic issues, oil tank issues, mold. Maybe more issues we don’t know about. It is not going to be an easy sell. These problems will be deal breakers for many buyers. Especially the mold. I believe you are legally obligated to disclose all inspection reports, so all potential buyers will have this information going forward.</p>
<p>If these people paid for inspection reports, I think they were serious about the property at least at one point in time. They may be scared off now. You need to back off and put it all in the hands of the realtor. Take your kids out for ice cream or something.</p>
<p>ETA: If I were selling this house, I’d sell “as is” because, as I posted earlier, it is difficult to judge the extent of problems in older homes and you need to wrap this all up quickly.</p>
<p>Alh, yes the mold on the cold cellar ceiling was very small and was immediately eliminated by our skillful handyman. If the buyer’s realtor says the buyer will go no higher than $115,000, she has my go-ahead to agree. You wrote “Maybe more issues we don’t know about.” Impossible, because this inspector did a square-inch by square-inch inspection of the house and we corrected many very minor “defects” and reported responsibly to the buyer’s realtor that all the minor issues were corrected, and they were welcome to come in and observe the corrections. This inspector’s report was so incredibly thorough, there cannot possibly be anything else to cause a problem. </p>
<p>In fact, on the listing, the house is offered “as is”(the buyer ignored the “as is”) and we corrected or arranged price reductions against the “as is.” The mold issue is entirely dealt with, and the oil tank issue will be completed by the end of the coming week. Remember, the mold–if it was indeed mold-- is entirely gone and I have carefully observed the ceiling in question, and the ceiling is completely clean… </p>
<p>Thank you for posting your thoughts. Yes, I communicate closely with the realtor and rely on her to take care of all communications. </p>
<p>CT Mom, I would think that if the buyer were a “responsible person” seeking to buy a house he would have sought and obtained pre approval on the mortgage by this point. It is a bad and disappointing sign–and a sign to me of carelessness and negligence–that he does not have a pre-approved mortgage… My husband and i certainly did. I will talk to or email the realtor tomorrow about reducing the market price to $240,000. Thanks for commenting.</p>
<p>The point is not to be distracted by the back and forth conversation with guy A. It isn’t done til it’s done. when your agent drops the price, she should get the word out pronto. Your agent will know if 240 or 245 is the way to go.</p>
<p>And it may bring in bidders who are pre-approved. You can offer a concession for the septic work, up front. Maybe offer a 7500 credit against the work. (Ie, 245 with a 7500 credit against septic.) </p>
<p>Selling “as is” (or with/without disclosures) can depend on local custom and expectations. Same with the “earnest money” deposit. </p>
<p>I am getting totally confused by your numbers. The counter from them is $215, not 115, right?. And my post you are referencing is #369, not 626 (thats my screenname). And you said earlier that your septic repair was $5K. Later you said it was $4230. This is hard to follow.</p>
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I hesitate to point this out, having been previously jumped on for pointing out critical language (that you denied using), but … Why again assume the negative? He could be a cash buyer for all you know. If you keep thinking negatively and critically you will set up a self fulfilling prophesy and the deal will tank. Try to think positively.</p>
<p>And one more thing to potentially ward off another negative thought… if your realtor happens to be Jewish, she would not have called you today. It is Yom Kippur, the holiest day of the year.</p>
<p>Well, it was I who said a serious buyer would seek pre-approval. Yes, it could be a cash buyer, but you know, being able to buy for cash is a big plus-- if I were a cash buyer, I wouldn’t make a secret of it. </p>
<p>dont think it has come up yet. It would come up when the contract is written. </p>