Joined to ask this question. A few weeks ago, kid made final college decision: UNC CH. We do think its a great fit, absent the current academic scandal. Kid considers it a factor, but doesn’t weigh it as heavily as we do. Do we override and pull the plug? There are other great choices on comparable money level, though none seem to carry the same appeal. For those familiar with the issue, what would you do? Probation started last June and will be readdressed this summer.
Show me a college with no athletics scandal in their history, and I’ll show you a college with no athletics in their history. Top school with great tradition and history. I would encourage my kid to stick with it.
Does the scandal involve the departments of his prospective major(s) or other areas of academic interest?
Is your son an athlete? Is that why it affects him?
UNC is a big school. Unless he is in a money making sport or a major that has been implicated, I wouldn’t worry about it at all.
This was pretty much one professor in one department who taught a no-show class and a bunch of highly suspect independent studies in a tiny department (a crooked administrator too, but she pretty much followed the professor’s lead). It happened years ago, but the NCAA is just getting its act together.
The athletic scandal was based on some academic support people steering athletes to this class and the professor, but plenty of non-athletes took the class. It was a disgrace, but doesn’t reflect at all on the academic quality of the institution (unless your kid plans to major in African-American studies, because I think the department was hurt by its chair being so unethical).
Tomorrow there will be a new scandal someplace else, possibly at your second choice school – and then what do you tell your kid? No graduate school or employer is going to discount his degree because of this. He’ll be fine. Congratulations.
I find it difficult to imagine that the probation will not be lifted.
Perhaps the question is whether your kid wants to go to a school where this kind of sports-related academic fraud takes place. Call me a cynic, but I am willing to bet that most big sports schools have some way in which their box office sport athletes are helped along in the interests not of getting them an education, but maintaining their eligibility for as long as they are useful on the court or field.
I think it is something that goes with the territory. In this case, they may have gone farther than most, and the violation was more flagrant.
At the same time, UNC CH is considered legitimately among the top flagship schools, academically. Does this probation materially affect the student body as a whole? Probably not much.
If this is other wise a reasonable choice, as it appears it is, I would not override his decision. You could have a final talk about it before he officially informs schools of his decision.
In four years, people will not remember what the scandal was all about.
If he is going to be devastated if certain sports teams are banned from post season play, then maybe it will matter. That seems to be the worst case scenario as of right now.
Check out this article: http://fansided.com/2015/09/30/four-infamous-scandals-college-sports/4/
If you throw in sex scandals involving sports, it’s getting hard to name a university without one. UNC-CH is a very good school. I wouldn’t nix your son’s choice based on this unless he is directly affected (athlete or wants to pursue a major in the involved department)
Over and above any pending NCAA issues, UNC is the ONLY major research institution in recent memory to be put on academic probation by their accreditor (SACS) for academic integrity issues. http://www.sacscoc.org/2015JuneActionsanddisclosurestatements/UNC%20Chapel%20Hill%20CDC.pdf
UNC responded to going on academic probation by replacing the Chair of the Board of Trustees with Dwight Stone, the Chair of their Ram’s Club althletic boosters/fundraising foundation. Lots of drama in ACC-land. Expect some ribbing about the Carolina Way.
If it’s a great fit and he can actually see himself there for 4 years, stick with it.
Also, if the scandal was important enough for you to want to veto the school, shouldn’t you have done so prior to the applications being made? (Assuming it is the athletes in nonexistent fake classes scandal that has been known for a few years.)
By letting him apply, you implied that he can attend if admitted and the net price falls within the cost constraint you told him. It may not be very nice to back out now.
I sent you a PM.
you are seriously considering pulling the plug on your kid’s No 1 choice for college over this issue? please don’t. that is a really terrible idea.
Thanks for all the responses. Not an athlete and will not take classes in the department affected, so issue-free there. And I agree that these types of scandals unfortunately go with the territory to an extent given the nature of athletic businesses functioning within educational institutions. It’s really the unusual accreditation issue (due to its severity) that is concerning and which we only found out about recently. I do think a lot of work has been done and it will be lifted, so I’m trying to get there. Fit is very important, and so is sticking to the deal of letting kid choose. Can handle some ribbing and post-season bans at least.
Every school has skeletons in its closet. Don’t worry for a nanosecond about this!
I’ve done some work in my school’s accreditation process (minor player, not an expert). It’s not super-unusual for them to use a probation to impose conditions and to give themselves the right to demand regular updates. About 10 years ago, accreditors started demanding “learning outcome” metrics, which no one had in the form that they wanted (should have seen the face of the law school dean who was told that bar results were not relevant). Schools unlucky enough to be up for review when the trend started ended up on probation until they were able to produce the new information. I think Rice and Duke got caught in this. It wasn’t publicized broadly since all of the higher ed press knew it was irrelevant and it had absolutely no impact on anyone. They’ll serve their time, provide massive amounts of documentation, and everyone will move on. Sounds scary, but it’s not like the for-profits who lose accreditation for financial reasons or because they’re a scam.
As far as athletic/academic scandals, this one is pretty mild. It in no way will tarnish your kid’s degree. Keep UNC on the list. Best of luck!
@glido, I don’t think it’s mild when it comes to sports. Yes, many schools may cheat, but I consider this a serious enough violation that I’d advocate for the death penalty for the sports programs involved. Do not think that this would have an effect on academic reputation outside of the A-A department, however.