<p>I know most women learn to deal with stuff like this at a very early age, but I didn’t, and even in the last five years this sort of thing hasn’t happened often, given my “privilege” of being middle-aged and not looking in any way distinctive, and therefore being essentially invisible! But I was sitting in the subway this morning on my way to work, minding my own business and reading a book, when some ordinary-looking guy around my age sits next to me (with an empty seat in between), and asks for the time. Which I tell him. And he leans over to thank me, and as he does so puts his hand on my shoulder and starts patting/rubbing it. Hunh? Are you kidding me? But it lasts only a few seconds, and I’m not about to make a scene over something like that, and maybe he’s just strange but entirely harmless, so I just sit there and make sure my body language presents as being completely closed off, and pretend he doesn’t exist, and bury my nose even deeper in my book. Next comes “Hot out, isn’t it?” Um, yes, it is. Hand reaches out for shoulder again, etc. Fortunately, the train is just about to pull into my stop, so I stand up. He stands up too (great! wonderful!), starts engaging with my shoulder again, and says something weird like “bye! see you tomorrow!” – but follows me off the train. Fortunately, he didn’t follow me up the stairs.</p>
<p>As I said, no big deal. Although certainly a little creepy. I certainly didn’t feel unsafe; it was a weekday morning at rush hour. But what was I supposed to do? Tell him to take his expletive hand off my expletive shoulder? That’s way too embarrassing. I suppose I could have gotten up to change seats if I’d found one, but why should I have to? What would you have done?</p>
<p>And I do wonder sometimes what it is that makes some men think they can just casually put their hands on women in public. It may not have happened to me all that much in the last five years, but this wasn’t the first time. Are they that entitled? Do they even know they’re doing it, or is it some kind of reflex? </p>
<p>Sorry if I sound a little naive or clueless for a woman of my advanced age, but this kind of thing is still relatively new to me, compared to decades of nothing like that ever happening, period.</p>
<p>I live in an area where public transportation is not readily available, but I cannot imagine someone doing that. I think that your first suggested response was good. You might look at the person with a very puzzled look and ask: “Do I know you?” When the answer is no, then say whatever comes to mind.</p>
<p>Yeah, it happens. My mother who has a very trim figure but is very old used to walk up a hill from a grocery store. She would get a lot of cars beeping at her, until they saw her face! She learned to make the nastiest, most scrunched up face to shock those beepers and enjoy their reactions. </p>
<p>I had an incident at Starbucks where I guess someone was coming on to me, but I was engrossed in a book and was not really paying attention until it hit me. Yeah, in my late 50’s and boy, did I get a hot flash and turn red. In Italy you are almost guaranteed to get your back side pinched in some of those buses and other public transportation modes.</p>
<p>Yes, although you can do it without the expletives. The direct approach is best: “Take your hands off me. Now.” You can do it either sotto voce or very loudly, depending on how much you want to embarrass the guy.</p>
<p>You’re right. I should have. Although each little “episode” was over so quickly, in just a few seconds, that I probably should just have said something like “please don’t do that,” or “please stop that.” I feel stupid for not having said anything at all and for having continued to be polite to him, but I was so surprised (shocked, really) that I sort of froze. Which I’ve done pretty much every single time anything like this has happened. It’s so unexpected.</p>
<p>Hey, at least it was on the subway, where you’re not blocked into a seat.</p>
<p>About 30 years ago, on a New Jersey Transit commuter train from NYC, I made the mistake of taking a window seat. A guy sat in the aisle seat, and proceeded to – shall we say – enjoy himself under the newspaper on his lap, at the end of which he deliberately created a situation that led to my skirt requiring a trip to the dry cleaners. I was aware of what was going on, but I was physically trapped, there were no NJ Transit employees in the car, and for all I knew, he could have had a weapon (besides the one he was using, I mean).</p>
<p>Oddly, he did not attempt to touch me or speak to me, even though I was clearly part of the “entertainment.” And he got off at the first stop, so I had no difficulty extricating myself when the train got to my stop.</p>
<p>I have never taken a window seat again. Not even on airplanes.</p>
<p>Loud and direct has always been my method if there are people around. I once got stuck in a train carriage alone with a flasher. It was so annoying - I had a great seat, but I left and looked for another one with more company.</p>
<p>agree - get up and leave the seat- not to sound mean- but perhaps staying there suggested it was ok? also maybe a set of ipod head phones to put in your ears- i talked with several kids who do this to not to talk on trains/buses etc. the key- disengage.</p>
<p>Marian: ewww is all I can say. Not sure what the heck I would have done in that situation. As you say, you don’t know if the guy has a gun.
Donna: I recommend practicing the look…I learned at a fairly young age how to give a guy like that a withering look of the “you are the lowest form of person on the planet” type. Usually works fine…they generally back right down.</p>
<p>It’s not as bad as it used to be. It was tolerated and even encouraged when I was a young woman. Not so much any more with political correctness stepping into the picture.</p>
<p>Donna, it’s part of male privilege that males seem to feel empowered to touch women they hardly know. Such men are being rude, and it’s perfectly fine-- even advisable-- to LOUDLY tell them to take their (insert profanity if you like) hands off.</p>
<p>Ignoring their behavior trying to chastise them with a withering look encourages them because unless one is blunt to the point of being obviously rude, they think you like what they’re doing.</p>
<p>Donna, your reaction is fairly common among women, I think. I’ve had my share of men touching me, displaying themselves, etc. in all kinds of locales, not just the subway. In Japan, it’s such a common problem that there are Women Only subway cars. I’ve often wondered if saying something loudly would scare them away or escalate the problem. The guy that you describe was way out of bounds for sure.</p>
<p>And it is a big deal to be touched by a man you don’t even know. It’s sexual harassment, not a little thing like the men who do things like that like to pretend it is.</p>
<p>Also, it’s OK to say “Don’t touch me” without the “please”. There’s more force and this is one situation you don’t have to be polite. After all, the man isn’t being polite.</p>
<p>Many years when I was still fairly attactive, I was standing in a very crowded subway car. A young man stood up from his seat, stood in front of me, said something, of course I couldn’t hear a word he was saying, but he was standing between me and a hand rail. I said to him, “Either sit down or get the ***** out of my way.” I said it as the car came to a stop. The young man said to me, “I just wanted to know if you wanted my seat.” Everyone in the car heard him. I turned bright red and thanked him.</p>
<p>I am now working in a country where everyone kisses each other at work. I am the most non-touchy person. People are accustomed to shake my hand now. Pleeeeese, don’t touch me.</p>
<p>No, I can’t imaging a stranger rubbing my shoulder.</p>
<p>I just walk around looking like I’m going to punch somebody.</p>
<p>(I’m truly a very non-violent person and despite many self-defense classes*, I would do anything to avoid actually laying siege to an attacker, but walking strongly and directly as though I know exactly where I’m going, and that anybody who gets near me is going to lose an appendage… that works incredibly well. That and the icy gaze.)</p>
<p>*Which reminds me… take a RAD course. Everyone, encourage your daughters and wives and friends and other women in your lives to do the same. RAD stands for Rape Aggression Defense, and it’s an amazing and empowering self-defense course that starts with showing you how to carry yourself to avoid trouble, and then shows you how to streetfight the ever-loving wazoo out of anybody who attacks you. Finally, they bring in some six-foot, no-neck thugs in protective gear to (if you feel up to it) grab you from behind and murmur unnerving things in your ear, and then you get to try out your newly-learned skills for realsies. I have some very powerful memories of being attacked by an off-duty cop and taking him OUT… I felt emotionally prepared for it, and I feel like I have the capabilities to take out an attacker now if I have to, because I’ve felt what it’s like in a controlled environment and I’ve succeeded in hurting the guy who attacked me, so I know I can do it again. Moreover, I know how to avoid the situation in the first place. I really feel like it’s a desperately important skill set to have in this day and age, and it’s given me a great awareness of my surroundings and has really put me in control of some subsequent sketchy situations.</p>
<p>* it is a big deal to be touched by a man you don’t even know. It’s sexual harassment, not a little thing like the men who do things like that like to pretend it is.*</p>
<p>As soon as they intrude into your space- even before they touch you- send signals.
If they touch you act like you are on fire.</p>
<p>Most people are fine- but you can learn to pick up on the sketchy ones and those ones you need to be clear with immediately- because " if you give em an inch"…</p>