<p>So our kids go off to college and even as freshmen, and just barely of legal age, we are held at a distance and expected to accept we have no rights any longer without our students approval. We pay the bills. We still provide support. They are arguably less prepared to live independently than previous generations due to being especially sheltered and because so much time has been spent with their noses in electronics-computers, cell phones, tablets-such that they dont have patience or an attention span or developed social skills. In short, legally they may not, but realistically, they still do…need us. So…WHAT WOULD YOU DO…</p>
<p>If you learned one of your freshman’s classmates had been held by the police and FBI and questioned for several hours. Parents never notified. No attorney present. Now the kid thinks he can handle it without telling his parents. You recognize he is being asked to provide information that will lead to his indictment, though misguided. If you were his parents, would you want some stranger calling you and telling you when your son decided he would not? Do you think it would be a huge violation of his right to privacy or to make his own decisions? What would you do in this situation? What would you want if you were a parent of his friend’s? What would you want if you were his parents?</p>
<p>This is a tough one. We generally take the approach of wanting to call the parents to protect the young adult. Others would argue he is a legal adult. Too much is at stake. What would YOU do?</p>
<p>Where are you getting this from? From your freshman? How sure are you of the accuracy of this information? Has anyone at the school been notified about this supposed FBI/police questioning? Does the freshman’s classmate have a lawyer? There’s free legal advice/ombudsmen on many campuses and the very least your freshman could suggest the classmate seek counsel. But it’s hard to say what I would do since some of these details sound a bit, how shall I put it, suspect. </p>
<p>I see two issues here: 1) the kid is legal, so from that standpoint any decisions taken without asking the parent or an attorney is the kid’s problem to deal with. Not much you can do after the fact. 2) However, the kid really should know he does not have to talk without an attorney present. As parent, you pay for the attorney. This is an adult we are talking about. But, the scenario presented all seems like problems caused by a kid not understanding his legal right to shut up without counsel present.</p>
<p>This is entirely accurate. Definite FBI/police questioning. Lounge next to my kids room. Classmates listened at door. Hallmates have been talking w the student since the Police/FBI left and encouraging him to inform his parents and to seek legal aid. .I’m not revealing more information because I wouldn’t want it to be traceable but I am 100% certain of its accuracy. University was not involved and we find universities take a hands off approach-it isn’t their place to protect students-they are “adults”. Not familiar with the concept of free legal advice/ombudsmen being available on campus but will look into that tonight. Exams begin tomorrow-crappy time for authorities to turn this kid and his hallmates lives upside down.</p>
<p>Cut the cord. You had your 18 (more or less) years to instill morals/ethics/values in your child. You don’t own your children. There comes a time to trust you did a good job of raising your child. If s/he becomes involved with the law either they want your input or don’t. Whether they choose to involve you or not depends on your relationship with them at the time. </p>
<p>I had no choice in what I would do. My son was independent enough to make his own choices without always telling us, even while in college starting while under 18. I was proud of him for taking part in protests in Madison when there were state capital sit-ins a few years ago, we would have also done so if we were there. </p>
<p>This generation is no more/less sheltered than previous ones. They have a different data base, that’s all. </p>
<p>The privacy laws are good for not allowing interfering parents to continue to control their children’s lives. The adult child can always give permission for parents to know things- if the adult/child relationship is good the child is likely to include parents in situations.</p>
<p>We all have to grow up sometime. Some will never run foul of the law, others will do so before of legal age. My advice to my son was “Keep it legal”. I trusted him to know right from wrong (he developed an internal locus of control, not some church imposed external reasoning for behavior he could reject).</p>
<p>I would not be able to do anything unless asked. That is the way it should be. My child is his own person. The law gives adults legal protection from parents for good reasons. Don’t meddle.</p>
<p>That’s a tough call but it sounds like you don’t know the family well - if at all - which inclines me to suggest you stay out of it since you don’t know the full extent of the issues involved (and perhaps the apple doesn’t fall far from the tree?). Some folks don’t like hearing bad news and the parents may not appreciate that you’re only trying to help. In fact, you may put yourself and/or your own son in danger if you decide to get involved. </p>
<p>If dorm mates have encouraged the student to take reasonable steps like telling his parents then you should probably leave it alone and let him decide if/when/how to tell them. </p>
<p>Thanks, everyone, for weighing in. I really appreciate it. Please indulge me as I challenge some of your responses-not to reject your advice but to provide more clarity, again without revealing enough for it to somehow be traceable, but enough to see if you would take the same stance if some of your concerns/questions were answered.</p>
<p>There is no danger to our son or to us.</p>
<p>It is not a matter of the apple not falling far from the tree-the parents are normal, responsible.</p>
<p>So first of all, what he is being investigated for is not “simple” legal issues of college kids like drugs or alcohol or fake IDs. What he is being questioned about I can’t reveal but he is in jeopardy of being kicked out of school unfairly. It could affect his whole future, educationally and professionally. The kid is a genius, has been recognized extensively for being so, and in a way, it is why he is being questioned. He is not a social misfit or prone to any violence. He is a good kid and has already accomplished much in his life.</p>
<p>No, we don’t know his parents well at this point, but our sons plan to room together off campus next year (with 3 other guys). I don’t know that that really means much, whether or not we know them well. Some of our closest friends (couple 1) kept secret from other closest friends (couple 2) that they (couple 1) had learned couple 2s kid was gay, at age 15, and suicidal about it, and couple 1 did not inform couple 2. I would have wanted to be told. I would have told. People have different perspectives. I don’t think the kid’s right to privacy was more valuable than his parents right to be able to provide support.</p>
<p>Again, thanks, and do we really let this kid be jeopardized because he is too young to know not to answer questions or does not have the knowledge of his rights so that he might be dragged through something that ultimately turns out to be a misunderstanding but could in the meantime cost him his full scholarship, his college career, and whatever other fallout can come that is irreversible even once one’s name is cleared?</p>
It sounds like the kid has already been given good advice by the other students. </p>
<p>Did your son ask you to intervene? Obviously, you weren’t there, you don’t really know the kid well – so I don’t really see where it is your place to be calling the parents. If your son feels strongly that his friend is making a mistake – perhaps he should be the one to contact the other kids’ parents. At least it appears that he has some direct information as to what is going on. </p>
<p>I realize that you are trying to be vague enough to protect the kid’s privacy – but it’s odd that you are making a connection between an FBI investigation (federal crime) and loss of a scholarship. I mean - if the kid is charged with a federal crime, loss of scholarship will be the least of his problems. And his parents are definitely going to find out if he is arrested and charged with a crime.</p>
<p>I think this is a serious problem, but I just don’t see how you are or should be involved at this point. I think you should hold off and at least see if this is one of those problems that resolves itself. Obviously the legal issues won’t resolve themselves, but it seems to me that there’s a good chance that the kid will tell his parents on his own.</p>
<p>One other comment: when you talk about kids being “especially sheltered” -to the extent that is true, it’s probably because of too much parental involvement and sheltering. Part of the problem, to the extent that it exists, may stem from parents who always rush to the rescue-- and it seems to me that your basic inclination is to do just that – or to prod the other kid’s parents into doing that. </p>
<p>Also – you said that the kid was “held” for several hours by the police and FBI, but then you say that it took place in the dorm lounge – so it doesn’t sound like the kid was legally detained. He might not have been sophisticated enough to know that he was free to leave-- but I am just wondering whether you have as accurate a picture of what happened and what stage the investigation is at as you believe. </p>
<p>Anyway, I think you should hold off. I don’t think the test is as simple as whether you would want t know about something like this as a parent. As a parent, there are lots of things I would want to know about that goes on in my kids lives, and plenty that they don’t want to share – and part of task of parenting is to come to terms with the fact that young adults do not always want to involve their parents when they run into problems. </p>
<p>He was detained, in the lounge, and underwent two hours of questioning. I think anything he said is admissible as evidence. He did not know he could walk out without causing more trouble for himself.</p>
<p>I think when there is a federal investigation, a school (or any business/corporation) may cut and run to protect themselves before an issue has gone all the way through a court system.In a highly sensitized situation with potential ramifications once word is out, innocent until proven guilty can get tossed out the window and the student could be dismissed.</p>
<p>My inclination is definitely to rush to the rescue, which is why I put this out here for other feedback. Because the potential cost and consequences are high for this student if his rights aren’t protected and he is unjustly accused (though later cleared), I wanted to know if that would cause other parents to give a heads up when they might otherwise stay hands off. It looks as though even with the stakes being high, the consensus is to let him hang himself.</p>
<p>I’m probably in the minority but I’ve told my kids they are on their own if they get arrested. I’ve also let them know that if that happens the record will follow them for the rest of their lives and could cause them to be unemployable or unable to rent an apartment. My oldest daughter received a speeding ticket and paid it herself when she was 18 and didn’t tell me about it. I eventually found out but was happy she took care of it. I assume I would probably help them out if needed but I hope they realize doing something illegal is not worth the punishment and will avoid doing it. I guess I need to tell them to demand an attorney before answering any police questions.</p>
<p>If your son’s friend is never charged, and only questioned, hopefully he won’t be kicked out of school or lose his scholarship if he’s cleared.</p>
<p>@dowzerw – in the field of criminal law, the word “detained” has a very specific and very important meaning. If he was “detained” then the investigating officers would have to Mirandize him (read him his rights) – and if they did not do that, then nothing he said would be admissible in any case with him. If, on the other hand, the officers merely asked him to hang around and talk to them – and he was free to leave if he wanted – then no need for the Miranda rights, and everything he said would be admissible. I doubt very seriously that he was “detained” for 2 hours in a dorm lounge within the legal, technical meaning of the term. </p>
<p>The reason I raise that point is that it sounds like you have formed an impression based on an an incomplete understanding of what has taken place – understandable, given that your likely source of information is probably your son. </p>
<p>A lot of the stuff you have posted doesn’t make sense. Why are you worried that this young man will be “unjustly” accused based on his own statements? Yes, there are times when law enforcement are out to get someone and try to trick the person and twist their words around… but it is not something that typically happens in the lounge of a college dorm. Sounds to me more like the kid may be in trouble for something he actually did or got involved with.</p>
<p>If you want to call the kids’ parents, go ahead. It’s hard for me to see how that helps matters very much at this point, but if it makes you feel better, so be it. Just be prepared for the possibility that you call will not be appreciated.</p>
<p>And I still think that this story doesn’t quite add up – and I don’t know if the missing pieces are items are things that you are holding back because of privacy concerns, or things that you simply aren’t aware of at this point. But no one can really give you advice based on the bits and pieces that you are able to share right now. There’s a pretty big range of possibilities that might result in federal agents showing up on a college campus – none of them good, but some of them potentially a lot worse than others.</p>
<p>As to your question: “, I wanted to know if that would cause other parents to give a heads up when they might otherwise stay hands off.” – I personally would need to know a LOT more facts (not rumors) before getting involved. Again: is your son asking you to intervene at this point? </p>
<p>I agree with calmom, the FBI would not detain somebody in a dorm lounge. If the student were a suspect in something, after a two hour talk the kid most likely would have said enough to implicate himself and would be arrested at that time. I would not think it was my place as a parent to call his parents, he is an adult. </p>
<p>I would stay way out of this situation. As for your son, this kid may have been a future roommate but right now, maybe,
maybe not. That would be the only aspect that concerns you right now, especially if you don’t know the student well, nor his parents. </p>
<p>Telling his parents without his knowledge would be a huge violation of his privacy and even with the best intentions, I can’t see that ending well for anyone: you, your son, the parents or the student in question. Also, if this is big enough news, don’t assume his parents do NOT know. </p>
<p>Well, since we have a lot of attorney friends, I’d probably call. Parents are a needed part to get kids out of trouble often. Hey, you heard it through the grapevine which is not very private. And his mug shot on the internet won’t be private either. I would want a heads up as a parent. If they already know okay, you’ve done your part out of concern and if they don’t know then they need to.</p>
<p>I see things differently. If the questioning happened in the dorm then a lot of student know about it and in a college setting I am sure by now a lot of people if not all know it. Not that private if you ask me. If I knew the parents or if my child knew them I would inform them. If I were in the situation I would want to be informed. I am not saying that this is the “right” thing to do but I would have done it. </p>
<p>As for “being on your own if arrested”–a speeding ticket is not being arrested.
Don’t expect a “thank you” if you do call–either way it’s tough for the parents on the other end but I’d still do it. Ask your son for an update before you do call.</p>
<p>Few months ago, someone at D1’s firm was in danger of being fired because they were blaming him for something he didn’t do. He was frantic, but he didn’t have anyone to strategize on what to say or do. D1 asked me for my advice. I was giving her a long list what he should say or do, then all of sudden I heard D1 say, “Here, this is my mom, talk to her, she’ll help.” I spent some time advising him of his rights and how to negotiate for the the best package. I told him that he should NOT be let go due to wrong doing because he would not be able to work in finance again after that. Thankfully, there was a happy ending, the young man was clear of everything.</p>
<p>OP - could your son convince his friend to talk to you on the phone? I wouldn’t get too involved with the situation, but it would be helpful if you could just convince him to get his parents help or at least get some legal advice asap. Sometimes it is easier to speak to another adult other than one’s parents. If after you spoke with him and he still didn’t want to get his parents involved then you’ve done what you could. </p>
<p>If it were my son I would want to know about it. It’s possible that the kid is too scared to call his parents and let them know what is going on. </p>
<p>I am going to put myself in the parents shoes…I would DEFINITELY want to know. All of the arguments all are well and good…but it’s a well known fact that the pre-frontal cortex of the brain is not fully grown until kids are in their early to mid 20’s. They are risky, they make mistakes…they don’t think thru things (ie not telling their parents when they are in serious trouble). I think that the scenario you have painted is a bit scary, that the kid was taken advantage of and that you should inform the parents exactly what you know. I agree…don’t expect a “thank you”. i would be brief, tell them you would want to know if it was your child, and that you wanted them to know. I agree with gouf78 about…find out the latest details. </p>
<p>If I were the parents, yes I would want to know! But if I were the adult child, I probably would not want my folks to know. If the revelation of the information to the parents is inevitable, tell them. Their early involvement could help. But they may not welcome the news or want to be close to you. </p>