<p>Don’t forget hammers.</p>
<p>Crimes such as this and other “day to day” crimes are committed out of opportunity and convenience. Why go three cities over to rob someone when you can rob the person living down the street? 86% of whites are killed by other whites. 93% of blacks are killed by other blacks. These statistics are so high because American communities are segregated, due in large part to our ugly racial history (that lots of Americans think is not relevant) and gentrification. Blacks tend to live in predominantly black neighborhoods, same for whites. 14% of whites are killed by non-whites. 7% of blacks are killed by non-blacks. The higher percentage of same race black crimes can be attributed to the correlation (not causation or result) of socioeconomic status and race (which is due again to lots of mechanisms still in place due to our racial history and present), and not that “blacks are more violent”. And even though there’s a 7% difference between whites and blacks, I don’t see anyone running a legitimate statistical analysis to determine whether this is a statically significant difference. Where is the outcry over the 7% and 14% of blacks and whites, respectively, being killed by someone of another race? Should Obama talk about every single non-same-race crime? Why wasn’t this put on the past presidents? Don’t they relate to these crimes because of their whiteness?</p>
<p>FYI: Obama was raised culturally black. And America (read: White America, because please don’t kid yourselves, white people have always been and still are in power, and no amount of “proper grammar” or “pants around waist” -ing of blacks will change that) doesn’t care how much whiteness someone has. One drop of black and you’re out (remind yourselves who created the “one drop” rule). </p>
<p>There is a difference between a documented hatred for a race and killing/harming someone because they were in the wrong place at the wrong time. Intersectionality IS real and is always relevant, however. Just to different degrees and different axes of personal identity. </p>
<p>Here’s an article. Feel free to search your preferred search engine for “black on black crime myth” and such. </p>
<p>“The predictable happened as soon as the race of the three teens charged in the Oklahoma slaying of Christopher Lane, a young white Australian baseball player was known. Two are black. The cry immediately went up yet again that whites are in dire peril from being victimized, and likely killed by young blacks.”</p>
<p><a href=“http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/3790262[/url]”>http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/3790262</a></p>
<p>And:
<a href=“http://m.colorlines.com/archives/2012/04/crime_myths.html[/url]”>http://m.colorlines.com/archives/2012/04/crime_myths.html</a></p>
<p>Here’s an excerpt from a great article. You don’t have to read all of this one, but you should. </p>
<p>"Black people cant talk to white people about race anymore. Theres really nothing left to say. There are libraries full of books, interviews, essays, lectures, and symposia. If people want to learn about their own country and its history, it is not incumbent on black people to talk to them about it. It is not our responsibility to educate them about it. Plus whenever white people want to talk about race, they never want to talk about themselves. There needs to be discussion among people who think of themselves as white. They need to unpack that language, that history, that social position and see what it really offers them, and what it takes away from them. As James Baldwin said, As long as you think that you are white, there is no hope for you.</p>
<hr>
<p>Do you remember how Clinton was vilified for wanting to have a national conversation on race? People thought it was unnecessary, that he was a race traitor, that it would lead to reparations for slavery, that it would make white people feel bad for things that were not their fault. White people dont want to hear about race because the dont want to be called racists or they cannot see how they are responsible for something they didnt do. That report talks a lot about white privilege. It was no surprise to me that it was not widely read and discussed."</p>
<p><a href=“http://goodmenproject.com/ethics-values/why-i-dont-want-to-talk-about-race/”>http://goodmenproject.com/ethics-values/why-i-dont-want-to-talk-about-race/</a></p>
<p>(Note: I won’t be returning to this thread because any comments I make after this post will be exactly what I said here. Don’t jump at a comment that’s different than yours, take a few minutes to actually be open minded and truly understand what’s being said.)</p>
<p>@hunt.</p>
<p>The point of all of this is that when we have the knee-jerk reaction of “on noes, the guns!” we miss another chance to get to the root cause of why some people are willing to kill for fun and have no regard for human life. </p>
<p>I just posted another sad story about a WWII vet who was just beaten to death for no apparent reason. WTH is going on?</p>
<p>I am just waiting for some murderer to invoke a version of the twinky defense “I wouldn’t have done it if I didn’t have access to those evil, evil guns”.</p>
<p>collegedad, we all want to get to the root causes of random violence and lack of regard for human life. As zoosermom and I have both asked, what is it about young men that gives them the propensity for extreme acts like this one?</p>
<p>And I strongly disagree with you and Hunt and anyone else who says guns are no more a problem than baseball bats and hammers and knives and other common household objects that can be turned into weapons. The fact is, gun violence is out of control in this country. Guns enable people to act quickly–without “thinking things through”–and with greater propensity for harm (and collateral damage) than any of the other items you describe. It seems every week there is another story of a toddler shooting a sibling or a gun-safety expert “accidentally” shooting someone in their class. In my opinion, proponents of gun rights would gain a lot of credibility if they would simply admit that we have a problem and that we need to do something.</p>
<p>Speaking of the gun-safety expert:</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>[Accidental</a> shooting was not first for firearms instructor | The Columbus Dispatch](<a href=“http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/public/2013/08/21/accidental-shooting-was-not-first-for-firearms-instructor.html]Accidental”>http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/public/2013/08/21/accidental-shooting-was-not-first-for-firearms-instructor.html)</p>
<p>@sally305 "In my opinion, proponents of gun rights would gain a lot of credibility if they would simply admit that we have a problem and that we need to do something. "</p>
<p>I think it is disingenuous to claim that gun rights proponents don’t believe there is a problem.</p>
<p>How about a national mental health database that could be used to cross-check against gun registration requests? Something the NRA proposed since they seem to think there is an issue related to gun ownership and mental health.</p>
<p>[The</a> NRA wants an ?active? mental illness database. Thirty-eight states have that now.](<a href=“http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2012/12/21/the-nra-wants-an-active-mental-illness-database-thirty-eight-states-have-that-now/]The”>http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2012/12/21/the-nra-wants-an-active-mental-illness-database-thirty-eight-states-have-that-now/)</p>
<p>The Delbert Belton crime in Spokane in my mind is really disturbing to me, it should garner more attention then this or TM in my mind. It compares to the teens that shot the toddler in the face, there is just no respect for the other people’s lives in these crimes.</p>
<p>collegedad, I am all for a mental health registry, among many other measures I believe we can take to make people safer when guns are around. What was your reaction to the gun-safety “expert” and his careless behavior? Do you think training needs to be more rigorous, or perhaps that people who accidentally shoot someone (or let someone else have access to their guns) should have their licenses or weapons taken away?</p>
<p>^I know my opinion is that he broke the number one rule of gun safety by treating the gun like it wasn’t loaded. He was reckless and paid the price, being reckless has the same consequences with any thing that has the potential for great danger.</p>
<p>Wow.</p>
<p>[White</a> House spokesman ‘not familiar with’ Chris Lane murder | The Daily Caller](<a href=“White House spokesman ‘not familiar with’ Chris Lane murder | The Daily Caller”>White House spokesman ‘not familiar with’ Chris Lane murder | The Daily Caller)</p>
<p>It took almost a month before the president commented on the Trayvon Martin killing. This happened last week.</p>
<p>All that link shows is that the Fox reporter who asked the question is not a legitimate journalist.</p>
<p>But raiders, is it the same? First of all, the two people he shot paid a higher price than he did. If I am operating a table saw and screw up, the only person likely to be hurt is me. With a car, yes, of course a similar outcome can and does occur but also every day there are thousands of accidents that are avoided by the RESPONSE of other people on the road. A person at the wrong end of a gun doesn’t have that option.</p>
<p>Riprorin, maybe the spokesperson was confused when the Fox News questioner referred to the 3 black shooters…</p>
<p>The spokesmouth probably has no idea about this incident either. </p>
<p><a href=“http://www.kxly.com/news/spokane-news/elderly-man-dies-after-being-attacked-outside-ice-arena/-/101214/21574858/-/9flm7iz/-/index.html[/url]”>http://www.kxly.com/news/spokane-news/elderly-man-dies-after-being-attacked-outside-ice-arena/-/101214/21574858/-/9flm7iz/-/index.html</a></p>
<p>I agree. I was shocked. Not to put it all on the parents, but I believe the parents had something to do with raising kids who could do something like this. Did the kids have any supervision growing up, were parents there to support them in any way, to guide them? Were they in a chaotic household with too many siblings? Maybe drugs had something to do with their indifference? I feel so sad for the parents of the boy who was killed.</p>
<p>However, when white on black crime occurs it brings out EVERYONE (the President, Sharpton and the rest) but when a crime like this occurs— who comes out to talk about racism? Nobody. It’s not PC.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Parents are to blame? Perhaps not always the case. Another Oklahoma CBM in the following link. Seem to have had upper middle class (white) parents.</p>
<p>[This</a> Cold-Blooded Murderer Could Help Prove There’s A ‘Killer Gene’ - SFGate](<a href=“http://www.sfgate.com/technology/businessinsider/article/This-Cold-Blooded-Murderer-Could-Help-Prove-4576969.php]This”>http://www.sfgate.com/technology/businessinsider/article/This-Cold-Blooded-Murderer-Could-Help-Prove-4576969.php)</p>
<p>“hate” crime at it’s purest undisputed form, that will never ever be labeled as such simply because of the race of parites involved…hipocrosy of the highest degree and the only thing we can do is smile and nod and smile and nod…this situation is created by our own brains, there is nobody else who did it for us. The rest of the world will start openning eyes on what is going on here, they will not continue being stupid…</p>
<p>deeza, one of the fathers claims to have known where his son was 95% of the time - that may be more than many of us know of our kids. As teens, we can’t monitor their every move, and as hard as we try, we are not going to know all of their friends as well as we would like. I don’t think the home life is such a big issue in this case as their individual personality traits. And even in cases where the home life is not ideal, it is usually only one of many factors.</p>
<p>I like the way the suspects were described in riprorin’s latest link - two males, who happen to be African American. To some it might not seem such a big distinction, but it really is. Their race is part of their decription, not necessarily their identity. When race is part of the headline, or is used as the main identity, it often leads to rants about race, particularly when the perpetrators are black. </p>
<p>Deeza - I’m sorry but your last statement can’t stand. half of this discusiion is about racism, and part of it is fueled by the fact that some media outlets didn’t fact check, and reported this as a crime commited by 3 black youth (and posted an incorrect picture of the one who clearly would not be identified by most as black).</p>
<p>deeza, you must have missed the part where the right-wing media jumped all over this as soon as it happened…and where the Fox reporter YESTERDAY misrepresented all the kids as “black.”</p>
<p>Remember this case from a few years back? I don’t remember “EVERYONE (the President, Sharpton and the rest)” saying a single word. And it WAS a hate crime, and was prosecuted as such.</p>
<p>[Three</a> men plead guilty to federal hate crimes in Mississippi killing - CNN.com](<a href=“http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/22/justice/mississippi-hate-crime]Three”>http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/22/justice/mississippi-hate-crime)</p>