<p>Wait; there are only 2 siblings in my family. You mean my parents might have done it more than twice? :eek:</p>
<p>well not yours mafool but snowballs certainly were ;)</p>
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<p>No, it’s not. I did not realize you were the son. I hope that all of your children are straight, for their sakes, not yours.</p>
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<p>Yes, it is, in the context that matters to my parents. And given that it’s their house, it is their premises that matter.</p>
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<p>If I ever have children. You might consider my uncertainty a boon to society. And the implication that I would not love my children is, (should be) needless to say, deeply offensive and obviously untrue. There is a distinction between person and action. I can acknowledge that difference.</p>
<p>Baelor, I respect you have strong convictions, but please believe sexual orientation isn’t a choice, it just is. Should a person be denied love, happiness, commitment because they are gay? I can’t believe in a god that would punish good people because of who they are “hard wired” to love.</p>
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<p>I do. This has never been an issue of contention for me.</p>
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<p>What you can or cannot believe is not my concern at this point, so believe in whatever you want – your perceptions of ontological truth are clearly your own to have, however correct or incorrect they may be.</p>
<p>That said, should we, with our current technology, deny blind people the joy of driving? Everyone is called to different paths in life, and everyone has his struggles to overcome, whether they occur every day or once a month. So I don’t view it from the lens of denial, but rather of liberation stemming from the fulfillment of divine purpose. I’m keeping it at a very high level right now, because I think that further discussion would be derailing this topic too much.</p>
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<p>The statement gay marriage is a total oxymoron or not valid is deeply offensive and obviously untrue. And if you want to unconditionally love all of your children, even if they are gay, then you’ll need to come with to terms with the fact that believing some of your children should enjoy their full civil rights and some should not does not fall into that catagory. Of course, you can conditionally love them, a lot of parents make that choice and blame it on religion. </p>
<p>Here’s the thing…I am very close, in fact closely related, to a lot of families like yours but you don’t know any like mine on that level. If I had a dime for every gay or lesbian friend of mine who is completely closeted to their conservative, conditionally loving family, I’d never have come here seeking financial aid advice. Their families would wager everything they have on the “fact” that their grandparent, parent, child, Aunt, Uncle, etc. is straight. And they’d be dead wrong. </p>
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<p>That’s exactly what I did. My liberal parents were behind me100% because their support and love are not conditional. </p>
<p>And I’ll do the same for whatever choice my son and his valid husband make in their non-oxymoronic marriage.</p>
<p>Baelor, I wasn’t looking for you to validate my beliefs, I was just making a statement, nor did I attack you personally. I am technologically backward, but hey if blind people can drive safely???</p>
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<p>It’s a good thing that I said it in the context of my framework. It’s factually true for some people – their laws, religion, beliefs, etc. do not allow for gay marriage because “marriage” is defined in a way that only admits heterosexual couples. So you’re basically telling them that the way they’re using a word is wrong. It’s a completely subjective statement, which is why I, as a rational poster, only used it in the proper context. Whether it’s offensive or not is a different question.</p>
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<p>First of all, not true – I don’t care about civil rights at all. I only care about human rights, which are vastly different. And if you think that I cannot love my children unconditionally while at the same time believing that they cannot marry the person whom they “love,” it is your children for whom I fear, because at least one of their parents has no concept of unconditional love.</p>
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<p>While other parents also love their children conditionally but mask the limitations thereof by claiming that unconditional love means letting the child do whatever he wants.</p>
<p>Again, don’t delve into issues that you don’t understand. Gay marriage is not something that is as simple as rights v. oppression – if you believe that, no wonder you think anyone who opposes gay marriage is totally irrational.</p>
<p>Okay. This is one of those issues that can never be resolved. Baelor, we understand your beliefs, but please understand that they are hurtful to many here. And parents are protective of their children, and it feels you are directly attacking their children.</p>
<p>That said, I profoundly disagree with you and support pugmadkate unconditionally.</p>
<p>I don’t want to try and change your mind because I understand that you are devoted to your beliefs.</p>
<p>Baelor, there are some posters here who find your comments on gay marriage personally offensive and I think it’s time we wrapped up this part of the thread.</p>
<p>Live and let live.</p>
<p>I do understand that they are deeply offensive to some people. But I answered the OP, and then people posted responses to me. I’m going to respond to them. As long as people move on, I will – but I hate leaving things hanging.</p>
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<p>Tell that to the U.S. legal system, and let me know what its response is.</p>
<p>I believe in my lifetime, and certainly in yours, Baelor, that gay marriage will ultimately be legalized in all 50 states. Like it or not, I think that is where we are headed…just a matter of time.</p>
<p>I don’t think we are going to change any minds here.
I’m relieved that there hasn’t been more invective. Can we leave this now?</p>
<p>I hope. 10char</p>
<p>Here here! Or is it Hear hear! I’ve never known.</p>
<p>Back to the original question…</p>
<p>Put them both in the guest room, close the door and don’t discuss what they do behind the closed door. That’s their business and not yours. Chances are they’ll be too squicked out to have sex in their parents’ house, but if they’re not, who cares?</p>
<p>Be thankful that they are happy (it sounds), healthy, and still want to come home and spend time with you. There are far bigger things to worry about.</p>
<p>Our experience was that we predicated all the restrictions on our older two when in college upon the fact that they had a youngest brother in middle school/early high school. </p>
<p>The problem has now become, on what basis do we now tell that youngest brother, when he’s a junior in college, that our “sense of the house” (the term we used l0 years ago) means he and his visitors need to occupy separate bedrooms for visits home from college. Who is he trying to mold/impress/not scare…the dog?</p>
<p>If we lighten up on the rules, expect howls of “unfair!” from the two older sibs who had to endure the Regime of Separation in their heydey. (They do howl about that, convinced the youngest got everything easiest; classic.)</p>
<p>I realized the youngest child’s dilemma when, after years of hearing us tell the older two about “sense of the house”, my own brother showed up to stay for a week with his significant other. That brother asked his nephew to grab him some linens, and the poor kid didn’t know whether to grab singles or doubles from the closet. He looked at me helpless, as if to say, “no matter what I do here, I’m going to offend someone!” I gestured him away and said, “never mind, I’ll handle it.” So I’m supposed to tell my 60-year-old big brother and his mate what not to do in my house? Not likely, not in this life. </p>
<p>I suppose all 3 of my kids come to a consistent conclusion that closing off behind doors without marriage is a prerogative of old(er) age. Not sure which is the age, but that’s the only lesson we seem to have communicated around here. It does seem like a lot of effort for a rather tiny lesson.</p>
<p>paying3tuitions- I find that interesting. I would have no problem telling my older brother (in my case, 54 years old) what he can do in my house if he were doing something against the rules of my home. If he were to light up a cigarette in our home I would tell him to put it out or take it outside. If he wanted to sleep with his unmarried partner I would tell him he couldn’t in my home. I would also expect him to do the same in his home if I did something against his beliefs.</p>
<p>My father wanted to visit with his girlfriend and assumed that they would stay in the same room. I reminded him that we had a 14 year old here; he immediately changed his mind.</p>
<p>I think it is perfectly acceptable to tell our kids that we do not want them to share a room with their gf/bf because
- it makes us uncomfortable
- it is confusing to younger siblings</p>
<p>When the youngest becomes old enough to want to do this but too young for our comfort, there is still #1.</p>