<p>They are not fat jokes, BOTW- they are a response to toodleoos snarky comments about pi$$ing off the op by buying two harleys. Lighten up (pun intended).</p>
<p>And as for social security, my moms benefits stopped the day she died. Dad didnt get a dime of her Social security. He was already at full retirement age and had no dependents. That is when hers stopped. However, if he had died, she would have gotten his SS. Thats how it was explained to me.</p>
<p>I’ll admit to not being well versed about motorcycles as I really hate them. I also was hit by a motorcycle (as a pedestrian) when I was a teen. But I just looked up Harleys and there are plenty of models that do not cost $25,000. I don’t see why this has to be an all or nothing proposition and perhaps there is a Harley model that is not hubby’s ideal, but would be a new “toy” nonetheless.</p>
<p>From what I can gather about Social Security benefits, a person can either take benefits based on their own earnings, or their spouses. In our situation, my husband has been the primary wage earner. I finally qualified for benefits (40 quarters of earnings), but my SS benefits will be minimal (about $150 a month or less). However, I can draw on my husband’s earnings in spousal benefits – about 1/2 of his after he retires. If OP has worked most of her adult life with significant earnings, then it would probably be best for her to draw Social Security benefits based on her earnings. Her husband would draw on his earnings. If her husband died first, then his SS benefits would just go away. You can draw based on your income, or spouses income, NOT both. Also, is there a survivor benefit to the pensions, or do they go away if the recipient dies? Many pensions don’t leave anything to surviving spouses or will leave at a reduced rate. </p>
<p>My husband and I have been married 38 years. He spent 30 years in the military. He has a nice retirement. I did not work for most of the marriage because we moved 16 times in 30 years. We both felt that taking care of the children was my primary job. He has been retired now for 9 years. He has a great job in addition to his retirement. We do well, but I wish we had more in savings. That being said, DH bought a nice boat after he retired. I was happy that he did. He had always wanted one, but it wasn’t practical while he was on active duty. His father and his paternal grandfather both died of cancer when they were in their mid 50’s. So, he is the longest lived male on his father’s side in 3 generations. The brother 16 months younger than him died of a heart attack at 57 years of age. I wanted him to have the boat. He loves it. </p>
<p>About 3 years ago my husband and another brother went in together for some recreational property about 9 hours from where we live. It is gorgeous. While we don’t get up there as much as he would like, it is a joy to go there. When the opportunity came about, we went over finances together, and decided it was workable. However, he agreed that he would have to work an extra 3 to 4 years to help pay it off before he is finally retired. I believe that it will happen. I am a little nervous about it, but we could pay off either our house or the property right now and still have money left over, so I am okay with it. </p>
<p>All of that being said, I would veto a Harley – or any motorcycle, and be furious if he would buy one with my disapproval. He has his “toys” (for lack of a better word).</p>
<p>Social Security doesn’t matter whether it’s the man or woman’s. The remaining spouse after death gets the larger benefit, and in the past, that has usually been the man’s. </p>
<p>If the smaller earning spouse doesn’t have 40 credits (what is required to receive full SS), then that spouse receives approximately 1/2 of the other spouse’s SS (while both are living)…ex. H receives $18,000/yr. and W ~$9,000. This is assuming wife had not worked.</p>
<p>If W dies, H still receives his $18,000. If H dies, wife then receives his benefits.</p>
<p>Previous page stated they also receive survivor benefits–this is only if a child under age 18 is still in the home.</p>
<p>Carry on.</p>
<p>Thank you silverlady and sryrstress. Very helpful posts. That soc sec stuff has always been baffling to me.</p>
<p>And as for your H’s boat, silverlady- it sounds like you and your H thought these purchases through carefully, weighed the pros and the cons, the risks and the benefits (and no, that was not a fat reference, BOTW) and made choices and decisions based on the best information available to you at the time. And he was able to follow his dream- to own a boat, and to have part ownership in a vacation home even if it means risking himself by staying in the working world a bit longer. You made these decisions together, as a couple. Kudos to you both.</p>
<p>H wants a villa (or a farm house) in Italy. Oh wait, that’s what I want too.</p>
<p>If we ever get one, I will post a picture on CC.</p>
<p>My husband wants to get a condo somewhere with no state and city income tax where the golfing is fine. I’m totally ok with him doing that, but I wonder what his timeframe is because if he moves permanently to that condo when he retires as he says he will, I will be a lonely old lady because he is a city worker and will retire about twelve years before I do. I wouldn’t love that at all, but he is right that his working two jobs for so long means that he has really earned a retirement that is about him.</p>
<p>Ah, the old Under The Tuscan Sun dream. I. Think you’ll get it oldfort, everyone I know with an Italian villa has a Birkin bag. Really!</p>
<p>If your spouse dies, you qualify for survivor’s benefits. You don’t automatically lose half of your social security just because your husband dies.</p>
<p>Uh…my dad died 3 weeks ago. The SS amounts that will be coming to my parents home will be less than it was before.</p>
<p>My Dad got full amount.</p>
<p>My Mom got 1/2 of dad’s amount.</p>
<p>Now that dad died, the household will not still receive 1 1/2 amounts. The household will have less SS money coming in. She’ll now only get my dad’s amount. So she loses 33% of what they used to get.</p>
<p>Sorry for your loss.
I don’t recall HM my mom got from SS but she had a pension and SS, as did my dad. When she died 6 yrs ago they both went away (well her pension was almost up, as I believe it was a 10 yr cap thing, and he got a small cash payout) but it and her ss, which was close to his, stopped, so his monthly cashflow form those payouts about dropped in half. This is in part why I had to help him out financially with a large chunk that had been earmarked for our house remodel, as I mentioned pages and pages ago.</p>
<p>*
It’s called the three checkbook system, and it can save marriages.*</p>
<p>I agree that they need 3 accounts…one for her, one for him, and one for the family. </p>
<p>I think it would make him much more aware of how much his “finer things” really do cost. However, since he might accidentally-on-purpose overdraw to force extra deposits, perhaps a debit card or cash system would be better.</p>
<p>jym…thank you.</p>
<p>Pensions can be funny. It can depend how each one is set up. Since my dad was 10 years older than my mom and my mom didn’t have a retirement, he elected to take a smaller amount each month so that my mom would have Survivors Benefits. </p>
<p>However, I worked with an older lady whose husband refused to do that and when he died she ended getting nothing after his death…leaving her nearly impoverished…</p>
<p>Since your mom’s had a 10yr cap, she may not have had that option.</p>
<p>Mom’s pension had a 10 yr cap. I believe it was a union thing and they didnt have a choice on that one. As for the SS-- that still confuses me. Hers was almost as much as my dads (she worked fulltime for a long time) but hers went <em>poof</em> as soon as she died. My dad’s pension pays as long as he lives. It is not a lot, but it sure helps. </p>
<p>*** Wasn’t there was a post a minute ago about overdrafts and jailtime by BOTW ? But it, like my mom’s SS seems to have gone <em>poof</em>.</p>
<p>The OP said the issue of a Harley came up only a month ago. She described is as the latest toy on the “I want it, can I, can I?” list, not a lifelong dream,</p>
<p>this may be part of the problem that I don’t think has been discussed.</p>
<p>Maybe part of the reason why the OP is against this is because after he got this Harley, then there would be some other “have to have” item…and then another…and then another…because he’s never satisfied. </p>
<p>Since the H seems to be an “immediate gratification” sort of guy…rather than someone who plans for awhile and saves up for the item…that could also be a concern. What will be next?</p>
<p>Yeah there was but I deleted it…it didn’t sound right.</p>
<p>But basically, if a person writes too many bad checks, they can get jail time for check fraud. The new banking legislation makes it a lot harder for banks to charge overdraft fees and let the account sit in overdrawn status, and encourages them to return checks on an overdrawn account.</p>
<p>Back in my home state, usually about once a week I heard about somebody getting arrested for writing bad checks.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Yes, but this goes back to getting married to the wrong guy.</p>
<p>This trait is not something that is a new development. It’s something that we learn as we grow up and in our young adult years. He was likely that way before they got married, have been that way for 20 years, and will be that way for the next 20 years. At the age of 45-50, he’s not going to change.</p>
<p>Give him his own checkbook and let him figure out what he wants to buy.</p>
<p>^^^</p>
<p>I agree that each spouse needs some monthly allowance that they can spend immediately, or save for a larger expense.</p>
<p>As for being married to the wrong guy…that’s too harsh. This should have been confronted a long time ago in a way that would not be so frustrating. </p>
<p>The problem is that any solution at this point (like separate accounts) might be perceived as being too harsh for him, so he might not cooperate with it.</p>
<p>Most traditional pensions are a single life annuity (SLA) if you are single, and 50% Joint and Survivor 50% J&S) if you are married. </p>
<p>So Jane Doe has a pension of $1600/mo. She is single. She gets her $1600/mo. until she dies. No additional payments are made after that.
Julie Doe, if she were single, has a $1600/mo. SLA. However, she is married. The same $1600 single life pension gets converted to a 50% J&S, which means it’s reduced by ~10% so that the SLA and 50% J&S are actuarially equivalent. Julie gets $1440/mo (1600*.9) for the rest of her life. If Julie dies first, her husband gets 50% of the benefit – or $720/mo. If her husband dies first, Julie keeps getting the $1440 until her death. No further benefits will be paid after she dies.</p>
<p>If you are a married person and have a traditional (defined benefit) plan, the normal form of payment is a 50% J&S. You can choose a SLA or other form, but your spouse <em>must agree to waive his/her rights to that benefit</em> in writing, etc. Pension plans can offer other forms of annuities, but these are the two standard models.</p>
<p>My dad wanted my mom to sign the waiver so he could get an extra $200/mo in a straight life annuity. Mom called me asking if this was a good idea (I’m a pension administrator). NOt a good idea! My mom spent most of her working years at home and then at a minimum wage job. She NEEDS those spousal benefits.</p>
<p>I had a plan participant who retired to take care of her seriously ill husband, and he waived the J&S so they could have more money. The wife died three days after her first pension payment and her spouse got nothing.</p>
<p>Back to your regularly scheduled discussion! :)</p>
<p>If you are a married person and have a traditional (defined benefit) plan, the normal form of payment is a 50% J&S. You can choose a SLA or other form, but your spouse <em>must agree to waive his/her rights to that benefit</em> in writing, etc. Pension plans can offer other forms of annuities, but these are the two standard models.</p>
<p>From what I understood the “spouse must agree to waive his/her rights” has not always been true in all 50 states. Maybe laws changed in the last couple of decades in some states because too many widows found themselves with little money because their H’s chose SLA without their knowledge/agreement.</p>
<p>I don’t believe that the widow I worked with (20+ years ago) made such an agreement ( I think she was from Tennessee) or maybe her H talked her into it against her better judgment or understanding.</p>
<p>My dad wanted my mom to sign the waiver so he could get an extra $200/mo in a straight life annuity. Mom called me asking if this was a good idea (I’m a pension administrator). NOt a good idea! My mom spent most of her working years at home and then at a minimum wage job. She NEEDS those spousal benefits.</p>
<p>Laws needed to get enacted to protect (usually) women from H’s who are being rather short-sighted What does such an H think his widow is supposed to live on after he dies???</p>
<p>
Not sure one can legislate against stupidity :)</p>
<p>Some people (dk if this is more true for men or not) have trouble facing mortality, and believe they will outlive the odds. This is not good thinking for someone who is considering owning a motorcycle!!</p>
<p>This happened to the mother of a friend of mine. The husband (her dad) was a retired police officer. Never injured on the job in all his years on the force. Took the higher benefit with no spousal protection. Wife never worked (or maybe did briefly as a secretary). Shortly after retirement he has a massive MI and dies (no previous cardiac history, but was overweight). It wasn’t pretty.</p>