Let’s move on from discussing @George_Orwell
AKA @NiVo
AKA @Cool_HK_Flats
AKA @NIRVANANA
I’m unsure why he keeps making accounts when I, and other mods, clearly explained the rules.
And really, the father posing as the daughter is just beyond the pale. I wish her luck in her future endeavors.
If anyone wants to slog through the 2400 post to explore his daughter’s journey, here it is.
Looking at the results threads (and a little too much TikTok) I am really floored by the number of young people who apply to vastly different schools (based on rankings I am guessing) get in and then are not sure if the schools are a good fit. Is this on the colleges? The high schools? The parents? I just can’t wrap my head around it.
I think there is some trendiness/ peer pressure/ gotta catch em all Pokémon hunting in some application lists. I think of it like wanting the newest shoes that everyone wants, buying them online and THEN trying them on to see if they are comfortable. Great, you got in but you don’t like Greek life or you hate small northern towns, so why are you applying to school where those are distinguishing features!? (My own kid was not one of these, in some ways it’s a pro to not have the world as your oyster in college admissions, honestly.)
This doesn’t surprise me at all, nor is new, nor is unique to college decisions. In my experience, the vast majority of people don’t do the homework/research on anything, even major decisions in their lives. It’s incredibly common to hear homeowners complaining about some development in their area that was in the works long before they bought for example, and would have been easily known with even the slightest bit of online research before making the largest financial decision of their lives. The college decision process was no more sophisticated decades ago when I went. Most kinds picked based on what was nearby, their friends were going to, had heard of (from sports), etc. I could easily count on one hand the number that carefully considered “fit.” It doesn’t matter that we have more access to info now. People are no better informed than they ever were because most are still inherently lazy about doing the work to really understand something. Better tools don’t matter if someone doesn’t want to pick them up.
Some might be lazy. But others just don’t have strong views about it. I mean, I know people who spend weeks if not months scouring the nation to find a car with the exact trim package they want. Because they care about it. Which is fine. I just don’t care so I buy whatever’s on the lot, as long as I can afford it.
The notion that you must select a college that “fits” is going to be more important to some people than others. Some will want to carefully curate location, Greek life, research opportunities, sports, food and a host of other things.
But not caring isn’t necessarily laziness. Nor is it lazy to care, but prioritize cost, distance from home, presence of friends or other factors.
Also important is that carefully curating fit only matters to people who have an actual choice. If you are low stats or flat broke or both, you’re probably not spending a lot of time trying to figure out if you’d be happier at a state flagship or a SLAC.
I need to join this too!
I can only speak for my kid, but they grew and changed kind of a lot between making their list of schools to apply to and when decisions came out. In October, they were pretty sure they wanted a BFA in acting, hadn’t decided whether they wanted a larger school or a small LAC, and thought they wanted to be in a city.
It wasn’t that they didn’t do research; it was that along the way they took a sociology course and started writing plays, which made them realize they wanted a broader liberal arts education rather than a narrower BFA. And they spent some time in NYC and other cities and learned that they really preferred what I call ye olde college campus.
So there are a few schools they got into that are no longer a fit for them. And thankfully, a few more that are great fits. But it doesn’t mean (imo) that they were wrong for applying broadly in the first place.
The nosiness of arbitrary people in this college admissions process is truly invasive. That’s why I’m not mentioning the names of specific colleges that admitted S on this site. I’m well aware that confidentially is in name only.
After receiving the mail yesterday, I found an item sent to S24 from a college that admitted him that had been intentionally opened. The postal worker handed it to me directly while delivering a package with it. It had been obviously intentionally cut open on one side with a straight-edge sharp item. As far as I can tell, all of the items in the envelope were still there.
The information in that piece of mail will become common knowledge soon enough, but why would anyone be motivated enough to do this? What is the point?
I’ve been lurking CC and this thread for more than a year now. Question for all the amazing, wise, and supportive parents of Class of 2024: DS 24, high stats, ORM (but under ORM if you know what I meant ;), with pretty deep ECs applied to 10 schools. One safety, 2 match/target, and 7 super high reaches. He goes a HS classified as rural fringe in IA. We are very grateful that he got into 5, waitlisted at 2 and rejected at 3 (YSM, deferred and then rejected at Y). Thinking of doing chemical/bio-chemical or bio-medical engineering. We are a full pay family. Can you please give us your thoughts/feedback on how to choose among UPenn, Rice, and UIUC. I think he will not choose Grinnell (with founders’ merit scholarship) and pass on the flagship state (honors and full-tuition). He likes to go farther from home and is very adaptable to most of the environments. Thank you all!!
One thing I have noticed is a lot of such young people seem to be spending a lot of time on social media discussing colleges, rather than doing what I call Web 1.0 research (looking at admissions and department pages and such), let alone real world information gathering like visiting colleges. I think this leads to group-think/echo-chamber phenomena like the “T20” concept, and other similar sorts of generic approaches to determining which colleges, or for that matter majors and careers, are “good”/“impressive”/“prestigious”.
Indeed, when you think of it, that very equation (good = impressive = prestigious) is defining things in generic social terms, which kinda makes sense if what you are implicitly striving for is status on an anonymous social media platform. And my experience in occasionally trying to suggest in such contexts that may not be the best way to think about choosing a four-year educational and developmental experience is some people get rather defensive about it.
Of course it may seem a little hypocritical to be complaining about college-related social media here on a college-related social media platform, and I would not claim we are entirely immune to bouts of group-thinkish dynamics (although, seriously, why SHOULDN’T everyone be considering St Olaf?!?).
But I think for a variety of reasons, including the active moderation, and just the mix of people participating here, we tend to be much more focused on guiding people to external sources of information–admissions podcasts, college websites, visits, and so on–and then encouraging them to make up their own minds about what colleges make sense for them.
As a final thought, I don’t really think it is laziness per se that leads to some young people preferring to stick to peer-driven social media, since they spend a lot of time on it. I think some of it is just a resources thing–parents willing and able to arrange visits, say, is not something every kid has–and some is just a higher level of comfort with that way of gathering information.
But in the end, I don’t think that approach is usually serving these kids all that well, and Web 1.0 content is in fact free too.
So my understanding this is an area all three of those universities do, but the relevant programs at Illinois will be by far the biggest, followed by Penn, and then finally Rice. Size can be a pro or con, but I would think really diving into the related departmental and faculty websites, and seeing if any are more or less exciting, would be worth doing.
I can’t speak to UIUC, but obviously different simply because its a large state institution, and I am a BIG Grinnell fan, especially if grad school is in the future. Lots of respect from other academic institutions and excellent placement.
Anyway, my impression is that UPenn and Rice have extremely different cultures and that Rice is a much more gentle and nerdier (in a good way), while UPenn is quite intense and cut-throat (more play hard, party hard).
Mine is an engineer at Penn. She is more introverted, thoughtful, kind, and doesn’t love frat parties. She loves Penn! Her core engineering friends are from diverse backgrounds yet personality-wise are very similar to her. The vibe is intensely intellectual (or nerdy in the best way), but they have fun(karoake nights, movie nights, exploring the city). The Engineering programs have formals and the Penn museum just hosted a freshman evening event (not sure if it was for everyone or certian major?). She does know some wharton and nursing kids through her dance EC and has not met a large swath of crazy cutthroat kids. Most do clubs or arts that are entirely outside of engineering/stem: there are so many multidimensional students there. The “cutthroat “ is more rumor than anything. However—it is an intellectually intense school with difficult classes, and there are a lot of hours put into studying by most. The classes are collaborative and often there are groups that work together on psets(allowed and encouraged for many classes).
Go to all the visit days and have your kid make their own assessment of fit! Great choices.
FWIW, my friends get annoyed with me for always finding an innocent explanation for things, but…
I occasionally get mail that is for my neighbors not for me, but don’t notice until after I’ve opened it. I actually don’t usually look at my mail until I’ve opened all of it neatly with a letter opener. 
I usually write a note when this happens and just stick it in their mailbox, but I could absolutely see just putting it back in your own box for the mailman to re-deliver. 
I was thinking the same…we get others people’s mail/packages all the time and I rarely look at the address before opening.
They are young. They can see so many possible, but very different, future paths. They still do sometimes see the world as their oyster, and why take that away unless/until it needs to happen? Also, they sometimes can’t even think far enough ahead to have the outfit they desperately “need” out of the dryer until 5 minutes after they were supposed to have left the house, so choosing just one of several appealing, affordable, but different, choices…can be overwhelming.
I don’t think anyone is failing those kids. They are just still actively growing as people (probably distinct growth even since applications were submitted 5 months ago), and this process can be HARD. For D24, not a single one of her choices was perfect in every way, and she really struggled making a decision because each place shone in different areas (location, major, housing, food, opportunities, facilities, cost, etc.). At one tour, she was asked where she was deciding between, and the professor commented that the two places couldn’t be more different. It was obvious to him, not so much to her.
She bounced around for weeks, sure about one place, then another, then another. I was doing my best to just support, this had to be her decision. Much relief was felt on my part when I could finally tell she had made her final choice, but her process in getting there was her own (my job was making sure all the schools were affordable, and to help her think through the different options for her major).
On the other hand, I do worry about the kids whose plan is to take on crippling debt, and sometimes parents are failing their kids there. Colleges can be failing people as well, for instance with a very positive financial aid page (we have grants! many students get scholarships!), not mentioning that their latest CDS stated they only met on average 50% of the student need at the school. And then that would turn back to the high schools, who ideally would be tailoring their advice dependent on the amount the student’s family is willing/able to pay.
I cant speak to UPenn. However, I am very familiar with Rice and can share why my D24 chose to ED there.
Reputation is very collaborative. For many years Rice has been ranked among the highest for happiest students. They have a “culture of care”. The residential college system was built to make it inclusive with no Greek system.
Area around Rice. Rice University is in a very nice part of Houston. It’s surrounded by multi-million dollar homes. It’s also right next to MD Anderson - the largest cancer center in the US. Rice Village also offers quaint shops with tons of restaurants.
Diversity. Rice is one of the few schools? that’s >50% people of color. Not sure if ORM you mean Asian but Rice is 35% Asian. Houston is also extremely diverse with amazing restaurants everywhere.
Access to big city amenities. Concerts, activities, etc.
Houston is extremely hot and unbearable from June - August. However, it’s really nice from mid October - early May (the majority of the school year).
I can only hope that your innocent explanation is behind this.
I’ve become exhausted with people’s intrusiveness over the last few years well beyond the college admissions process but also with it.
I literally chased some neighbor’s au pair out of our backyard last week. She decided to avail herself of our backyard amenities, which are limited, because she thought no one was home. S24 had taken the car out and I was home.
Things that helped D24 make a decision
Looking at a sample 4 (or 5) year plan and the website. Are the classes more technical, more theoretical, more labs?Are there better facilities, cutting edge research, plentiful research for undergrads, famous faculty in the field, signature study abroad…something will set the school apart.
The short list visits. She was able to ask specific questions, compare the labs, interact with students/faculty, imagine herself sitting herself in the spot doing that work. She walked from a potential dorm to see what the “commute” would be like, ate in the food court nearest the building she would be spending most of her time, etc.
D24 popped by while I was writing this and wanted to add that she figured out which college was “best” in the major, and that she feels student life would have been good at any of her 3 top choices. I asked her what if she had 3 that were tied for “best” in the major and student life…cost was her next factor, then distance. D24 also said, eventually, she just knew.
Best of luck as S24 makes his choice.
This was extremely helpful for us.