I don’t know if this is the right place to write this, but to put it simply, my parents refuse to let me apply to “non-prestigious” schools.
I’m currently a senior, and my parents and I are immigrants from Asia. I came here when I was young and grew up in the US, so our views about college are drastically different. They think schools like USC, UCLA, UCB are “safety” schools, and I don’t agree, to say the least.
I see where they’re coming from, because they’re accustomed to Asian ideas centered around prestige and numbers. I have a chance based on just my SAT score (1590) and GPA (4.35 weighted, 4.0 unweighted), but my extracurricular activities are mediocre and I definitely think there are applicants with better essays out there.
I really don’t think I can make it to the Ivies or MIT or Caltech or any of those “top” schools my parents want me to apply to, and don’t think considering UCB, USC, UCLA as “safety” schools is enough. I seriously want to apply to other schools like NYU, Boston College, Oxy, Irvine, UCSD etc., where I think I have a better chance at, but my parents refuse to pay for the application fee and the tuition if I do end up choosing a school that isn’t good enough in their ridiculously high standards. I don’t want to go behind my parents’ backs not only because they refuse to pay for the tuition, but also because they’re my parents.
I’ve tried talking to them several times, but each time we just end up arguing and fighting and it’s incredibly draining and stressful. I don’t know how to approach them about this anymore, and am honestly terrified that I’ll end up a few months from now with no college to go to. Whenever I ask what I will do if all my applications are rejected, they get angry and tell me to stop thinking of what-ifs. They ask why I’m so insecure and not confident in myself, and no matter how much I try to explain that those top schools do NOT just look at grades, are extremely difficult to get in to, and that I really need some backups, they keep insisting that I can get in if I try hard enough.
If anyone has any advice on how to talk to them, or went through a similar process while applying for college, I’d really appreciate some help or words of advice. I know they love me and only want the best for me, but their views of prestige and my capabilities are far from mine and I don’t know what to do anymore.
Sorry this was kind of long.
Thanks.
Hopefully, your college counselor or guidance counselor can convince your parents that all students need a reach, match and safety. And for good reasons. Not do so so would be folly. If you want choices, you need more than one in each category.
With 1590 SAT and an unweighted 4.0 you have a good chance at USC, UCLA, and UCB. However, I agree with you that these are not safety schools.
I can think of three possible options. Obviously I don’t know what your parents would think of any of these and as such don’t know whether any of them would work.
One option is to agree with your parents to try very hard to get into these top ranked school but get them to let you apply to one or two true safety schools as well. It sounds like you have probably tried this and it sounds like it didn't work.
Another option is to get someone from your school, possibly your guidance counselor, to talk to them. Frequently people will listen to adults with official authority even when they won't listen to the same words coming from a teenager. To me this seems to have a decent chance to work, but of course I don't know your parents.
A third option is to apply to a "prestigious" school outside of the US. In the US getting into top schools is a bit of a lottery and is based on many factors, much of which is hard to predict. Outside of the US getting into top schools is largely based on stats, and yours are superb. Of course the closest prestigious non-US schools are going to be in Canada. Your stat's would pretty much for example ensure acceptance at McGill (or Toronto or UBC). Whether you would want to go there, and whether McGill or UBC is "prestigious" enough for your parents I don't know, but McGill is certainly very well regarded worldwide. Of course there are also universities with very strong reputations in Australia, Europe, and elsewhere.
They say it’s better for me to not go to a school at all, if I don’t go to a “prestigious” one, and get really angry when I ask them what happens if I don’t get in. I don’t know how to convince them otherwise
If you are in-state California with that GPA/test scores, it would be very strange for you to be rejected by UCB/UCLA. I wouldn’t worry unless you don’t want to attend those schools. They will cost much less than an out of state school that is no better. And in the unlikely event you weren’t admitted to those, you can go to community college.
But why not talk to your guidance counselor at school. I’m sure he/she would send a letter or call your parents explaining that your high school advises you to apply to a few more and add one or two more safeties. With stats like that you don’t need much more.
You could use Early Action or Early Decision to test the waters. If you are accepted early to a school that you can all agree upon, then everything will be fine. But if you are not accepted, you could use that as evidence (for yourself and your parents) that the admission process is indeed hard to predict, and that you need to cast your net widely when you apply regular decision. You can decide in advance upon a list of schools in case your early application doesn’t pan out.
You will still need to apply to UC in November, before you find out the result of your early application. With your GPA and test scores, I predict that you will be able to get into UC San Diego and UC Irvine without problems. With UC Berkeley and UCLA, though, it depends a little on what major you apply to, with some of the engineering majors being very hard to predict. But admission to UC schools does rely more heavily on GPA and test scores than on extracurricular activities.
Do your parents have friends they respect, perhaps a fellow immigrant/mentor who had helped them adjust to the US, who are more knowledgeable about the process and how much of a crapshoot it is for HYPSMC? I am guessing they grew up in a country where you are placed into a college by 1 national college exam (or at least that was the case for them), so arguably everything is within your control. Those friends may have more influence than your GC.
I have a hard time believing you won’t place into a good UC school with the stats you posted. At the same time, you might consider applying to HYPS, Caltech or MIT EA. If you get in, the pressure is off by mid Dec. If you get deferred or rejected, maybe your parents will have a better understanding of how hard it is. For purposes only of potentially enlightening your parents, S may be a good choice because S is pretty digital in either accepting or rejecting, with much fewer deferrals. If you are rejected, your parents might be more willing to consider the realities of the admissions process vs a deferral.
A completely different question is if you want to go to the “prestigious schools” or if in fact your first choice is a BC, NYU, etc… If the latter, that is a tough one and the intercession of relatives, friends, mentors of your parents may be necessary so that you can do what you want and not screw up your relationship with your parents.
You have gotten really good advice already - apply EA where it is available and consider applying ED if you and your parents can agree on a target school that is your first choice and is affordable. See if your GC or a trusted adult can help to mediate.
Additionally, you might apply to a few schools that you consider safer bets and pay the fees on your own, assuming you have some savings. If you get into UCLA/UCB/USC, then you need not consider those other schools further. Given your scores and GPA, I believe your chances are good. But if the unthinkable happens, and you got shut out, you’d have a back up plan.
Considering true safeties is prudent. Given your parents’ resistance, you might want to target safeties that are in state and/or offer merit scholarships so they would be affordable as well.
Good luck and don’t sell yourself too short! You sound like an impressive applicant.
Have you found out yet how much they really are ready, willing, and able to pay? Have they run any of the net price calculators at the websites of the places on their list and your potential list? Are they offering different amounts of money for different categories of places?
If there is a possibility that they might refuse to pay a cent unless you attend a place on their list of “top” institutions, then you need at least one that you can pay for entirely on your own. Your stats make you competitive for merit scholarships at a lot of places, and guarantee you true full rides at others. Go to the Financial Aid Forum and read through the threads on merit based scholarships to get started on your research.
“If there is a possibility that they might refuse to pay a cent unless you attend a place on their list of “top” institutions, then you need at least one that you can pay for entirely on your own.”
Or OP needs one that they would pay for that he will for sure get into, or OP needs to be willing to take a gap year. It is possible (I can’t predict the likelihood) that if OP doesn’t get in anywhere, then the parents might be more flexible the following year.
That being said, given OP’s stats, I think that the chances are quite good for at least one of USC, UCLA, or UCB.
One thing that I haven’t notice yet on this thread (I might have missed it): Have we verified that OP is from California? If not, then the cost of the schools might also be a surprise to the parents. I agree that running the NPC would be a very good idea.
Would they refuse to pay if you don’t get into one of the schools on their list? Will they at least complete the FAFSA so you could take the federal student loan? You may need to find some financial safeties that offer merit for your stats.
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They say it’s better for me to not go to a school at all, if I don’t go to a “prestigious” one, and get really angry when I ask them what happens if I don’t get in. I don’t know how to convince them otherwise
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I don’t believe that they would rather you not go at all.
In the meantime apply to ucla and ucb and all the other schools that they want. Apply to as many as you can EA and one ED so that you’ll have some answers in Dec. After those results your parents may realize that it’s not as easy as they think.
Bring the latest USNWR (it should be put soon) and show them the lists : top public universities, top national Universities, top LACs.
Would your parents agree on your applying to top 5% Universities and Colleges?
Ask like that. Is top 5% what they’re after? Top 10%?
Top 10%= Princeton Review’s best colleges.
Top 5% would mean about top 50 research universities and top 50 LACs plus a handful of others. But don’t say that now.
You need to agree you’ll apply to prestigious universities but they must be prestigious universities for Americans since your life will be here in the US.
Have you talked budget? Sonthey have an idea of costs (and that you can’t just borrow)?
What’s their budget out of income and savings? What your EFC?
Apply to the schools they want, but also apply to one safety with no application fee (that you would be happy to attend). See what happens. If you get into Stanford, great, but if not, you have somewhere to go.
I guarantee they’d rather you go to a school they consider lower tier than to stay home and scoop ice cream.
Would they consider McGill in Montreal sufficiently “prestigious?” It’s less expensive than some of the private colleges you mentioned, and admissions are based entirely on statistics. You would probably get in. I think your stats would give you a decent shot at Washington U or Vanderbilt, also, if your parents would accept them. If they’re reluctant to spend a great deal, then try to persuade them that UCSD is just a smidgen less prestigious. I realize that many immigrant families only recognize a handful of “brand-name” colleges, and are dismayed when they learn that even as fabulous a student as you cannot be guaranteed admission. They often don’t understand that the most selective colleges here do not admit strictly on the basis of numbers, but consider other criteria, and they unfortunately believe that you could have performed better. I hope, for everyone’s sake, that they adopt more realistic positions soon.
I understand they think it’s in your hands, if you work hard or harder. And many American students need to learn, and are humbled when they realize, that to a certain extent, for universities below 20-25%, it’s out of your hands because you don’t know what they’re looking for that year. If it were in your hands, it’d be like in Great Britain, you apply to 5 and you’re good to go. However in the US the most competitive students apply to 10 or 12 universities (and the limit on CommonApp is 20!)