Penn State Sandusky scandal

[Pizzagirl]

<p>

The students have to remember, this is not about them, and it never was. But it IS about that group of students that protested. It IS about an atmosphere perpetuated by the administration that allowed them the power to seemingly represent the student body at Penn State. It will now be up to the rest of the students to wrest that power from them, and let the world know that THEY are Penn State.

</p>

<p>Well said - but as it’s up to the rest of the students to wrest the power from the small group of Paterno-defenders et al, one way they can do so is to be humble about football, and not have their public acts be about “But Penn State Football is still alive and kicking!” Because right now - it doesn’t MATTER than Penn State football is still alive and kicking, and insinuations or actions that imply that it’s really important and thank-god-the-team-is-still-playing send the wrong message.</p>

[Naturally]

<p>

As to anyone who has the power to directly “harm” the students through refusing to hire someone from Penn State, perhaps we all should think about whether we would want to work for such a person in the first place. Their refusing to look at a resume might be the greatest gift of all.

</p>

<p>Nothing personal, but I am not a fan of this argument. Having people shunt your resume aside is not good. It is bad. The person in HR who looks at your resume is probably not someone you will even work with, and at any rate you don’t have to be friends with work colleagues.</p>

<p>Anyway, I don’t think it will be a case of “Oh, a Penn State grad? THROW THE RESUME IN THE TRASH!” I think it will be more like, “Oh, these two resumes look really good. Hmmm, this person went to Stanford and this one went to Penn State. <em>calls the Stanford grad</em>”</p>

[mini]

<p>I doubt there will be more than one or two people who would do the above, and it would be absolutely horrible if they did. But I am also sure that at least subconsciously, it will be on at least some folks’ minds, and with lots of applicants for a limited number of places, it would be quite surprising if it didn’t impact at least some decisions (as, whether one gets called to an interview, as opposed to do deciding between two candidates.)</p>

<p>Remember that virtually all most hiring folks knew about PSU before this episode was football. That likely will not have changed.</p>

[sax]

<p>This is the reality of the first football game:</p>

<p>The media will swarm the campus in the days before the first home football game.
They will be sticking their cameras in students faces and asking questions meant to stir up emotions. They will do their best to create the news rather than report the news.</p>

<p>There will be protesters at the gates with signs about abused children. I would not put it past the press to be involved in these groups. </p>

<p>The media will look for those goups of students who will be the easiest marks and they will hound them. They will look for the kids who have been drinking and follow them around. </p>

<p>The PSU students want to be left alone by those whose only mission is to stir the pot. They want to go to the football game and cheer on their team. They want to go to pep rallys the night before and have fun and chant for their team. This is what a football weekend is all about.</p>

<p>20,000 students will gather at Beaver Stadium .It will be the first time they have gathered in such a large group since last year. There is much anger and hurt in these students who feel blamed for the actions of their administrators. The media onslaught will fuel their frustration.</p>

<p>They will cheer louder and stronger than ever before WE ARE… PENN STATE. Not for the football. Not for the cameras. But because of all the pent up frustration they have felt in the last 9 months toward people who told them who they were.</p>

<p>The administration and BOT have not felt the pulse of this campus since last November. They have not been engaged with how their quick, thoughtless behaviors can influence their students. They need to get it and now.</p>

<p>They need to have a plan and they need to have a media free zone around the stadium. They need to communicate with the students beforehand and often. They need security to hold back the media. </p>

<p>They need more than ever before to help their students get through this first game and all the baggage that will come with it</p>

<p>They just want to go to their college football game. It will be hard to do that.</p>

[sax]

<p>Penn State University is the #1 schoool for employment recruiters. </p>

<p>They are not there because they have heard of Penn State football…good grief.</p>

<p>Rankings and Ratings</p>

<p>Corporate recruiters rank Penn State #1 </p>

<p>Quote from Penn State site</p>

<p>"Corporate recruiters rank Penn State #1, according to The Wall Street Journal. </p>

<p>Penn State was recognized by the Wall Street Journal for its ability to prepare graduates for the job market.</p>

<p>The university was ranked first among 100 colleges — including several Ivy League schools — in a September 2010 survey of 479 recruiters from companies across the United States.</p>

<p>The recruiters cited Penn State’s wide range of academic majors and its ability to give students the well-rounded education needed to thrive in a variety of industries. "</p>

[blueiguana]

<p>

Well said - but as it’s up to the rest of the students to wrest the power from the small group of Paterno-defenders et al, one way they can do so is to be humble about football, and not have their public acts be about “But Penn State Football is still alive and kicking!” Because right now - it doesn’t MATTER than Penn State football is still alive and kicking, and insinuations or actions that imply that it’s really important and thank-god-the-team-is-still-playing send the wrong message.

I strongly agree with this. I read an article regarding the seemingly harmless pep rally. The following quote really caught me (the bold is mine):</p>

<p>

“What these guys have had to endure and overcome, nobody has ever been faced before in college football,” said Tim Sweeney, a businessman who hosts an online radio show. “There aren’t any better representatives of our university than our football team.”

</p>

<p>I think this sends the wrong message. Really? They’re aren’t ANY better representatives for PSU? No high achieving academic students doing research, no student groups working for charity, no engineering students working abroad with Engineers Without Boarders? The best way, right now, for PSU to identify it’s self is through their football program? I disagree! I think it’s time to focus on the great work and achievements of the rest of the university that has been overshadowed for years by football. I think this is absolutely the right time to highlight other student groups. Football doesn’t have to hide in shame by any means, but it’s a good time to show the world what else PSU consists of…I think people would be surprised.</p>

[sax]

<p>How about THON just for starters. and the $9 million dollars they gathered for kids cancer last year.</p>

<p>How about the 17 Olympic ATheletes from Penn State in England right now.</p>

<p>How about Schreyers honors college and their commitment to others and giving.</p>

<p>Why don’t you know these things? Because they do not create NATIONAL NEWS and VIRAL VIDEOS</p>

<p>They do not back up the medias agenda of PENN STATES FOOTBALL culture.</p>

[sax]

<p>How about the corporate recruiting rankings up thread. Why do you not know about this. It was in the paper but you probably didnt read it. Why not?</p>

<p>Because it is not controversial. It doessn’t draw your attentuion.</p>

[momofthreeboys]

<p>Yes, some of this is just faulty logic. Employers are NOT going to pass over resumes of Penn State graduates unless they were already pre-disposed to do this. Frankly the amount of people that might be potentially in a position of hiring singlehandedly and “might” have faulty logic of associating students with criminal activity other people associated with the college would be so few and far between it’s not even worth thinking about. </p>

<p>And yes, the media always needs a hook or an angle. Even local media generally doesn’t run a story without finding an angle. Football is low hanging fruit right now - easy to grab an write a story. That same national “story or interest” could be gone at the snap of a finger when the “next big story” or the “next big criminal case” comes along.</p>

[blueiguana]

<p>sax - I actually DO know several of these things (some thanks to this thread). My point is that these types of things should be what PSU tries to promote right now as the ‘face of PSU’, not the football team. I was simply reacting/responding to the quote I read (and reprinted).</p>

[sax]

<p>So many posts about what one person is saying. Out of context blips.</p>

<p>sorry bluei… I am just really grumpy</p>

<p>Penn State can put out lots of press releases…but what gets picked up?</p>

[blueiguana]

<p>No worries sax, you’re entitled to a grumpy day. This is grump inducing stuff.</p>

[bclintonk]

<p>

@momofthreeboys

Bo Schembechler 26 years

</p>

<p>No, let’s get our facts straight. Schembechler coached at Michigan for 21 years. He was a head coach for 26 years, but the first 5 were at Miami University (Ohio). He retired from coaching at the relatively young age of 60 to make way for younger men, staying on for a transition year as athletic director (his predecessor in that job had just died), then moved on to become president of the Detroit Tigers.</p>

<p>Beyond longevity, I just think there was a fundamentally different kind of football culture at Michigan, even in the Schembechler era (when I spent a lot of time there). Obviously, football is huge at Michigan. But while the head football coach was certainly respected, he wasn’t revered and idolized as the kind of larger-than-life figure that Paterno became at Penn State. (In fact, even as his teams enjoyed great success on the field, there was always a lot of grumbling that Schembechler coached a particularly boring, grind-it-out kind of football, so while he was respected for his success he was rarely idolized, at least until his coaching career was over). And there was accountability; there was never any question that while the football coach was 100% in charge of football, he worked for a very strong athletic director, Don Canham, who worked for a succession of strong presidents, who worked for the Board of Regents, who were very active in setting policy for the university and who were directly accountable to the citizens of Michigan via the ballot box. Schembechler never became the public face and image of the university the way Paterno did; in his day, Schembechler was the public face and image of Michigan football, but never more than that, and in retirement his legend grew until he was “canonized” into the ranks of the Michigan football greats like Fritz Crisler and Fielding H. “Hurry-up” Yost. But he achieved that status only after he no longer had any real responsibility for football or anything else at Michigan.</p>

<p>What I think happened at Penn State is that Paterno was canonized long before he left coaching, and such a powerful cult of personality grew up around him over such a long time that he became more powerful than the athletic director and the president. Until the very end even the Trustees were more his toadies than his bosses. So the lines of authority became completely inverted. And everyone just trusted Paterno’s legendary integrity to keep things on the right track. That’s always a dangerous situation when you’re trusting the personal integrity of a single individual, with no meaningful checks or safeguards. To me, that’s the very definition of “lack of institutional control,” the NCAA infraction for which the Penn State football program is being punished. When you lack the appropriate kinds and measure of institutional control, things can go badly off the tracks, as they obviously did at Penn State.</p>

[Stats21]

<p>Sax, I get your frustration and I do feel badly for PSU students and alumni. I think, however, your expectations regarding media coverage are unrealistic. The Honors College, the Thon, college recruitment, are important topics for prospective students, parents, and guidance counselors. You, and all Nittanay Lions, have every reason to be proud of the accomplishments of the university and its students. But those topics are not newsworthy.</p>

<p>UVA, UNC, and Michigan, are also home to very bright, altruistic, and highly sought after students. Their high academic standards and historical contributions are well known, but like Penn State’s, their virtues are unlikely to be trumpeted on 60 Minutes or Nightline.</p>

<p>A university president, vice president, athletic director, and football coach are suspected of abedding a child predator in furtherance of preserving the reputation of a football program. Massive public scrutiny ensues. God help us all the day it doesn’t.</p>

<p>The media is, and should be, asking probing questions about what went wrong at Penn State. If there was a coverup, and plight of past and future abuse victims were weighed against the reputation of a coach, a program, or a school (with horrifying results) one must ask how that was permitted to happen. What is it about the culture at Penn State that allowed that to occur? A discussion of the the Honors College or job placement has no relevance in addressing the topic at hand. </p>

<p>I believe that Ma Barker’s crime spree could have been fairly and accurately reported without mention of that fact that she made great marmalade. Others may present the omission of any discussion of marmalade as evidence of inherent bias, but I shall stick to my guns (as did Ma).</p>

<p>The media is not tarnishing Penn State’s good name. Penn State, by the actions of its leaders, tanished Penn State’s good name. It is, in fairness, a self inflicted wound. </p>

<p>Your anger and frustrations is completely understandable but, I think, misdirected.</p>

[sax]

<p>Stats.</p>

<p>You are actually making my point. </p>

<p>Other posters here want PSU to stand up for their university by focusing others on the highlights and accomplishments of the academic and altruist side of PSU rather than football.</p>

<p>I agree, it is just not newsworthy. No one cares unless you are somehow involved.</p>

<p>So that was actually my point. The media has no desire to write stories about the good stuff no matter how much of it is occuring. </p>

<p>Where we part ways is on the media’s representaion of the PSU scandle.</p>

<p>If the media does not show up for the first football game the students go in cheer and go home. </p>

<p>So what happens when you have a huge throng of media with cameras running up to groups of students and asking “Dont you think it’s wrong to cheer?” Aren’t you supporting child sexual abuse by coming to the football game? “Are you going to chant WE ARE?” “Are you ashamed of going to school here?”</p>

<p>Somewhere there is a video of a newsscastor handing a kid a bottle and daring him to throw it the night of Joe Paterno being fired. I probably can’t find it anymore but I will look.</p>

<p>Who do the media run to? group A: rowdy raucous group obviously having had a few drinks or group B: a small group of kids waliking to the game?</p>

<p>Guaranteed you will find a few jerks out of thousands at a PSU game this September. Guaranteed they will make the news. </p>

<p>Report the news YES. Create the news: NO
Present only behavior and statements that enhance your agenda: well…that’s the media</p>

<p>so is my anger and frustration misdirected…oh he$$ no.</p>

[Stats21]

<p>I certainly respect your views (and you are correct that I misinterpreted them, apologies). I thought that you were unhappy with media coverage to date, most of which has been fairly good with the exception of the reporting of Sarah Ganim which has been exceptional.</p>

<p>Clearly there will be copious coverage of the first game. I have no expectations regarding the quality of the coverage but understand your concerns.</p>

[cartera45]

<p>Every PSU student should start looking in the mirror and practicing the words “no comment” in order to be ready for the games.</p>

[Seahorsesrock]

<p>This is not about football per se. It’s about the systematic coverup of a child rapist by the adninistatrors of a college, and the why they did it. That is how football is entangled. Paterno and his posse made calculated decisions to protect football over little children. And now as the cases are going to get filed, the school gets back in session, the football team plays again, the media will probably be a thorn in the side of psu. </p>

<p>If psu football hadn’t had such a fall from grace, due to it’s own weight.</p>

<p>There are a lot of good things people do that don’t make the news. Penn will be fine.</p>

[Stats21]

<p>Sax, just to clear, I would think it appropriate to report any demonstrations of support or tributes to Paterno occurring at the first game. It would make no sense to report that others behaved within normal societal expectations. That is to be exected. If some Penn State students or fans act in a disrespectful manner and wind up on the news then they, and not the media, are to blame. </p>

<p>A report of a man jumping from the George Washington Bridge (presumably to avoid New Jersey, understandable) need not inform us that tens of thousands of others crossed safely. We get that.</p>

[myturnnow]

<p>Sax–I definitely see your point. And I understand from your perspective how this must feel…</p>

<p>I have posted here repeatedly including months ago, that the students are innocent in what has occurred at Penn State, and do not deserve to be put down, nor to have any negative impact in terms of employment. As MOWC stated, I don’t understand why one would have a hard time seeing that. Also, we are all parents of college students, and I know for sure I would be upset if my son or daughter’s college was going through such upheaval, as it would absolutely affect their experience. Using the word suffering clouded the issue, and led to comparing the victims’ suffering with students, which is unnecessary. </p>

<p>It remains to be seen how this will play out, but I would not think it’s appropriate for an engineering student, psych student, any student. to be viewed as coming from a “tainted” university. I do believe that Spanier, Curley and Schultz on the other hand, absolutely deserve to have fallout and impact to their careers. Whether there are legal outcomes remains to be seen, but there’s no question that each of these men did not demonstrate good judgment, good character etc. and I don’t think there’s more to be revealed here. While the Freeh report may not be perfect, I do not believe there is any real explanation for their inaction.</p>