Please help...need advice...are they about to

Parent Cafe
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<p>Well I meant that they hadn’t had sex at 15-
They are no longer 15-
my older daughter is almost 25, she has been sexually active I imagine- she did go to a college with a naked slip & slide ( to wash off the blue body paint) but not currently as of when I visited her a few weeks ago and asked if she had considered getting the HPV vaccine
She doesn’t need to use contraception, and I admit I don’t ask what other kind of protection she uses- that would be TMI</p>

<p>My younger daughter is 16, almost 17, I would be shocked if she was sexually active not just because I generally know where she is and what she is doing but because her introverted nature doesn’t make her very approachable, even though she is very beautiful, and she also doesn’t dress or act in a suggestive manner. ( also that her friends don’t mention boys and are more likely to have a tea party with only girls than to have a co-ed party-)</p>

<p>Im not bragging- her inclination to stay away from boys isn’t because of any fantastic parenting skills on my part, but possibly role modeling by her sister- who also was too busy in high school and lack of the opportunities that I had had when I was in high school.</p>

<p>For instance when I was in high school, I was involved with track for an EC- that is only a small part of the year & practice was not every day, as the current school sports.My parents were too busy with their own issues to really pay attention which probably motivated me to find attention elsewhere.
( actually the way I was built at the time- it pretty much found me- Ive since had a breast reduction :D)</p>

<p>My older daughter had a volunteer job from age 12 to high school graduation- she accrued over 2000 hours from summers as well as one afternoon and one full day every week during the school year.
The rest of the time she was busy with school work- about 3 hours of homework everyday, as well as participating in vocal and theatre rehersals.
Of course she did stay overnight at friends houses and they stayed here, but I didn’t sense any sexual activity going on.</p>

<p>My 16 year old is equally busy. Often she is on two sports teams at a time, currently, however, she is only on a rugby team, swims for recreation and is in a College Access now program to help with college entrance. The day she doesn’t have anything scheduled after school she has tutoring.
One day a week she has a rugby game- the other day she is sleeping and doing homework and chores.</p>

<p>Yes for someone really determined Im sure you could find a way to have sex. But generally, that person would need to be pretty motivated and find opportunities that others would miss.
She just isnt’ that motivated.</p>

<p>I just wanted to add- It wasn’t my idea my kids were so busy
I would have never come up with rugby as an idea!
the sports I do think is a good idea- because it is a good way to get to know people in a big school & I beleive in keeping your body strong
plus it is fun & it gets rid of excess energy.</p>

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<p>this is a RIDICULOUS thread. your daughter needs to make her own decisions and learn from her own mistakes. hopefully you have raised her to think very hard about making such a huge decision. but if you believe you have, then you need to trust in that. you cannot read her mind or her heart. you cannot know if she will or will not, has or has not, and whether or not she will regret it or not. You cannot try to protect your daughter from life. she will have relationships. she will have break ups. and in between she will go through the rollercoaster that is a relationship. and hopefully she will learn each time. but you had NO right to IM her boyfriend. that was very cowardly. if anything, you should have talked to your daughter. suck it up, be an adult, and approach you daughter to talk to her. this thread makes me so angry bc you had a chance to really connect with your daughter and get closer to her as a growing and developing young adult, and you played it safe by treating her like a child. thankfully, my mother has (with a few exceptions) generally always come to me to keep an open dialogue and to force me to talk to her and to show me that i can trust her and i can say that her presence in my life, not an overbearing one but one of guidance and support, has helped make me the strong, thoughtful, very fulfilled collegiate student that I am today</p>

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<p>

This is from the original post, and I think it’s what the responding posters have been doing, as per the thread title (“please help … need advice”). The problem seems to be that, while most posters are offering advice about how to talk to the daughter and what approach to take, the OP is looking for advice on how to prevent her d from entering into a sexual relationship with her long-term boyfriend.

I didn’t mean to imply that I would encourage taking that risk or that it’s “ok,” in that I would say, “Fine with me, honey - just be sure to use a condom.” I would certainly talk to my daughter about my concerns for her emotional and physical well-being; I would say “I don’t consider you to be an adult yet and I think that sex is for adults”: I would say “What will you do if you become pregnant? How will you feel if this relationship ends when one of you goes off to college?” However, I wouldn’t think that the decision was mine to make, and I can’t see how I could keep it from happening if my daughter decided to go ahead. Would I ground her forever? Imprison her in the house? Send her to boarding school? I just have no idea.</p>

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<p>Good post, Frazzled.</p>

<p>The thing is, this is not your decision. It should not be your decision. It is her body, her emotions–her choice. As everyone has been saying, talk to your daughter about the possibility of getting hurt and how this could affect her emotionally. Guide her to make an informed decision that she feels is right for her. You suggested earlier trying to keep the two of them from having sex by any means you can. If your daughter is mature, she should be able to look at the factors involved and think about how this would affect her. </p>

<p>I am concerned that you have said nothing about keeping her healthy during sex. Have you discussed this with your daughter? Almost every poster has mentioned it, and you don’t seem to have listened or responded at all. Protecting her health is much more important than protecting her from possible future heartbreak. You need to make sure that she practices safe sex and knows what that entails. If you don’t know or don’t want to talk to her about it, send her to her doctor.

Look, I know nothing about their relationship except that they’ve been dating for a year. If they’ve been dating for a year, he’s not in it for the sex. He can get sex a lot easier than this. When they eventually break up, assuming they do, both of them will be hurt. She may break up with him, he may break up with her, or–most likely–it will be a mutual conversation this summer before he leaves for college. The boy is not the enemy. The two of them are in a reasonably stable and long-term relationship, and you’ve suggested that the boy is also a virgin: this is a decision for both of them. She will be hurt and sad whenever they break up, regardless of whether or not they had sex. I doubt that she will regret losing her virginity while in a good relationship, even if they do break up.

Sparing her from heartbreak is not your job. You can tell her how you feel and talk to her about her feelings. You cannot and should not shield her from heartbreak. It will happen regardless. You need to let her judge this for herself.

Sex is a normal and healthy part of a trusting and developed relationship. You are seeing “sex” as been the single act of intercourse. Their sexual relationship has probably been developing from the start of their relationship, with kissing, making out, “cuddling,” and a dozen other acts that are fundamentally sexual in nature.</p>

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<p>

My concern is that I think you are being inconsistent and giving mixed messages. You have given your daughter permission to date this guy and spend many hours of unsupervised time with him, apparently since she was age 15 … but now you are looking for ways to prevent them from having sex.</p>

<p>I know many parents who for cultural or religious reasons feel very strongly averse to the idea of their daughters being sexually active as teenagers, and they exercise control by putting a lot of restrictions on their daughters. These girls aren’t dating at age 15; they aren’t going go sit out in a park at night and “cuddle” with their boyfriends. Their parents expect them home at an early hour, and their parents make sure that they know what is going on with them.</p>

<p>I don’t have a problem with that, and I don’t think it necessarily backfires – the message is consistent. “In our culture young girls don’t date.” </p>

<p>I don’t have that viewpoint. I was a permissive parent. I also grew up in a state where the legal age of consent was 16, at least at that time, so I guess I personally have integrated the idea that 16 is old enough to decide whether or not to have sex, no matter what the current law is. I figured my d. would become sexually active in her late teens, because I did, and because she attended a public high school in a very liberal city. So when I saw my daughter get into a serious relationship a few months shy of her 17th birthday, I figured it was probably going to lead to sex. </p>

<p>I don’t think you can do both: I don’t think you can give a kid the freedom to date, to have a steady boyfriend, to spend hours alone with him – AND think you can prevent sex from taking place. Calling up the boyfriend and threatening him is not “parenting”. Sitting down with your daughter for a serious talk is parenting – but if your daughter is going to be alone with this boy, then it is her choice, not yours, what she does with him.</p>

<p>Parenting a teenager means giving guidance as well as respect and trust. I’m happy because my daughter listened to me. I’m not saying another parent needs to do the same thing, all I am saying is that parents should be consistent and forthright with their kids. If you want to be a strict parent and exercise a lot of control, then make the rules and the consequences clear and stick by them. I wanted to be permissive, but I understood that meant relinquishing a lot of control. It worked well for my kids – maybe if I had seen my kids getting into serious trouble (drugs use, falling grades, etc. ) – I would have tightened up – but it didn’t happen that way.</p>

<p>By the way… my son, who is older, was much, much later to get seriously interested and involved with girls. I am pretty sure he was a virgin until he was in college; he definitely did not date in high school - I wouldn’t be surprised if he didn’t have sex until age 20. So I don’t buy into this notion of the boys only want sex and are using the girls, the girls are all sweet and innocent and vulnerable. Even though my daughter’s bf is 18 months older than her, I think that she is the more sophisticated and pretty much calling the shots in the relationship.</p>

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<p>

I helped my daughter avoid the risk of “getting hurt” by all those conversations over the years we had about relationships. </p>

<p>I didn’t want my d. to have sex in 11th grade, but if you want to know some positives, here they are:</p>

<ul>
<li><p>She stayed involved, long-term, in a relationship with a serious and considerate young man who treats her with respect and constant love and support. My d. was always kind of fickle, and her previous relationships with guys had lasted no more than 4-6 weeks, usually shorter. She just didn’t seem the type to commit. But this relationship caused her to get more serious and focused about her personal life, and it has brought out a more giving, considerate, caring side of her. </p></li>
<li><p>My d’s bf is conservative about his lifestyle – he doesn’t drink, he’s not a wild partier. My d. is more outgoing, more likely to experiment, and I think this relationship has been a good influence on her. </p></li>
<li><p>My d. has gained the experience of being in a good relationship, with a guy who treats her right. He is not jealous or controlling, he doesn’t criticize or complain or try to change her, he remembers birthdays and anniversaries, he goes out of his way to help her, he’s a good listener. Even if this relationship doesn’t last forever, my d. will have a good model for future relationships. </p></li>
<li><p>When he went away to college and she was still in high school, she stayed home a lot in the evenings - so she actually led a more sedate and safer lifestyle than she would have if she had been unattached and dating during her senior year. </p></li>
<li><p>My daughter’s first… and only … sexual experiences have been in the context of a long-term relationship with a guy she really loves and trusts. Now that she is in college, it is possible that if she weren’t in this relationship she would have been more prone to serial, short-lived relationships as part of dating various college guys. So basically, it’s led to a monogamous lifestyle at an age when there is a lot of bed hopping going on among her peers. </p></li>
</ul>

<p>Could these things have happened without sex? Probably. But the point is, that my d. got into a very positive, strong relationship with a young man. Sex is probably the least important aspect of the relationship, but obviously it is part of the intimacy and strong bond that exists between them. </p>

<p>There have been no negatives in our case, other than the fact that I kind of “lost” my d. to the guy – that is, he is clearly a more important, more trusted, more cared for fixture in her life than her parents. But that’s only a negative for me – and the umbilical cord has to be cut sometime.</p>

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<p>maybetransfer: of course you find this thread ridiculous, you aren’t a parent yet…write back when you are grown with teenagers.</p>

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<p>calmom: you and your d were the lucky ones but I think your situation and the outcome probably is not the norm.</p>

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<p>SharonD, my viewpoints are going to be so different than yours I don’t know if this will help much, but here goes - </p>

<p>First, on the issue of privacy, I don’t think there is such a thing as enough privacy. As early as middle school, I put a second telephone line in the house; I have no interest in knowing who calls my daughter or who she calls or what they say/said to each other, UNLESS she elects to tell me. Since then, I have never answered her phone, opened or read her mail, read her IMs, text messages, or anything else, and, unless something extraordinary were to have happened (such as criminal behavior along the lines of drug use), I would never, ever consider such a thing. The road goes two ways though - she also doesn’t read my stuff, answer my phone, etc. My reasons are simple: I established guidelines and a model of behavior in word and deed. I have told her loudly and often that she is trusted and valued, and that I honor and respect her judgment. </p>

<p>As far as discussions with her physician, that really has me a bit amazed - I’ve taken my to countless doctors over the years for various sports injuries, and never do I participate in whatever goes on in the examination room. My role is to provide the health insurance coverage, pay the co-pay, provide the transportation, and also pay at the pharmacy if medicine is prescribed. I don’t consider it any of my business what she decides to discuss with a doctor. </p>

<p>If she were going to have sex at age 16, well, I would very likely not be happy about it, but I’m also not foolish enough to believe there would be a lot I could do to stop it. But I absolutely would do what everyone else here has unanimously suggested - I would make sure she has access to and support for protection, sex education, etc., and, to that end, I have always expressed to her that my door is open without conditions or judgments, should she ever need my assistance on these matters. What I would NOT be doing is getting involved in the young man’s matters - there will be young men (and eventually middle-aged men etc.) always and my responsibility is to my child; whoever she is dating is simply no concern of mine.</p>

<p>Where does this get me? My daughter is in her early 20’s, and tells everyone whether we want to hear it or not that she will wait until marriage to have sex, and furthermore she does not approve of birth control pills - she has some strong beliefs that I cannot articulate that taking these pills is like putting poison in her body; anyway, she is of the opinion that she will wait until marriage, and then have children. Perhaps she and whoever she someday marries will explore variations of family planning; if so, that’s her/their call. </p>

<p>I didn’t demand, or even ask that she take this position. All I did is what everyone else here has already suggested that you do. I offered LOTS of information, education (the education part includes real numbers and statistics about the social and economic impact of unplanned and/or teenage pregnancies and children born and raised in single parent homes), support, and over and over and over made sure the message got through that I trust her judgment, backed up by the message that if she ever gets into a problem, she can always come to me. She HAS had a boyfriend or two that I stone cold couldn’t stand the sight of, but, in the end these proved to be good experiences as she seemed to learn from them what she needs and wants in a romantic relationship, and so she now dates someone who I would be happy to welcome into our family. </p>

<p>If I were you, I would back off. I would certainly stop the invasions of privacy, stop reading the text messages, etc. 100% of the information you need and want you can acquire in legitimate, respectful, supportive ways - by sitting down and having honest, open dialog with this person who is almost an adult. Backing off, being a supportive resource, etc. sometimes gets you to the opposite problem: sometimes you get too much information! I intend no offense and hope that this helps in some way, and hope you will reconsider some of your strategies.</p>

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<p>Calmom: All girls are not sweet and innocent but those that are, their parents sure would like to try and keep them that way for as long as possible. I doubt your son was a virgin at the age of 20, but since you sound like such an incredible mom he might have been.</p>

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<p>

That’s really interesting. Do you know the details? I’ve only really heard an objection from a religious, usually Catholic, perspective. Does she feel the same if there is a medical reason for the pills? Sorry, you don’t have to answer if this is too personal or you don’t know. I’m just curious–don’t mean to steal the thread. :)</p>

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<p>SharonD, lots of young men and women are still virgins in their early 20s…I know several…some are intentionally waiting until they are married, and others are open to a sexual relationship before marriage but simply haven’t met the right person yet…</p>

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<p>

</p>

<p>And it makes me wonder if your presence could cause her to lie to a doctor she would otherwise be honest with. That’s very scary. Aren’t kids supposed to start having parent-free parts of doctor visits at 10-12 years of age for just this reason (among others)?</p>

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<p>Corranged, I don’t want to steal the thread either, but I’ll try to see if I can explain - her position is along the lines of she doesn’t think that birth control pills have been “on the market” long enough for there to be a comprehensive evaluation of what these pills do to women’s bodies and overall health, and what the potential consequencies may be to future generations, in terms of birth defects or other negative impact.</p>

<p>Some of this may have roots in her education - one of her degrees will be in biochem - but - she was headed this way even before she got to college, so, I am not 100% sure this is the total foundation of her reasoning. </p>

<p>I don’t entirely disagree with her (I won’t take the things either, never have, never will, I’m sort of in the same place - then it’s hard to find even an aspirin in our house - we’re sort of drug-adverse) - but, I have always, always told her, that I would prefer she obtain birth control than ever risk an unwanted pregnancy, and, I believe she would take the appropriate steps to prevent pregnancy if she did decide to have sex while not married. </p>

<p>We are fairly seriously catholic, but, I don’t think her reasoning has its foundations in her religious education. She is completely polarized in her position that sex is a gift to be shared between husband/wife, and should be reserved for marriage, but it seems as if she thinks so because of the commitment factor and because of the natural extension to having children, not the religious factor.</p>

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<p>Beck, that’s my point, outside of the obvious, I stopped going in the exam room when she reached about age 11 or so, for that very reason. A young lady should be able to have a private, confidential conversation with a physician without the stress and worry of what a judgmental parent or even a very permission, open-minded parent might think, do, or say…</p>

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<p>OK. That makes sense. My family is also medicine-conscious, so I completely understand.</p>

<p>I started having confidential doctor visits when I was about 10 or 11, I believe. I remember that the last year my mother went in with me, I felt very uncomfortable.</p>

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<p>

If he was, it has nothing to do with morality or how I raised him, it’s just a matter of maturity and personality. He really wasn’t ready to date in high school – I think he felt awkward and intimidated around girls. My daughter’s personality was different.</p>

<p>I didn’t happen to be very “protective” of either of my kids, however. I wanted to raise kids who could deal with the ups & downs of life, so I wouldn’t really be likely to try to prevent my kids from doing something that might result in emotional hurt. </p>

<p>Actually, I think that a woman who is too afraid of getting hurt emotionally in a relationship might be more at risk than the one who is willing to deal with a little pain, in terms of getting stuck in a relationship with the wrong guy and not knowing how to get out of it.</p>

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<p>To everyone who has posted their responses to my plea for advice please know that although I may not have commented on all of them since there have been so many, I have read each and every one and have learned something from all of them. I thank each all of you for taking the time to respond and for being so honest and sharing your own personal experiences with your children.</p>

<p>I sat down with my d tonight before she went to bed and I calmly expressed to her my feelings and apologized for reading her IM"s and for contacting her boyfriend. I told her that I understood what it was like to be in love at such a young age and the feelings that can accompany that love. I told her that anything I did that upset her came out of my love for her and because I am so used to looking out for her and protecting her and that I still see her as my baby and that I am having a very hard time letting go. She has been a joy from the day she was born and this year of her dating and having to share her has not been easy.</p>

<p>I told her that because we have always been so very close and spent a lot of time together and she has always come to me and told me pretty much everything, that it hurt me and scared me that she didn’t talk to me about this very important decision in her young life. My d was a miracle baby and that even if she wasn’t my daughter I would still love her because I admire her for all the wonderful things she stands for, how she treats others, how she believes in people and is loyal to the end, how hard she works at everything she does and that she is just a beautiful person inside and out.</p>

<p>I ended with how I would try harder to trust that she will make the right decision about this situation and that maybe this all happened for a reason and it will help us both prepare for when she leaves home for college next year. I am sure I will want to wrap myself around her and not let her go but I will promise to do my best.</p>

<p>Now…please someone else steal this thread. :)</p>