My name is Romani, she/her. I even have it in my email signature.
It’s an extra two syllables. And since my name is only one syllable, it’s still a shorter introduction than a lot of other people. If everyone’s pronouns match their outward appearance, you won’t have a problem now will ya?
I spend more time with the queer community than 99% of the people on this subforum. Through my work, advocacy, and volunteer work, I meet hundreds of new LGBT+ people every year. I’ve never, ever met someone who wants to use ve/ze/other new pronouns. I’ve also never met anyone who didn’t want any pronouns. Neutral is they. I’m not saying it doesn’t happen, but it’s sure not the norm.
Honestly, people get upset over the weirdest things IMO. I wonder if this is what it was like when women wanted to be called by their names instead of Mr. Husband’s first name. Oh no, you’d have to remember TWO names per couple!
I will use whatever pronouns a person wishes, but I think it is very odd to assume that every person might wish to use pronouns other than the ones that seem to apply. There is no need to have everyone announce one’s pronouns at the start of the conference, meeting, or on one’s name tag. If I call you “he” when you identify as “she,” you can correct me.
The idea that we all choose our pronouns or have confusion about our genders is utter nonsense. Acting as if gender is fluid or uncertain for everyone actually trivializes the situation for those who do face this issue on a daily basis!
I kind of like the way they handled this on Star Trek:TNG. The officers were all “sir,” regardless of gender. They just co-opted the Sir and made it gender-neutral.
I think people should be able to state their preference for pronouns used in their presence to refer to them, although you doesn’t have a gender attached to it.
I suspect that there is more to the pronoun suspension story than was told. Maybe the child was mocking the other child and being mean, was asked to stop, and continued to bully him/her/zem/them on multiple occasions, in part by deliberately and mockingly using a certain pronoun. No sane teacher or administrator would suspend a child for using the wrong pronoun by mistake! (I have been a school administrator for 15 years, so I have seen adults do many stupid things, but usually not that stupid! Suspensions need to be reasonable or you could get into legal trouble.)
As far as pronoun use goes- on another thread, there was a discussion about some adults preferring their friends’ kids to call them Mr. or Mrs. So-and-So to calling them Joan or David or whatever. If that is what they prefer to be called, one calls them that, because they prefer it and that’s their right, even if one thinks it’s a little formal and weird. So if someone has a preferred pronoun that does not match their appearance, one calls them that, because they prefer it and that’s their right, even if one thinks it’s a little new age and weird. Whether you are liberal or conservative, treating people kindly and calling them by the name and pronoun they prefer is the right thing to do.
As far as it’s being part of group introductions, I think it is just a deliberate effort to make new students visiting the college feel comfortable and that this is a place they will be respected for who they are.
There is a new awareness of gender identity, and college students are often the first to embrace a cause of standing up for any group they perceive as an oppressed underdog. Typical college stuff.
So while one may smile inwardly at the incredible new breadth of available pronouns— if one is truly bothered by it, one needs to ask oneself why. How does it hurt a person if another person wants to be called by a certain pronoun? It doesn’t. So respect their choice.
————-
(P.S. Was the OP at SUNY Albany today? I heard another person who was there today tell the same story.)
“My name is Romani, she/her. I even have it in my email signature.”
I can see that in e-mail signature actually. There are many names that don’t signify gender. Off hand I know “Pat, Sandy, Ashley, Michael” just as a start.
Especially since many women have been given masculine names at birth so that’s how they appear on resumes.
I am old-fashioned, if by that you mean being polite and referring to people using the names and pronouns by which they want to be referred to. But I can tell that “old-fashioned” has a different meaning in this thread.
My place of employment just completed a diversity and inclusion survey, I was surprised to learn that we have 14 transgender individuals working at our company. I don’t think it’s too much to ask to treat them with dignity and use the name and pronouns they wish.
Statistically it may be a small number but that small number equates to real people.
Of course, but my point is that we shouldn’t just assume everyone needs to make their pronouns clear. It really is okay to assume until told otherwise.
I’m old enough to remember when people were outraged by Ms. I have a hard time calling people they, though I get that there are times when English already kind of uses they as a singular noun. I have two friends with transgender kids and we all (including the parents) slip up from time to time. Languages change and eventually I’ll get used to it. I found it very hard to get used to the fact that the German word for “girl” (Mädchen) was neutral not feminine!
I think the reason for the introductions with pronouns is so that the people who want to use the non-obvious ones won’t feel singled out.
I think people should do their best to use the requested pronouns, and the people being addressed should not take offense for mistakes. Change is hard!
" However, I don’t think not doing so should be punished."
Do we have evidence that such things are happening for the accidental or innocent error? We have one comment here on an anecdotal situation with very little detail provided but I’ve seen no evidence that this is an issue of common occurrence at all.
It makes me wonder what will happen in the future. Will a person announce a birth with, “Its a boy!” or “It’s a girl!” Or will that become politically incorrect? I can see the child remaining genderless until he or she decides which gender to identify with.
While I respect the right of a transgendered individual to adopt a new pronoun, and I would certainly use their preferred pronoun, I believe much of this has gotten out of hand. New York City, for example, now recognizes 31 genders. :-/
People have a right to be referred to in the manner that makes them most comfortable, and I make an effort to respect their preferences. The only problem I have – and it’s one that I have to suck up – is the grammatical incorrectness of singular they/them. Long before gender pronoun awareness reared its head, many people would use “their” rather than “his/her” regardless of singular/plural antecedents (e.g., “Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.”). I suppose I should be grateful for those that can distinguish among “their /they’re/ there,” which many people confuse.
@bhs1978 From the article link you posted which makes it clear the policy would be for blatant and repeated use of wrong pronouns not accidental occurrences, hence my wording in my post. Let’s not use this fear or an anecdotal story as an excuse to not honor and respect the wishes of others.
“Sellew, though, says she doubts anyone would be punished for a mere slip of the tongue. “Heavens no,” she said. “I don’t [think] you’re going to get fired the first time you call Melissa ‘he.’ Maybe the 40th time, if you’re doing it loudly and publicly and brazenly, you might get in trouble. ””
I have the same hang-up despite the fact that 2 of my close friends that, during the school year, I interact with daily use they/them. It takes a long time to undo 20-some odd years of grammar training!