Providence College or Penn State?

College Search & Lists
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@AustenNut @kelsmom @thumper1 @parentologist

Hello my amazing friends! Your feedback last year when considering business programs for my son was so appreciated and helpful! (thread under MAScout username)

We are now closing in on acceptances and starting to struggle on choices. My son will study finance and has been accepted to:

  1. Penn State Smeal School of Business (#21 USnews) - $55K Out of State plus need to start in summer of 2024. He was accepted as a main campus summer admit. Goodbye summer job/income/fun, hello extra $7K cost. but it helps students acclimate I hear.
  2. Providence College - Generous need based aid year 1 and 2 (single mom). Will cost less than Umass Amherst. Last 2 years will cost more.
  3. Babson - Too expensive $72K
  4. Waiting on Santa Clara and USD (both attractive financially Catholic schools to us given my income, but far from home)

Penn State is 8 hours from Boston and that kind of travel would be tough on me logistically. He’s young and doesn’t quite understand the impact of the location or why he would ever need his parents around while in college.
Providence is just over an hour. Penn State’s reputation seems stronger nationally but PC is #1 Regional School in the north. He has visited PC and liked it but seemed a bit party-centric. Will visit Penn State soon. I’ve heard PC prices can go up over time which is a risk. But I belive it would cost less for 4 years at Providence than at Penn State. But not enough to really matter to me.

Would welcome your thoughts on reputation, opportunities for grad school admissions, etc. from these business programs vs. the value /cost. Son would probably have no PLUS loans from PC, but $20K plus loans from Penn State which we can deal with. He will also take 28K federal loans wherever he goes.
p.s. wasn’t interested in UMass Amherst and tough to get into this year for business in any event.
Added complication for Mom. His brother has life threatening health issues. I would hate to have him so far away. But he is OK with moving forward with his life and perhaps this just creates space for him to get away from the ongoing medical challenges at home he has been forced to deal with - lots of stress. Some say they need to break away from the stress of long term illness (pediatric cancer) in the family or be consumed by it.
Thanks so much!

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Sounds like PC is the way to go, but I agree that distance from a sibling’s longtime, major illness (which is its own kind of trauma) is also healthier.
Summer Start at Penn State is indeed excellent, gives students the opportunity to take 2 required 1st year classes (I’d recommend the CAS&Economics “pride”) with a small cohort of 20-25 students while learning about college life, the university’s resources, etc, so that in the Fall they’re ahead academically and hit the ground running for everything else. BUT indeed it’s expensive and it’s 6 weeks of summer job earnings he won’t have which it sounds like he’d need.
In addition, finance requires a 3.5 GPA (a top GPA, unlike HS) at Penn State : is he ready for that? Would he prefer attending Penn State and major in something else like MIS or Supply Chain OR is Finance more important (in which case PC is the only answer)?

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Thank you. My son is caught up in rankings and wants as much top grad school opportunity as possible. Plus he loves football…hence his interest in Penn State…but he hasn’t seen it in person to get a feel for size/location…He really did NOT like Umass Amherst for example. Too lonely, everyone wore headphones! Seemed antisocial. He wants a decent friend group vibe.

If he could pull off Babson, we would as it’s 30 minutes from home and close to the hospitals. But alas it’s out of our reach unless I mortgage myself to the teeth! Which I’ve considered! So many students get big aid to Babson, but we unfortunately didn’t. Very sad. I went there :frowning: I would put my finances in a challenging spot to attempt this for him.

PC is nice but seems not as rigorous academically as Penn State. Business school ranking on US News is much lower for PC. That’s what I’m struggling to understand. We witnessed the heavy party focus at PC basketball game and the city of Providence didn’t give a great vibe compared to Boston so it was a bit of a turn-off. It is economically much different/less vibrant than Boston.

I think he’s a bit unrealistic re: travel to and from Penn State. But I don’t want to crush his aspirations for a top-ranked Biz School. He’s a serious student/non-partier/and I want to reward him with opportunity. But as a single parent with cancer caregiver demands, I can’t realistically support him easily in Pennsylvania. He’d have to grow up fast there.

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Is your son sick, or a sibling?
If himself, the situation is different and needs to involve his doctors.
If a sibling, it’s better if he goes far away from hospitals he’s known for years for his sibling.

Can you arrange for a visit with admissions and Smeal? See if he can attend a couple classes? In addition, see if anyone from your area attends and could give him a tour? If he applied to Schreyer and got in, contact Schreyer too. In all cases he should eat in a “regular” dining hall, at the student center (called “the HUB”), visit the library and a gym.
Avoid the weekend before Spring Break and Easter weekend, then have him fly to State College (with another adult, grandparent, cousin…) for a Friday-Saturday or a weekend.
He might find the college too big, the program too rigorous. Getting a 3.5 for finance is no joke.
Make sure to ask him the question wrt best of a bad situation, would he prefer MIS or Supply Chain at PSU OR Finance at PC?
(Also, to avoid extra fees, nix fraternity rush).

Kids at selective, residential colleges don’t go home often. Their parents drive them (or fly them with 2 suitcases) for their 1st semester and then they have to handle life on campus.

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Then he will need to do well wherever he goes and apply to top grad schools (which is four years from now and a LOT could change).

He will also have a better idea of the area of finance he truly is interested in, and hopefully a couple of internships under his belt.

@Catcherinthetoast any input about finance? Or is this totally out of your wheel house?

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His younger brother is sick. They are close. It’s not easy no matter how you slice it. I’m just not sure he has the maturity to understand how he might feel if his brother is in the hospital. A friend said distance is good for sibs mental health, but is this too much distance is my concern. And no affordable direct flights. This is the nervous mom in me. I don’t want to stand in the way of his future and I know I shouldn’t.

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There are serious students at Providence College and there is tons to do in Providence even for a kid on a budget.

Penn State is the U Mass of Pennsylvania- if he didn’t like his own flagship, what’s the appeal of paying MORE for someone else’s flagship?

To me, it’s a no-brainer based on what you’ve posted- Providence for the win. Your son can do his first Finance 101 homework assignment and calculate the loan payments on his Penn State package. 28 plus 20 gets you close to 50K and your son might be shocked to see what kind of a hit his lifestyle is going to take trying to get those paid off. 5 years after graduation his best friend is getting married- bachelor party is in a fancy resort in Cancun. The other guys are going, but your son has loan payments to make. His friends at work are going skiing for MLK weekend- he’s staying home, he’s got loan payments to make. 8 years after graduation he’s modeled his costs for renting vs. buying a condo- and it definitely makes more sense to buy-- but he can’t save up the down payment because his extra cash every month goes to loan payments.

He wants finance? Let him do the payback scenarios.

And if you don’t think Penn State is party centric… you didn’t visit on a Thursday night, or watch kids stagger to the dining halls at 11 am on Friday morning…

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I agree with @Blossom. From what you have described, Providence checks off a LOT of boxes.

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Providence. He can do his first two years there, and then if they jack up the price on him, he can transfer to UMass Amherst.

You need to make life easier on yourself. Keep him nearby. Also, last thing you need is extra loans. And BTW, if you wanna talk party school, I’m sure there’s at least as much going on at Penn State as anywhere in the nation. Providence is his best bet.

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Two great options so congrats. I’d take a breath and consider after the visit to Penn State.

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If you don’t think Penn State is “party centric”, I think you don’t know much about it. My D tells me of a friend’s mother who goes there to party with students.

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All great options and not hugely different from each other IMO - ignore silly rankings based on nothing important. PC sounds perfect if Babson won’t budge on the $$.

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Besides spirit, I would mostly agree. Right now, out-of-state state schools are on fire though.

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On fire for what- kids going into debt to attend someone else’s public U when they aren’t excited about attending their own? Because kids from Philadelphia are so fundamentally different from kids from Boston? Jenkintown is completely different from Framingham or Belmont?

For kids who can afford the luxury of out-of-state- terrific. For the son of a parent struggling with an ill child, for whom the solution is loans on top of the federal maximum-- this sounds like the early chapters of a financial dumpster fire.

So yeah- “on fire”. But not the good kind.

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I suggest staying local, but the facts are the facts.

US News has been increasingly inflating state school ratings over the last few years. Not agreeing, just stating. It allows for people who do not know any better to make wrong choices. Sucks IMO.

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Providence… family is everything and so is getting an education you can afford.
My S24 turned down Penn State and is going to Pitt, where his 2 siblings are and we live in a suburb of Pittsburgh. Our 3 kids are close as well and nothing makes me happier. Your son will never regret being there for his sibling. Doesn’t mean he won’t have a great college experience. He’ll have to deal with his siblings changing illness even far away so I wouldn’t be concerned with him being “too” close by. These type of situations allow them to develop resilience.

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He should see Penn state for sure because it is completely different from Providence college. You know your son better but if he is interested in Penn state I would think maybe he does need some space and the concern is more from his mama bear watching out, maybe let him have it. As far as traveling, I went to boarding school out there, I took a train to Lancaster and then took a bus and I was in high school and CLUELESS, and I figured it out. I am sure there are closer or better train and connecting bus routes now, but just wants to note it’s definitely a better cost option,

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Congratulations to your son on his current acceptances! These are all good programs.

Based on what you indicated in your earlier thread, this sounds much more like Providence than Penn State to me.

I know your one child still has cancer, but does the rest remain true? If so, I’d be very wary of selecting a school that would require PLUS loans because 1) you may not qualify for any in future years, and 2) YOU are actually the one responsible for paying back those loans. Though there is often an arrangement whereby the kids pay back these loans, legally, you’re the one on the hook. If you are disabled and were having $30k/year in health costs prior to losing your job, taking on extra loans seems unwise.

Providence seems like exactly what you were looking for, and it’s coming in at an affordable price. Seems to hit the best of everything for your family.

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I 100% agree that if the objection to Providence is that it’s a “party school,” then Penn State is not the answer, because it’s just as much of a party school, and on a larger scale.

Distance-wise, if you’re concerned about the distance to PSU, California seems unwise. Having to get flights makes any unplanned travel a much more fraught project that being somewhere driveable.

Penn State is an excellent school, but I don’t fully understand the mystique it has with some kids. (And I don’t really see what’s better about it than UMass, beyond the “familiarity breeds contempt” factor for a MA kid.) It’s very easy to fall through the cracks at Penn State (speaking from personal experience with a relative who found all of the pitfalls I feared she would). I would be extremely apprehensive about sending a kid there on the basis of a major/career plan with a secondary admissions process that depends on getting significantly better grades than he got in high school. I get that family stresses were a factor, but there are no guarantees about future family stresses, nor about the individual stresses that come with college. And college is, at the risk of stating the obvious, harder than high school. Going over-budget only to gamble on the ability to study what he wants just doesn’t seem like a win to me.

Honestly, Providence sounds like a great plan - far enough from home to feel like he’s truly somewhere else, but close enough to come home when he wants or needs to, and a great environment and student experience, for a price you can afford without PLUS loans.

I’m sure the past few years must have been very difficult for all of you, and along with wishing things could have been different for your son, there’s probably a desire to make the difficulties up to him by giving him everything he wants in a college experience. (On top of the desire we all have for our kids to get everything they want!) But it seems to me that PSU would involve going out on several limbs, taking on pressure on both the academic-performance and financial fronts, just for the sake of perceived “better”-ness that may not really serve him better. Providence seems to make an awful lot of sense. If he actually finds it not challenging enough, that’ll mean a great GPA in the first two years, and he can transfer to Isenberg or somewhere else that works financially. But I think the great likelihood is that it will provide all the challenge he needs; and being a top performer there will position him well to get the internships that are the most important stepping stone to the career he wants.

I’d stay away from the PLUS loans, given everything else you’re contending with. Sure, the idea is for him to pay it back, but you never know what may happen, and ultimately it’s your debt. He has the opportunity to go away to a great college (it’s not like you’re asking him to stay home, go to community college, and take care of his sibling - an hour from home is plenty of distance) without putting you in debt; I think he should take that opportunity and run with it.

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