Providence College or Penn State?

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21

Thank you for the info. on Penn State Summer Program. It feels like the straw that broke the camel$ back financially and logistically.

It’s unclear to me if it’s $6K or more likely $20K+ to attend this required session for my son. Plus it would be a summer away from his brother (not desireable)

Would you happen to know if they require summer session 1 & 2?

Tacking on 20K on top of an over 200K state flagship felt painful today when we discovered this.

Yet my son still seems fixated on Penn State! Maybe it’s his love of football that is really at the root of this…but I believe it’s the USNews Rankings and fear that he needs Penn State to get into a reputable MBA.

22

I’m overwhelmed at the support and insights you are sharing with me. It feels like the same kind of warm hug feeling I did when I posted last year and was amazed at your help. And also the support I feel from Providence College is heartwarming I admit. (so much so that I had to compose myself as my son and I drove up to the campus last week…the emotion overtook me). It is the ONLY school that has factored in the extraordinary demands of the pediatric cancer/single-parent household situation I’m in. I am grateful. I just can’t seem to get it through to my son…he remains concerned the price will go up if my income fluctuates at all which it could.

My son is worried that PC will go up as we have heard it can. He was waitlisted at UMass Isenberg, and he actually disliked the campus vibe (lack of social interaction, everyone wearing headphones, dirty windows and dirty/tired feeling)…I’ve heard Penn State is much nicer…but I haven’t been there yet…so no guarantees he would be able to transfer to Umass in the future. And then he worries if he were to stay at PC that he’s back in Plus loan world. So I imagine he thinks Penn state is a steadier pricetag.

Mostly, I am so grateful for your empathy. I soldier on raising three kiddos with the father attempting to block my son’s admission at his school of choice (agreement states father must agree in writing). So it’s a tactic to avoid paying anything is my guess.

The father is lowering his “budget” (there was no defined budget just that each would contribute 1/3 Umass on top of any 529) to rock bottom schools that my son has no interest in to force our hand and cause us to “breach the agreement” and thereby free him up to contribute zero. So now I have to hire an attorney just to try to send my son to college this fall otherwise father won’t approve of anything and suggests a gap year to further harrang us. Wasted resources. And I didn’t understand the in’s and out’s of the hearings so I missed one! And now I have to pay his legal fees as ordered by the judge possiblly! OMG!! not fair! It defies logic but I can’t sit idly until May 1st and then have my son breach the agreement. So I want my son to pick one and present it to the court. I’m grateful PC could save my son from his father’s non-flagship state college after the fact wishes (father did not participate in selection/applications, that was all me for past 6 months full time). And yes Father is very successful to boot. But I digress…

It’s been a challenging few weeks and your support makes it a much easier load to bear. Dealing with pressure from my son to keep all of his options open, to take out Plus loans that his high earning father will not, to support his hard work and ambitions. But your comments give me push I need to better articulate why PC is the most logical choice at this point.

I don’t have the bandwidth to take him to PSU for a visit never mind multiple visits going forward. And he’s not the most logistically oriented kid so it would fall on my shoulders big time whenever he needs assistance. And I can’t abandon my other 2 kids whom I have custody of to pop down to Penn State in a crisis. But kids don’t understand…will touch base with him on all of this and see if I can get through to him a bit.

23

Football - get him Hulu
US News Rankings are laughable these days - high grades from either get him the same jobs and in a couple years, the same MBA

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24

I am so in awe of what you are juggling. Sending you internet hugs from a complete stranger.

I am curious, though – is there a particular concern that PC will raise costs in year 3 and 4 over and above what FAFSA/CSS Profile would indicate if your income increases? If they are being so understanding about your extraordinary situation, I would think that understanding would continue throughout your son’s four years there, and not dissipate once he has enrolled. It may help to set up an appointment with the financial aid counselor assigned to your son, and then reach out to him/her specifically in the future with any questions or concerns.

Also, I personally think Providence is a wonderful city – just the right size for a college student to explore by foot, bike, bus or Uber. And Amtrak makes it super easy to get to Boston, or New Haven, or even New York and Washington DC for a day/weekend/spring break. Far enough away from Boston (and different enough vibe to feel like he’s elsewhere) but super easy to get home in an emergency if needed.

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25

To clarify – if you are receiving need-based financial aid from PC, then it is true that the need-based aid may go down if your income increases, but that would be true at any college that is providing need-based aid, not just PC.

26

Penn State is a party school. It is large enough that he could certainly find likeminded people, but there is a significant party culture.

It is also isolated and travel to Boston will not be easy. There is a local airport, but a tiny one. Many people love Penn State, of course, but it isn’t the place for everyone. We are in state and neither of my kids considered it because it is so rural. The campus is vibrant and thriving, but it is in the middle of the state, truly in the middle of nowhere.

Also, please have your son look into the state funding debacle that has been happening each year for Pennsylvania’s state-related universities. Penn State isn’t a state school, but a state-related school (like Pitt, Temple, and some others). There have been significant legislative battles each spring/summer for the last couple of years to ensure that these universities continue to get state funding. As long as Governor Shapiro is in office, I believe that the funding will happen, but the tuition amount is in limbo each year and OOS students are bearing the bulk of the yearly tuition increases.

Finally, I have been the parent of a medically fragile child and I can see both sides of what is best for a sibling in these situations. I can’t guess what might be better for son, but it is very clear that what is best for you is Providence College. That matters. YOU matter. Your mental health and ability to juggle all of your responsibilities matters.

Do you or your son see a therapist who might be able to moderate a conversation with the two of you so that you can hear what he is saying and he can understand your perspective? Providence College sounds like a great, manageable option for you and for your son…perhaps talking it through with a neutral party might help you both understand each other’s perspectives and come to an agreement that can work.

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27

Thanks for the virtual hug!! :slight_smile: PC has assured me they will work with us. It’s the anecdotal stories that cause pause. Nothing specific to my situation. The Aid counselor has been so wonderful.

My best friend went to PC a million years ago and I spent a lot of time there. I thought it was amazingly fun and beautiful school So that is where my strong interest in PC came from. Plus I’m a practicing Catholic and would love a Catholic school for my children.

When we first visited we assumed it would be full price. We left in awe of the beauty of the campus, the chapel the whole vibe. We never dreamed it would be in reach. I am filled with gratitude personally.

28

Every time I have gone to my computer to google flights, trains, buses, driving directions to Penn State I just browse and then stop! I can’t drive 8 hours personally. And the flights to the small local airport are expensive. Boston is “tricky” to get there from so they tell me. My son wanted “suburban” initially and he has no idea how far of a drive it is to Penn State.

I imagine it will be on me to take him for a tour, but I’m not particularly eager as it would be physically demanding for me. Not impossible, but not a joy! I’m one of those give everything mom’s and I find it challenging to say no to my kids. Maybe I need to learn how to.

29

Thank you for including me in the equation! And I empathize as you have also been the parent of a child with medical challenges.

Great suggestion to speak with someone…I have started investigating and including others who can guide my son a bit along the way.

30

Summer start is different from the regular session, but in any case it costs 8k you don’t have. So, that’s it.

Did he take AP calc and Ap Econ (micro/macro) with scores of 4 or 5?

Please don’t worry about “things that may happen”. Even if he’s at PC, you won’t “pop down” - okay, perhaps for parents’weekend, to take him out to a restaurant, but not “if there’sa problem”. He needs to figure things out by trial&error. You’ll equip him with medical basics (anti vomitive, anti diarrhea, bandaid, paracetamol, cold medicine, etc, etc) and a wikihow laminated page about laundry, and he’ll manage (more or less, then better and better), like hundreds of thousands of freshmen every year everywhere.In addition, even if he attends PC, he needs to be fully confident he’ll be able to be independent, as independent as if he were in PA.

As for his sibling’ (very serious, I understand) medical issues, he can’t drop everything to rush and be at the hospital each time his sibling is admitted- even if he feels he has to or wants to. He’ll need to focus on his studies, his work study job, attending office hours and/or meeting with tutors to refine his paper or check he is learning what he’s supposed to, plus making friends, staying healthy, networking, participating in clubs good for the former or the latter, in short grow as an independent, resourceful young adult who’s successful in college, even if he sees himself primarily as a brother. Honestly trying to rush to the hospital more than once or perhaps twice in the semester could derail college entirely for him. Classes go much faster - the entire 10 months of calc AB are covered in 13 weeks. The 1st semester of a foreign language covers 2 years of HS language. Some classes decrease the student’s grade if they’re absent more than 2-3 times per semester, others count participation including in-class quizzes. In short, he can indicate (to his adviser and what dept deals with this at PC) he will need accomodations and try his best to be there for his sibling during breaks but he has to be able to project himself as a college student, not just as a sibling.

Finally, it’s clear PSU is unaffordable and you’re already under a lot of stress. It’s just not possible. The level of stress you’re feeling right now… :hugs:

Btw, 1/3 of UMass Amherst would currently be 12k (if a typo and you leant 1/2, itd be 18k) + whatever from the 529. Although no amount was written down, this is a guaranteed amount.

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31

There is nothing suburban about Penn State. It isn’t simply the distance from Boston…it is FAR from any major airport or city. The school is hours from Pittsburgh or Philadelphia. There is a town around the school, so there are restaurants, big box stores, grocery stores, a hospital, etc. It is not a city, though.

Good luck to you! I am sorry that you have to manage all of this on your own, and I hope that your son appreciates that you are a voice of reason and not the bad guy.

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32

Oh, if it’s just people’s anecdotes, I wouldn’t worry about that at all unless they provide good, compelling details. What tends to happen is most people don’t understand how need-based financial aid works, and then are surprised that if their income goes up their aid goes down. Or that, at least in the past, many colleges gave need-based “discounts” for families with more than one student in college at a time, and when the older child graduated from college, the younger child’s need-based award might decrease drastically, resulting in significantly increased costs. But that would be true anywhere that gives good need-based aid, not just PC. (And I say in the past, because with the new FAFSA rules, FAFSA-only colleges can’t provide those discounts any longer. CSS Profile colleges (of which PC is one) may still provide those discounts for their institutional funds). And if you have a good relationship with a PC financial aid officer, I would truly think you will be fine in years 3 and 4. In fact, you could ask them about this if you want, just to get it on the record.

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33

Also, do you have significant medical costs for your younger child? Some colleges will be able to exercise “professional judgment” to provide additional aid for families with significant medical costs. Here is the form that PC uses: Appealing Your Aid – Financial Aid (providence.edu)

Also paging @kelsmom for her input.

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34

Thank you. Yes, they have done professional judgement. They have factored in our extraordinary medical expenses. As they say at PC, PC works fast, and it’s true!

From their mission statement: "Providence College is confident in the appeal of reason, believes that human beings are disposed to know the truth, and trusts in the power of grace to enlighten minds, open hearts, and transform lives. "

As a person who has given back most of my adult years volunteering through Boston College and its organizations, with Mother Teresa’s gift of love hospice and beyond to the poor and the sick I’ve always been committed to being of service to others. Good things flow from service to others.

#Grateful!

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35

Mommy, you are truly extraordinary.

Is there a teacher, counselor, priest that your son is close to (or admires) who can take him out for an ice cream and “talk about your future”?

The more information you provide, the more concerned I become about the Penn State option. Has your son figured out what EACH trip home is going to cost? Even if he’s just paying half for gas and tolls if he finds a classmate who is driving to Massachusetts-- each and every trip.

Getting into a top MBA program has nothing to do with Penn State vs. Providence and EVERYTHING to do with HIM. I graduated from what was at the time at top 5 MBA program and my classmates came from schools you’ve heard of, obscure tiny colleges you haven’t heard of, and everything in between.

Your son has the opportunity to make the first sound, fact-based decision of his business career here. And NOT taking on unnecessary debt, exploding the time, hassle, and cost of a visit home, and basing a decision on emotion vs. data is the sound way to move ahead.

Maybe time to get another adult in on the dialogue.

Truly sorry about your ex. Situation sounds absurd but it is what it is.

Hugs for being a great Mom!

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36

From reading the posts, PC sounds like the best option. I worked at a large public university and at two small schools. Large schools are great, but …

At PC, you found staff that cared about your child and worked to make it possible for him to attend. I worked at schools like this, and we were empowered to help our students in a way that staff at most larger schools were not. Your family situation is unique, and having staff who support your child is a blessing.

I went to school less than 45 minutes from my parents’ house. I rarely saw my parents (rarely even talked to them in those days of expensive long distance phone calls). He will feel as far away from home at PC as he would as Penn State … but he can more easily get home when he wants/needs to if he goes to PC.

As for grad school, the undergrad school is far less important than the student himself, as others have correctly pointed out. I would think that he would have ample opportunities to get to know his professors at PC - this will be extremely helpful when it’s time to apply to grad schools.

Many of us here have had to tell our kids no when it comes to certain schools due to cost. I had to tell both of my kids no to at least one school. Don’t feel too bad for doing so … it’s one of those situations when parenting is difficult but necessary.

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37

Me too.
:hugs::hugs:

MBA admission will require 2+ years of work, which will depend on internships, which will depend on what HE does in college. At PC, he’ll be in a more personal institution, with smaller classes, professors who know him, opportunities offered to the most involved students. At huge universities, students can get lost in the crowd (which is why Summer Start is so useful - small cohorts - but you can get that for less $$ at PC and not just for 1 summer but all the time.)
And if staff at PC know about your situation, it’ll be better for him and you.
If he’s worried you’ll be close enough to drop ny, assure him you won’t (even if it sounds like you’re too busy to even contemplate this).

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38

Others have been giving you great advice, so I have nothing more to add. Just wanted to share this with you:

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Hope you feel hugged.

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39

I agree that Providence College is the much better option. The cost to attend the PSU summer session for an out of state student would be about $10,000 for tuition alone, plus several thousand for room and board. And as you mentioned, he wouldn’t be able to have a summer job to earn money. I think you’re going to have to tell your son that it’s just not affordable. We are instate for Penn State and I (another single mom) refused to let my D17 apply, knowing that we would be unable to afford PSU.

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40

@kelsmom Can you speak to the OP’s son’s concern that PC will arbitrarily raise the price tag for years 3 and 4? That seems to be a major factor for him. Having info from someone with your background may be very helpful for him.

OP — Kelsmom is a former financial aid director and knows sooo much about financial aid!

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