<p>
</p>
<p>Really. I went to college '67-'71 and I could never even stand the stench of it.</p>
<p>*To simply state that they are crazy and “smoked pot” at one stage in their life is not proof enough to validate their postulations though."</p>
<p>They probably ate meat and drank sodas too.*
<a href=“http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/links/doi/10.1046/j.1440-1614.2000.00685.x/abs/[/url]”>http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/links/doi/10.1046/j.1440-1614.2000.00685.x/abs/</a>
<a href=“http://bjp.rcpsych.org/cgi/content/abstract/178/2/116[/url]”>http://bjp.rcpsych.org/cgi/content/abstract/178/2/116</a>
<a href=“Psychiatry Online”>Psychiatry Online;
<a href=“http://pt.wkhealth.com/pt/re/addi/abstract.00008514-200209000-00010.htm;jsessionid=FjQQc46Pmvtk3XQn1RGbqQt7fj2vjXKyG3nRLmMwWsQGQsT1LzJB!-1047064887!-949856145!8091!-1[/url]”>http://pt.wkhealth.com/pt/re/addi/abstract.00008514-200209000-00010.htm;jsessionid=FjQQc46Pmvtk3XQn1RGbqQt7fj2vjXKyG3nRLmMwWsQGQsT1LzJB!-1047064887!-949856145!8091!-1</a>
marijuana(THC) is cumulative in the body including brain
it doesn’t take a high school diploma to figure out that, that will sooner or later present changes.
<a href=“Stages of progression in drug involvement from adolescence to adulthood: further evidence for the gateway theory - PubMed”>Stages of progression in drug involvement from adolescence to adulthood: further evidence for the gateway theory - PubMed;
<p>I find it interesting that despite many substantive studies, some of 21 years, that some people still find the need to make cracks about the results.
What it is that marijuana gives you that you feel so protective of?</p>
<p>“What it is that marijuana gives you that you feel so protective of?”</p>
<p>Another offensive jab. ‘GIVES’ present tense??? I take offense to this.</p>
<p>One word: bong. Although THC is not water soluble other carcinogenic constituents are; however, which greatly reduces their presence in the smoke that eventually reaches your lungs. Yes, there are dangers associated with marijuana. There are also dangers, de facto more dangers associated with cigarettes and tobacco and yet they are legal. </p>
<p>Also, every time you sit in your car, cross the street, drink a soda, and even leave your house you are subjecting yourself to danger and yet you still presumably persist. I don’t know why people continue to assume that the essence of a person’s life is measured by its longevity.</p>
<p>from one of the above-posted links:</p>
<p>"Results: There is limited clinical evidence for the first hypothesis. If ‘cannabis psychoses’ exist, they seem to be rare, because they require very high doses of tetrahydrocannabinol, the prolonged use of highly potent forms of cannabis, or a pre-existing (but as yet unspecified) vulnerability, or both. There is more support for the second hypothesis in that a large prospective study has shown a linear relationship between the frequency with which cannabis had been used by age 18 and the risk over the subsequent 15 years of receiving a diagnosis of schizophrenia.</p>
<p>Conclusions: It is still unclear whether this means that cannabis use precipitates schizophrenia, whether cannabis use is a form of ‘self-medication’, or whether the association is due to the use of other drugs, such as amphetamines, which heavy cannabis users are more likely to use. There is better clinical and epidemiological evidence that cannabis use can exacerbate the symptoms of schizophrenia.‘’</p>
<p>That doesn’t sound very conclusive. It seems to say that if someone has a predisposition to schizophrenia, pot might increase their vulnerability. Well, so can a lot of other things.</p>
<p>Anyway, no one here is defending pot. POT IS BAD. OK??? Get it?</p>
<p>Caffeine is bad.</p>
<p>Sugar is bad.</p>
<p>Fried foods are bad.</p>
<p>A lot of things are bad.</p>
<p>Most of them legal.</p>
<p>I have not smoked pot in over 25 years, and I never will again, and I hope my son never does. But when I say pot is RELATIVELY benign COMPARED to harder drugs, that’s exactly what I mean. I still contend that alcohol is worse, overall. That doesn’t make pot safe. And I don’t need a study to tell me that. I know from experience. I’ve seen what it does to people I went to school with. Nothing real obvious…nothing violent like alcohol…but…they…just…sort…of…slow…down…their…liiiiiivvvvess…and…just…want…to…curl…up…with…a …Pink…Floyd…album…with headphones.</p>
<p>Stupid. </p>
<p>Can you feel the drool?</p>
<p>See, we aren’t protective of pot. We’re just indignant when people imply that it’s this horrible thing, and they lump it in with all the other horrible drugs, and they don’t see the contradiction when they do their own drugs. I contend that we’re all better off without ANY drugs, whether that be alcohol, cigarettes, pot, painkillers, whatever.</p>
<p>It’s self-righteous and hypocritical to treat pot-smokers like scum while holding a drink or popping their painkillers…</p>
<p>I think you have to understand my tolerance points…</p>
<p>There’s dumb and there’s stupid.</p>
<p>Dumb are those things that thank God, don’t result in a trip to the hospital, jail or free clinic. A little experimentation is dumb, but for the most part harmless in the big picture. You have to learn what your limits are. It might mean you burn your hand on the burner or puke in your girlfriend (excuse me ex-girlfriend)'s lap. Stupid is buying the stuff, stupid is continuing to use ANYTHING to excess. Stupid is the hospital, stupid is jail, stupid is someone really gets hurt. I can always forgive dumb, stupid is a bit different.</p>
<p>It isn’t the drug that’s a concern, it’s a developement of an addictive behavor that’s at issue. There is no truly safe or harmless thing a person can do with an addictive personality. Coke, beer, smokes, weed, food, exercise, whatever, some people just can’t handle anything. It’s going to depend on your kid.</p>
<p>So if a kid does a dumb thing once or twice but doesn’t make a habit of being dumb, I can live with it. Stupid is not as easily forgiven, but stupid can be if the person is smart enough to stop being stupid.</p>
<p>Opie, I totally agree with you. Your latest post is, as always, very well stated! Thanks for making such an important distinction!</p>
<p>I would like to differentiate the context of the word ‘stupid’ in the way you used it vs the way I used it.</p>
<p>I used the word ‘stupid’ when referring to pot to distinguish its effects from those of other drugs.</p>
<p>Alcohol tends to bring out the worst in people. It contributes greatly to acts of violence (barroom brawls, people shooting each other in a drunken rage, etc.) and deaths on the highway. All in all, a lot of death and violence often results from alcohol use. That’s not even counting the liver damage.</p>
<p>We already know that drugs like crack, meth, etc. are highly addictive and can be deadly.</p>
<p>Pot, in comparison, tends to make people a bit…er, hazy. Sometimes apathetic. In short, stupid.</p>
<p>I didn’t mean it literally. As I previously stated, I was one of those who maintained an excellent GPA and worked in a technical field, while getting high in the evenings. But, looking back, those 6 years are…HAZY. I don’t remember them too well.</p>
<p>There used to be a popular shirt that said ‘Are you stoned or just stupid?’ that I think makes the point quite well.</p>
<p>Anyway, the point is, that even though pot is RELATIVELY mild IN COMPARISON with harsher drugs, I contend that it’s still not a very smart thing to do. It can cloud one’s judgment, cause wonderful memories to be lost, and affect clarity of thought and emotions. Worst of all, it can offer a convenient escape from reality so that the person may tend to bury his feelings, thus preventing healthy communication and intimacy. And, if those studies are correct, PERHAPS increase the predisposition to certain mental conditions. Other drugs, including many prescription and over-the-counter drugs, can do the very same thing.</p>
<p>Those are more than enough reasons to stay away from it, imo. And those are the reasons I tell my kid. It doesn’t do to lump all drugs together and say ‘Don’t do any drugs OR ELSE!’ because the kid knows better. We don’t need to make pot a bigger demon than it is. The truth is that it’s a little demon compared to the really nasty demons out there. But it’s still a demon. It can still have negative consequences on one’s life. I think it’s better to be honest about it than to try to make the kids think that drugs are all the same. They’ll learn soon enough (if that haven’t already) and if anything will influence them in favor of getting high, it’s learning that it’s not QUITE as scary as Mom made it sound. otoh, if Mom admits that pot’s only a leeetle bit scary, but scary nonetheless! then I think they’ll be much more open to some common sense guidelines.</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.samhsa.gov/news/newsreleases/060907_nsduh.aspx[/url]”>http://www.samhsa.gov/news/newsreleases/060907_nsduh.aspx</a></p>
<p>From the above (U.S. Dept. of Health and Human Services, Substance Abuse and Mental Health Service Administration):</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>While I understand that many people need to justify their own current or past use of drugs, by declaring it not harmful, when newly released research indicates it to be more negative than previously thought, it is a shame that people arent capable of incorporating new information into their opinion.</p>
<p>While I would quickly agree that for some diseases, ALS, MS, glaucoma for example, marijuana prescribed by a medical provider has been found to be very useful and in some cases most effective.
But does no one ever wonder that if pot is so effective against these very severe degenerative diseases, what affect it has on healthy tissue?</p>
<p>Incidentally, I don’t take painkillers, and while I do drink alcohol occasionally, it doesn’t accumulate in my fat layer, staying indefinitely, and I also don’t contribute to the coffers of drug dealers who also don’t require ID or govt oversight, but will sell to children who don’t realize that because the “harmless looking green stuff” is advertised as “safe” by their parents generation, doesn’t mean that their joints arent soaked in embalming fluid and PCP.
[Dude</a>!, thats what makes it so *****in’ man!](<a href=“http://www.foh4you.com/mem/library/default.asp?TopicId=268&CategoryId=0&ArticleId=90]Dude”>http://www.foh4you.com/mem/library/default.asp?TopicId=268&CategoryId=0&ArticleId=90)</p>
<p>So sorry, you’ll have to find something else to accuse me of hypocrisy.</p>
<p>“joints dipped in embalming fluid and laced with phencyclidine (PCP)”</p>
<p>Creepy!</p>
<hr>
<ol>
<li><p>I never accused anyone personally of hypocrisy. If you took it personally, that was your choice. I was speaking in generalities.</p></li>
<li><p>You, otoh, along with others in this discussion whom I do not have to name because it is so obvious, have deliberately attacked both Opie and me. Twice sarcastic jabs were made implying that we STILL do drugs. I find these accusations HIGHLY OFFENSIVE. We’ve also been accused of ‘defending’ pot. And now you have the audacity to completely twist our words and say that we think it is harmless. W<em>F??? I called it a demon. Repeatedly I have said to stay away from it. I said it makes people stupid, as well as many others negative effects. W</em>F??? Never did I say it was ‘harmless.’ Everything that I said that you MISTAKENLY took as positive, was only intended to draw a comparison between it and harsher drugs. Obviously, pot soaked in some other chemical IS NO LONGER POT, now is it?</p></li>
</ol>
<p>No wonder your kids don’t talk to you if you insist on twisting everything they say.</p>
<p>For the benefit of any teens who might be reading this thread:</p>
<p>"…a marijuana joint is dipped in formaldehyde and ethyl alcohol (the main ingredients of embalming fluid), and PCP is added to enhance marijuana’s effects, increasing the risks of harmful reactions.</p>
<p>…Most adolescent drug users do not know that embalming fluid found on the street contains PCP, so they have no idea what they are consuming. PCP is not a normal component of embalming fluid but is added before the embalming fluid is distributed on the street. Finding embalming fluid to buy on the street is not easy because most street drug dealers make more money selling individual joints soaked with embalming fluid for about $10 to $20…</p>
<p>The percentage of formaldehyde found in embalming fluid ranges anywhere from 5 to 29 percent. The percentage of ethyl alcohol, the psychoactive ingredient found in alcoholic beverages, varies anywhere from 9 to 56 percent. According to the Office of National Drug Control Policy, it is common for marijuana to be laced with PCP or embalming fluid, both of which produce a hallucinogenic effect…</p>
<p>They taste like rubbing alcohol and smell like gasoline, so why do many teens still want to smoke marijuana joints treated in embalming fluid and laced with PCP? Because they burn more slowly than marijuana joints that are not treated, there is an increased chance of a prolonged high. Although this treatment of marijuana is thought of as an emerging drug trend, its use actually has been around since the 1970s.
Marijuana combined with embalming fluid and PCP can have the following effects:
Short-term Effects:</p>
<pre><code>* Anger and frustration
- Depression
- Hallucinations and delusions
- Headache
- Impaired vision and coordination
- Increase in women’s sexual appetites
- Loss of consciousness
- Memory loss
- Paranoia
- Physical violence
- Sleepiness
- Vomiting
</code></pre>
<p>Long -term Effects:</p>
<pre><code>* Brain damage
- Bronchitis
- Coma
- Convulsions
- Coughing
- Destruction of muscle tissue
- Fever
- Heart attack
- High blood pressure
- Inflammation of the throat, nose, and esophagus
- Kidney damage
- Lung damage
- Maturation process cessation
- Pneumonia
- Spinal cord destruction
</code></pre>
<p>The education and awareness about this drug trend is vital to the public, whether to inform parents, caregivers, or teens about the dangerous additive in some marijuana joints, or to warn current marijuana users about the increased immediate and harmful effects. If you are concerned that someone you know might be using marijuana dipped in embalming fluid and laced with PCP, some warning signs that you should look out for are:</p>
<pre><code>* Unreasonable anger and frustration
- Depression
- Physical violence
- Sleepiness
</code></pre>
<p>Slang words for marijuana joints dipped in embalming fluid and laced with PCP: Amp, Clickem, Crazy Eddie, Drank, Fry, Fry Sweet, Ill, Illy, Milk, Purple Rain, Wack, Water-Water, Wet, Wet-Wet, Wetdaddy."</p>
<p>As the woody allen movie line went… " I used to get high on heroin, now I am addicted to Jesus." </p>
<p>I tend to the holier than thou community with a bit of distain as their secrets are far more juicy than mine. Didn’t your mama ever teach you pointing a finger at someone else points three back at you? Of course your thumb is either pointing at the guy to the side or up at Jesus. </p>
<p>This originally was how to deal with a situation with kids, not a moral high horse. Imply what you want, if it feels better and makes you whole by all means don’t let me stop you.</p>
<p>hh, there is more than 1 way to give STRONG PARENTAL DISAPPROVAL of pot. My son knows that I STRONGLY DISAPPROVE of ANY drug use, including pot. (Hell, I disapprove of caffeine!) He also knows that he can talk to me about it if he’s ever tempted, and I will understand what he’s going thru and will be able to help him. That’s a very valuable thing.</p>
<p>emerald, from the link you posted:</p>
<p>“As the name implies, ?freebase? is the base form of cocaine, as opposed to the salt form of cocaine hydrochloride. Whereas cocaine hydrochloride is extremely soluble in water, cocaine base is insoluble in water and is therefore not suitable for drinking, snorting or injecting. Whereas cocaine hydrochloride is not well-suited for smoking because the temperature at which it vaporizes is very high, and close to the temperature at which it burns; however, cocaine base vaporizes at a low temperature, which makes it suitable for inhalation.”</p>
<p>So, we are both right. It is a terminology issue. What I call ‘cocaine’ is the white crystalline powder (cocaine hydrochloride), and that cannot be smoked. However, there are other forms of cocaine which CAN be smoked. I refer to those with other names: crack, freebase, etc. That’s why I didn’t think of them as ‘cocaine.’ But, they are FORMS of cocaine, so we are both right.</p>
<p>I was wondering how long it would be before Jesus would be brought into the conversation. Poor guy. He really gets a bad rap sometimes.</p>
<p>No kid on this planet is going to talk to a parent if they are “sorely tempted” to use a drug, imo.</p>
<p>“The both of you please stop trying to play I’m a more moral parent than you”</p>
<p>I’m not a parent at all, so I’m certainly not claiming special expertise, moral or otherwise. I agree that this is just a difference of opinion, and a small one at that.</p>
<p>We’re on the same page when it comes to pot. I’ve had a great deal of experience being a teetotaler among drunks and a teetotaler among the stoned. While drunks are admittedly more entertaining, I would love to see heavy-drinking teenagers switch to pot brownies at parties. We’d have a lot fewer dead kids. (If you grow your own, you don’t have to worry about PCP or funding drug pushers.) I like to party sober, but I don’t have much hope for converting the nation to my habits. I DO think there’s more we can do to make abuse uncool.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Not if they are going to get behind the wheel of a car afterwards. Studies in Britain and France recently have shown that marijuana use prior to driving is a major factor in FATAL car crashes:</p>
<p><a href=“http://dailynewscentral.com/content/view/1978/0[/url]”>http://dailynewscentral.com/content/view/1978/0</a></p>
<p><a href=“http://webmd.com/content/article/115/111967.htm[/url]”>Substance Abuse: Drug Types, Alcohol, Tobacco, and More;
<p>“No kid on this planet is going to talk to a parent if they are “sorely tempted” to use a drug, imo.”</p>
<p>Now WHICH parent in this discussion said s/he was ‘sorely tempted’ to use a drug?</p>
<p>“Not if they are going to get behind the wheel of a car afterwards. Studies in Britain and France recently have shown that marijuana use prior to driving is a major factor in FATAL car crashes:”</p>
<p>At last! Something we can agree on!</p>
<p>It is a myth that pot does not impair driving. While it may not impair driving quite AS MUCH as heavy drinking, it DOES impair driving nonetheless. Reflexes are drastically slowed down and unexpected traffic situations take on a surreal quality. I would NEVER get in a car with a driver who is even mildly high.</p>
<p>There would, however, be fewer dead drunks in bars.</p>
<hr>
<p>“I would love to see heavy-drinking teenagers switch to pot brownies at parties.”</p>
<p>If they don’t drive, then I would agree with this statement. There would be fewer rapes, too. But, better yet, I would love to see teenagers realize that they don’t need drug stimulants to feel naturally high and have a good time. They should take up running.</p>
<p>I realized I inserted “sorely” after it was too late to delete it! Sorry, you said “tempted.” Don’t know why I thought “sorely.” Do you think kids would be more apt to call Mom about it if they were tempted as opposed to sorely tempted? I don’t think they’d consult Mom however much tempted on this issue, imo. (Unless, perhaps, they thought Mom might give the green light on trying it once or twice to see what all the fuss was about.)</p>