Lest we think it is just the fraternities - here is the Wiki on the Baylor football team scandal, which is floating around on various social media feeds - also largely covered up. Remember, Baylor is a Christian University with very strict conduct rules.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baylor_University_sexual_assault_scandal
Interesting to see who got “punished” and for what. 2 of the 7 have claimed (through their lawyers) they did not engage in the activity and did not do drugs. In the victim’s original statement there were 4 partners. The 3 others were in the room at some point.
The statements from their lawyers are worth a read.
I don’t think anyone can deny the prevalence of SA in Greek Life. That said, athletes, politicians, corporate leaders, military members, law enforcement, teachers, actors, news anchors, and other men in power sometimes behave as if women exist for their personal gratification and assume an entitlement that doesn’t exist. Our country has twice elected a president who boasted about grabbing women by the pu$$y, and that apparently wasn’t disqualifying to the ~80M Americans who voted for him in 2024, many of them women.
I think overemphasizing the role of Greek Life is a way of distancing oneself (or more likely in this case, one’s children) from the risks: “Well, my D doesn’t walk alone at night, or dress provocatively, or belong to a sorority, or drink or use drugs, so therefore, this won’t happen to her.” We all know this is a myth. In reality, living life as a woman makes us vulnerable—not just on college campuses, but in the workplace, in a parking lot, on the street, on a run in the park or a hike in the woods. Furthermore, and as others have pointed out, 18-22 year olds as a group (both male and female) are curious about sex, eager to explore their new-found freedom, and don’t always have the judgement to match their volition.
I’m not saying there aren’t real issues with Greek life/culture, there certainly are, but even if fraternities ceased to exist, there will always be men who behave immorally and illegally to obtain what they want and think they’re entitled to from women—and it doesn’t end with graduation and leaving Greek Life behind. We have all encountered the 45 year old Frat Bro, we just get better at recognizing him and dealing with him (or avoiding him) as we mature; something most young women haven’t yet mastered.
I agree with your post 100%. I’d also add that in addition to recognizing him, dealing with him and/or avoiding him, many of us learn the institutional levers that are available to us-- a steep learning curve which is very hard for a 20 year old to figure out.
And it may be very different too. I have just seen an instagram post with someone who was raped at USC (the person was found guilty, but it took 476 days to get to that point). They (title IX investigation) called in a whole bunch of people and asked them fairly explicit questions about her personal and sexual history (she has photos of some of the questions). Apparently no one was asked any questions about the guy’s history.
The post is public but I am not sure if the rules here allow me to share the username, but it was very insightful about how difficult the process actually is for victims. This was another one who ended up leaving her dream school because of it.
Yeah, the reality is the more I sit with this, the more I feel the only real answer is to abolish all fraternities. Period. It is irrelevant that some people have anecdotal “good experiences” with them. In this situation, there were 50+ men who received the text and no one stopped it, and while people are appalled, no one is that shocked that frat boys would act that way.
When there is a school-sponsored, school-adjacent, or even school-tolerated club that has misogyny and sexual assault woven into its fabric like the Greek system does, it is time to bury the whole system six feet under and start something new.
Yes, there are terrible men everywhere. But why allow clubs designed from the ground up to normalize, justify, and facilitate SA?
The Greek system is about exclusion, wealth, status, and patriarchy. If people want to create clubs that are about friendship and service, great! But that is not what the Greek system is. It is a cancer on college campuses.
Indeed. Corporations are also (somewhat) better at protecting their female employees. When I was working at a well regarded financial services firm in the 90s there were several male executives who were infamous for harassing their female subordinates - nothing ever happened to them even though everyone knew what they were doing. That would be much harder to get away with today.
And the key change was NOT protecting employees. It was when clients/customers and vendors started pushing back.
It’s one thing to lose an admin or an analyst every now and then when she can no longer tolerate the situation and nobody will take action. It’s another thing when your firm loses out on a huge bond issue because the client decision-maker- a woman- picks up the phone to call the CEO to explain “the leader of your team is a pig and I choose not to work with a pig”.
There were cheers and cupcakes-- a spontaneous display of emotion after that phone call!
And I once witnessed the full court press- a phone call to the CEO, and then emails to the General Counsel, Chief Human Resources officer, and members of the board-- all cc’d. The days of “plausible deniability” were over. Some senior employee is an entitled aggressor who preys on colleagues who have no power? Oh well, boys will be boys. Clients are walking away because he’s violently pressed the wrong woman up against a wall and whispered something disgusting in her ear? Consequences.
I had a (male) boss back then who, when one of our admin got groped by someone and told him, pushed the case through the company to make sure the guy got taken before whatever board it was (I don’t think they fired him but I think he got an immediate final written warning). Boss knew that kind of stuff got swept under the carpet by other departments and wasn’t going to let that happen in his.
Back to topic, I just heard about this old incident (frat house hanging sheets as banners to “welcome” freshman girls). I guess they don’t do that anymore but do we think the thinking inside the frat houses that see this as funny has changed?
It’s sad that is what it took.
Sad and horrific and effective.
New clause added into every offer letter; new system of reporting so that if you want to report your boss, the report doesn’t end up on his desk; the old protocol of “three strikes and you’re out unless you’re valuable to us in which case we stop counting strikes” is over. No more three strikes. And no more “let’s keep this out of the papers, shall we?”
Shaking my head
I think this is a very fair observation. It is often a lot more about power and connections, and that crosses party lines. Though there is a difference when those in power suggest it is ok compared to at least acknowledging that it isn’t. Some politicians are forced by their party to resign or drop out of a race when these allegations surface and some are just excused by their party. So there’s that.
I don’t know if this is accurate, but I have seen more than one suggestion that Jane Doe was not a high income /legacy etc kid and that this disadvantaged her in this context too vs who at least some of the frat guys were. That would track with this reading of how power and connections might be involved. It does seem at least that the family couldn’t eat the cost of losing the tuition for the semester at Cornell (they refused to refund) and why she felt compelled to see the semester out despite what must have been an awful environment to be in.
Columbia university sororities just put out a joint statement of support for Jane Doe and a set of demands for more transparency from the university on sexual assault and violence.
Here, overall, is an excellent opportunity for sororities and fraternities across the country to utilize their vast networks and organizational skills to effect positive change.
Sadly - booze (and there were drugs) cause so much destruction in society that it goes beyond transparency.
Too many join with the idea of parties and too many - meet the need with parties and more.
The messages are nice but where there’s an over abundance of booze and drugs, there will be bad things that happen.
agree. It’s like the “groundbreaking” study from a few years ago which showed that the presence of a gun (in a military barracks, in a private home, in a college dorm) significantly increased the rate of suicide by gunshot. One of the takeaways was that although some suicides are meticulously planned, others are reactive/spontaneous events. And having a loaded gun at arms length is a deadly factor for someone experiencing suicidal thoughts- even if they would have been fleeting or temporary.
A reminder that this is not the Politics Forum, and posts that don’t comply with Forum Rules are subject to editing/deleting without notice or explanation.
I agree with you and with @tsbna44. It’s really a perfect storm: underdeveloped brains who aren’t thinking through the long-term consequences of decisions made; group dynamics in which “everyone is doing it” seems to negate a sense of personal responsibility; opportunity to satisfy a desire or curiosity (morality be damned!); and a culture in which men are not consistently held accountable for the abuse and mistreatment of women. On top of this, add alcohol and drugs and it’s nothing short of a disaster waiting to happen. Oh yeah, and let’s not forget that college boys drinking and doing drugs is often used an explanation for poor judgement, and for college women engaged in the same behavior, it’s seen as a reason that she’s to blame for being assaulted.
As the mother of a D who graduated college in 2024, reading these texts of “free pu$$y” and “just whip it out” and “store still open?” absolutely turns my stomach. I keep thinking about the excitement and promise her family must have had when taking her to Cornell and the sickening rage I would feel to hear my daughter spoken of that way. I would love to know how the parents of these young men are responding to this news. I simply can’t imagine my despair if my son treated a woman this way.