I lost a family member to suicide. He was very popular, had a girlfriend, etc. and no one saw it coming. He believed that he was doing everyone a favor because he was in such a dark place. It will never be ok, but I am certainly not mad at him because he couldn’t control his thoughts. One of the best descriptions of depression that I’ve read are the dementors sucking all the happiness out of people in Harry Potter.
My nephew was anything but impulsive. He drove almost 400 miles to his destination, in an area that he had never visited. It was obvious he had researched it carefully.
"But suicide is rarely impulsive. "
Actually, a lot of the info I’ve read states the opposite. Here is one example of many. Obviously there is no uniform opinion on this. Research studies are all over the map with estimates on impulsive suicides ranging from 20% to over 80%.
https://www.vox.com/2015/7/30/9068255/suicide-impulsive-gun-control
""One myth, for example, is that suicide isn’t impulsive, and people will simply resort to other methods if some lethal means — like guns — aren’t available to them.
But Jill Harkavy-Friedman, vice president of research for the American Foundation for Suicide Prevention, told me years of research show that suicides tend to be fairly impulsive acts during short-term crises, and they can be caused by multiple factors that sometimes may not be perfectly clear to the public or even friends and family."
“Time is really key to preventing suicide in a suicidal person,” she said. “First, the crisis won’t last, so it will seem less dire and less hopeless with time. Second, it opens the opportunity for someone to help or for the suicidal person to reach out to someone to help. That’s why limiting access to lethal means is so powerful.”"
Success rate differs greatly depending on method chosen, which many experts believe points to a degree of impulsivity. Guns - fatality rate is over 80%. Overdose - fatality is less than 2%.
“The fourth is ability to abort mid-attempt. More people start an attempt and abort it than carry it through; therefore, methods that can be interrupted without harm mid-attempt — such as overdose, cutting, CO poisoning, and hanging/suffocation — offer a window of opportunity for rescue or change of heart that guns and jumps do not.”
https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/means-matter/means-matter/case-fatality/
I wish that had been true in our case. 
One needs to look at the myriad of risk factors to understand the many variables that contribute to suicide https://www.cdc.gov/violenceprevention/suicide/riskprotectivefactors.html . And definitions vary as to what is considered “impulsive”, and what may be considered a response to a short term crisis. Even if the crisis is relatively short term, the person who suicides frequently takes steps to plan and carry out their plan.
Without going down “that” rabbit hole, yes, easy access to lethal means does increase the risk of a successful suicide. That said, its unlikely many of the successful suicide by firearm are done by someone thinking “hmm, I think I’ll just off myself today”, with no history of prior mood disorder, suicidal ideation, situational stressors, etc.
The way I read the quote in post #102 is as it relates to suicides in response to a short term crisis. Many, if not likely the majority of suicides, are not responses to a short term crisis.
But, with respect to short term crises, there are the examples of criminals who are cornered and suicide rather than surrender. That is probably considered “impulsive”. But I know of a young, promising young man who apparently got arrested for drug possession with intent to distribute and felt pressured to turn in his dealers to avoid ruining his potential career and face a possible prison time. Meets criteria for a short term crisis. Fearing the negative consequences of both options (fearing what would happen if he turned in his suppliers), he went to Home Depot, bought a ladder, rope, and went into the woods. Was that “impulsive”? It was clearly thought out and planned.
Well…Andy Spade has put out a statement.Among other things, he says that KS had suffered from Depression and Anxiety and had been receiving treatment for 5 years. He said they had been separated for 10 months and had not even discussed divorce. They still ate many meals together and vacationed together. Their daughter split her time between them.
Most interesting is his claim that he did not see any suicide note written by his wife although he seems to be saying there was one:
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/06/style/andy-spade-statement.html
It’s unfortunate when people refer to MH issues as “ fighting with personal demons” It is an illness, not a possession. This is one of the best articles I’ve read on why that phraseology is ill advised: http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/public_health/Battling-demons-When-it-comes-to-mental-illness-language-matters.html
Okay - agreed, “impulsive” wasn’t a good word choice. What I meant was a choice made, that when looked on with hindsight, would have been done differently, had one been thinking “rationally” (ie, not clouded by the Depression)…
Not sure why you quoted my comment about why people are discussing the allegation that KS refused treatment, but omitted my comment below, which is of the same sentiment as yours above.
None of us really needs to “know” the truth but I suspect truth lies sonewhere between the husband’s statement and the sister’s statement. The reality was something was not “OK” with Kate Spade and mentally healthy people don’t typically kill themselves and it is always tragic for the family and close friends who are always left wondering if they could have done more.
@Nrdsb4 I never said it was. Too much speculation about situations like this one where no one actually knows anything about the individual concerned or about the effects of depression itself. All over, in the media and here.
I saw it when the son of a dear friend committed suicide on his mother’s birthday an hour after speaking to her on the phone to wish her a happy birthday. People saying how selfish, how cruel of him, he’s ruined her birthday forever. People shouldn’t comment with opinions on things they know nothing about.
This makes sense to me (if it’s true): https://pagesix.com/2018/06/06/fashion-insiders-claim-alcohol-may-have-fueled-kate-spades-tragic-decline/?_ga=2.12645300.2053303628.1528121858-2004094866.1515516342
" and the findings are the higher the ground water lithium level (still micro level compared to pharmaceutical dose) the lower the population depression rate. There are such claims to use microdosing of lithium to treat depression and bipolar."
Lithium Carbonate has been used for many years to treat bipolar disorder. It’s hardly new.
If it’s true, to me it just indicates that she was self-medicating. A high percentage of people with serious mental illnesses do.
@Classof2015 Please note Andy Spade’s statement denies any substance abuse.
I realize you did say IF it was true. I’m just saying Spade has denied it.
Quote from an interview with her father: "The last I talked with her, the night before last, she was happy planning a trip to California to look at colleges. She doted on her daughter,” he told the paper. Spade leaves behind her 13-year-old Frances, whom she named her clothing line that she launched in 2016 after.
Looking at colleges with a 13-year-old? Wow.
Kate Spade is not here to speak for herself. Everything is being reported by people she had a relationship with, without context, perhaps with some embellishment. Perhaps her daughter is extremely bright and it would not be inappropriate to visit schools with her. I don’t think that’s out of the realm of possibilities. I personally looked at colleges with my D when she was finishing her 8th grade year - oh, she was 13, almost 14. Perhaps those visits wouldn’t have been appropriate for most young teens, but they were right for us. Who are we to judge Kate Spade’s choices and plans for her family vacation? Who are we to judge her at all?
Just a reminder - there’s help available if you need or want it. I’m sorry if you’re hurting that badly because it really does suck. Reach out. National Suicide Prevention Lifeline: Call 1-800-273-8255
@jonri yes that’s why I said IF. I had read his statement on the NYT. These “fashion insiders” could also be trading on old gossip – who knows. But a friend of mine who has struggled with alcohol addiction said that is the only thing that makes sense to her.