thank you
@fretfulmother thank you. My kid is not the same kid in your class. I am amazed on how people can generalize. How can anyone even assume that DD does not have an impressive list of summer activities is beyond me
Some of us are advocating you look at more than what you think matters or what you think is more impressive or an advantage. You can go with a poster opinion or take a look at what the colleges actually say. And what the Common App asks.
Well OK then, it would have to be reported if it was at the high school.
The common app asks for academic enrichment activities to be listed. Even if not taken for credit, this is clearly an academic enrichment activity. Don’t ask your kid to lie on their college application. But if this is all on the up and up and not any attempt to make colleges think the OP’s kid is a better student than she is, then there’s no issue, is there?
Actually, in my school there is a “transcript attachment” and students are asked by the GC to disclose exactly that - any courses taken online or in person, for enrichment, etc. etc. My first son listed his Hebrew School as well as his online enrichment courses (Number Theory and a few others) and he even had to list his ill-fated foray into taking a class at Harvard Extension, with the notation that he had dropped. My second son will certainly list his “Duo-Lingo” online work that he took upon himself to do to pick up a language that isn’t offered in our district. It’s not part of your Common App list, no, but it is likely going somewhere, whether in the GC letter, the transcript attachment, or referred to in an LoR from a teacher. It wouldn’t be hidden (but why should it be).
^^^The quote from the common app from lookingforward is explicit about enrichment programs on a secondary school campus. Since this one would be, it would have to be listed. I am sure the OP has no intention of lying on the form, and I am unsure why they would be accused of it.
See post 60. Certainly sounds like the OP doesn’t want to disclose these pre-taken courses.
@lookingforward Thanks!
The math class was a “Russian math” type of class not in “secondary school campus”. Do student really have to list their Kumon type of prep?
The HSSP classes were at MIT but there were not prep classes, just fun. I guess he could have listed those but I assume those would have worked to his benefit anyway.
“The 2009 State of College Admission Report states that during the Fall 2008 admission cycle, 21 percent of colleges reported that they had revoked an admission offer, compared to 35 percent in 2007. The average number of offers that were revoked was 10. The most common reason that colleges indicated for rescinding admission offers was final grades (65 percent), followed by disciplinary issues (35 percent) and falsification of application information (29 percent).”
C’mon. Not disclosing a private course “falsification”? Really stretching it now. I know admissions get rescinded. I asked for a specific example of it being rescinded for not listing a private enrichment course. I’ll mea culpa if you find one. One.
“Secondary” generally refers to high school. There’s a second question that covers colleges:
“List all college/university affiliated courses you have taken since 9th grade and mark all that apply: taught on college campus (CO); taught on high school campus, excluding AP/IB (HS); taught online (ON); college credit awarded (CR); transcript available (TR); degree candidate (DC).”
I personally think it’s unethical to take a summer class in a school subject and then not disclose that on a college application. And I really agree with @mathyone that if there’s nothing wrong with pre-taking, there should be no “need” to hide it. If it’s above-board, then who cares if Harvard knows that your “A” was on taking Chemistry for your personal second time.
Our original disagreement was about whether this class constituted “legal cheating”. No one has answered my question if they believe private tutoring is legal cheating, or why other forms of academic enrichment are not either.
Beyond the specifics of what lookingforward posted? Including things like Berlitz/ID Tech? For the record I have no specific position on this except to say the rules for applications should be exactly followed, whatever they are. Some here posted that the mere act of taking the class was cheating, which was where I objected.
@lookingforward thank you and I can understand. However, I just do not see how it can be labeled as “legal cheating” or whether tutoring is okay, or whether tutoring provided to all students would be okay, then without asking me, some even assumed that she would not have summer activities…It is not advocating for me to look at what matters.People just can’t stand that this kid has an “unfair advantage”…
BTW, outside of school, she is a competitive swimmer, a lifeguard. She volunteers at a hospital. When she turns 16, she will be a cadet EMS and will also get her WSI cert.
Should I package her with a resume for ivies ? no, it is not in my plan…She will have to decide her choice of colleges… I have no problem if she were to attend a state U which we already visited.
I am sorry some kids do not have this “advantage”, I am not going to guess why their parents choose a different path. But it is known that when a kid realizes that she/he is good at something, the kid will further improve…this happened to her and I am not going into specifics for now.
@Postmodern My son took AP Comp Sci as a freshman and that was the most advanced course the high school offered. He took the Graphics course after that - it was a college level course. So no it did not make the high school CS course easier. And of course he put it on his college application, it was one of many CS things he did beyond the HS curriculum.
I actually think that taking the physics summer course because it covers the whole curriculum unlike AP Physics 1 makes sense, except there’s no plan to take the Physics subject test - the original plan was to take Chemistry and Math. (BTW, I think the new curriculum spreading AP Physics over two years is really stupid and has caused endless difficulties with kids’ schedules.)
My older son took Chemistry through CTY another summer because of similar scheduling snafus. He got a “Credit” from the high school and it may have brought his total GPA down a smidgen. He was number 8 in his class, which put him in the top 2% - he still got into top schools. He also ended up taking a regular physics one year instead of honors or AP because of a scheduling problem. That also impacted his GPA.
I’d absolutely list a Berlitz course taken over the summer. The Common Application has lots of boxes to describe how you spent your summers. Most colleges are going to be a lot more impressed by a kid who did something than one who just spent the time at the pool.
As for what I would do in the OP’s shoes. The daughter wants to take the physics summer course and it’s paid for so let’s consider that a given.
- Take AP Chem junior year. Take AP Physics senior year - consider seeing if she can take AP Physics C based on the summer course. Take the physics subject test fall junior year and see how I do. If she gets a great score, no need to worry about the chem subject test and it might help lobby for a more advance physics AP.
OR - Take AP physics junior year and take the physics subject test in the spring. Take AP Chem senior year.
I looked up the AP credit policy at Carnegie Mellon - they give credit for AP Chem, and AP Physics C, but not for AP Physics 1 or 2.
@annamom it sounds like you have a fine kid and I am sure she’ll do fine in college admissions. We just like to argue here on CC. 
The above was not even the discussion…
.
Will it be an unfair advantage if someone take AP Physics 1 again?
I’m not sure about “legal cheating” - what I know is this: most of these kids would not like to disclose on their applications:
“4-8 hours of tutoring per week in HS classes, including extensive help with math in order to stay in Honors science classes”
“Took three classes in summers preceding actual credit course in order to get a higher grade relative to my bozo classmates who didn’t do this scheme”
“Worked every weekend for hours to bring up SAT practice test from 1850 to the 2100 superscore you see before you”
“Bugged teachers relentlessly for every possible point they may have missed, incorporating parental whining to department heads as needed, successfully turning at least four B+ grades into A- over my HS career”
A lot of the elite college admissions staffers’ job is trying to discern/weed out those kids (!!). A big part of the game for parents/students is seeing how much they can get away with to bump up their perceived competitiveness without having to disclose it. There must be a moral line in there somewhere.
Great! But you wouldn’t expect your admission to be rescinded if you didn’t… right?