@roycroftmom in the case of Brunswick, there’s very little availability when it comes to housing. I found two houses. Very few apartments too. That’s it. There won’t be a herd of Bowdoin students just outside campus. They are not allowed to use campus in any way so, really, it doesn’t matter where they live. They really could live anywhere. It would just be to be together.
As others have pointed out, some on this thread are from a tiny, affluent, privileged slice of society. There seems to me a huge business opportunity for your pandemic summer camp idea combined with a volunteer community service component. It’s a good “what I did during the pandemic” essay for college admissions or future employers. I think parents would pay for that. Of course, it might be more impressive if students created their own volunteer effort, especially if able to grow it by recruiting peers.
adding, I’m being sincere here. It seems to me time to start thinking of positive, creative responses when college just won’t be back to normal for a while. Lots of folks here have resources to provide their students fun and interesting alternatives to college this next year.
Good editorial in the Harvard Crimson asking why Harvard College students should pay more than twice as much for their online college courses as the students at Harvard Extension. Apparently many of the courses are identical. Awkward.
I grew up in a traditional farming and food processing community in PA. Every single one of my friends except one (who studied dental hygiene at the community college), went away to college and dormed there. We were all middle class, some, like me, were in the lower middle. In my experience, sleep-away college is not exactly some new phenomenon custom-made for the elite such that it should be so easily scorned as unnecessary.
I’ve actually been saying this for years - but MINUS the “no academics required”. I think there should be large campuses where kids can learn a trade, via a 2 year vocational program, but all together in the same area. Plumbing certification, Electrician, Hair Stylist, Medical tech, etc… Housing doesn’t have to be organized by the campus, it could be local apartments and such, but the key is to have the training schools centralized near each other around a ‘town’ that has grocery stores, shops, bars etc. We’d come a long way to fix the shortage of vocational training that we have and kids would get the ‘college experience’ and be able to move out of home while getting that training.
Because the prestige of Harvard College (versus Harvard Extension School) is bundled with their tuition? Those who do not care about the prestige may want to look into transferring to Harvard Extension School.
Of course, for those getting financial aid, the price comparison may differ.
Living on campus seems an important part of the educational experience to me, but if students can’t be on campus this next year, there are other ways to approximate that experience. Living in an off campus pod with friends, and doing online courses is one way. Creating pods of peers to live together and do service work is another option for those not wanting to online education.
Those in rural areas may have to go away because there are few or no colleges nearby.
In the suburban area that I grew up in, the local community college was the most common destination after high school graduation.
Is there any similarity between football practice, college dorm living/parties? If so, it doesn’t bode well (lots of spread): https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2020/06/22/college-football-programs-hit-covid-after-resumption-voluntary-workouts
LOL
It could also be argued that those who feel the value of their education is substantially diminished by switching online are in effect saying that they value the camp aspect more than the academics (with the obvious exceptions for those fields where personal presence really is paramount, such as performance arts, dental hygiene, etc)
DS20 is staying very busy studying for MIT ASEs day in and day out.
I know he will make the best of his freshman year in whatever form it unfolds, and, to be honest, we kinda look forward to keeping him around for a few more months while saving on room and board.
I’m not so sure how worthwhile that ‘in person’ part is really going to be this semester. D has to re-register for all classes, and the course catalog (not out yet) will indicate if the class is exclusively online or also has face-to-face components. But the school has said ‘those face-to-face components will never be required; every course will be delivered such that it can be completed entirely online by students who need or choose to do so.’ So I’m curious as to what the FTF components will actually entail aside from sitting 6’ apart from classmates while wearing masks… will professors be there in the classroom and livestreaming to remote students so they are interacting with the students in the classroom? Will there be enough students even showing up to the class to have meaningful Q & A or in person discussions ? It will be one big experiment. I am concerned that the value of FTF component will not be worth the room & board. My D missed only two classes during her first year both of which were due to my scheduling her flight home a day early to save $. She hates being on a computer, hates reading on a screen (no kindle books for her and hates online text books), likes to hand write all of her notes, and generally wants to be learning side by side with peers… college was the first time in her life that she wasn’t the smart kid in the class and the day to day learning was far more collaborative than HS and wow, what a difference. (Her HS highly integrated technology into daily learning and she disliked it to the point that I didn’t send my other kids to that HS). D will not know if she gets into classes with FTF component until re-registration occurs just days before move in. On a positive note, school has said that students can opt out of housing (which is not being reassigned until two weeks before re-registration) right up until the semester starts… and, that if students opt to study remotely for the Fall semester, they can return for the Spring. My other two kids in HS and MS had no problem when their schools went online and preferred it in some ways, not surprising to me given their personalities.
All I can say is, that may have been your college experience (it certainly was for most of my high school friends) but that was not my experience, nor that of any of my close college friends, and it’s certainly not what my D experience is based on her first year- or I wouldn’t even consider sending her back. Going to a highly residential college campus in a different part of the country absolutely altered my life course for too many reasons to list, and I’ll just leave it at that, predicting the same for my D already based just her shortened first year experience. And I’m sure I’m not the only one whose kids started doing their own laundry in middle school.
We had a very low college budget, but where we live, the nearest cc is 45 minute drive and the nearest 4-year is a good hour. I wasn’t going to have my girls commuting over winter, so one went to a cc an hour away and moved into student housing, the other is at a directional 2 hours away and lived in a dorm freshman year.
DD’19 has an apartment off campus with a lease that started in May. She is going to live there regardless with her roommate and see her circle of friends, some of which are already living in their apartments since they’re paying for them.
Her school just released their plans last week. Smaller public school, rural Midwest. Very low cases in the area and they don’t pull many students from far and wide. They are doing the go home at Thanksgiving model. One dorm, formerly used for low-income upperclassmen co-op housing, is for quarantine for “those with symptoms who cannot go home”. You might go to a class in person one day and be virtual for the next session and so on. Two large gen-eds have been moved to online only. Students should wear a mask- if not, disciplinary action may happen. No loitering in the Union, eat and get out, and to-go will be available. All freshmen still required to live on campus and it doesn’t say there will be singles only. A surveillance and testing team has been organized for suspected cases.
Or it could be, @TheVulcan, that parents have read the reports from Brookings,and other places that online learning is much less effective than in person.
Being on campus is so much more than “camp” and socialization. It’s access to labs, maker spaces, fabrication shops, 3D printing labs, and most importantly in person project teams. It’s not summer camp!
In-person learning is undoubtedly better than remote learning in most cases. However, that has to be weighted against its potential downsides during a pandemic. The kid can be infected, disrupting his/her education for at least a period of time that could ruin the entire semester or quarter. The college could close down again if infections become widespread on campus or in nearby communities. Students on campus will likely spend (waste?) significant amount of their time everyday going through onerous processes for classes, food, etc.
But if social distancing type rules are implemented (as many colleges trying to get back on campus are doing), then these types of things will be significantly limited, diminishing the academic value of being on campus.
Or is it that many people prefer that colleges go back to the pre-virus norm, giving up on the idea of limiting the virus’ spread, and accepting that some unlucky people (students, faculty, staff, people in the nearby community) will get very sick, die, or suffer longer term disability, in order to restore the full residential college experience (as opposed to a very limited one, if any, that seems to be what residential colleges returning to on-campus mostly seem to be doing)?
I agree that some classes will be at a disadvantage in online virtual environments, but any lecture based class should transition well. However, schools need to make that a priority. They need the infrastructure, and tools to make it happen, but it can be done.
I get it that many prioritize the social aspect over academics, but even there, your student may have much to learn on how to engage (yes, even socially) over the internet because that will be table stakes in the post-covid business world.
I think that if schools are willing to embrace change that all students should be able to learn at a high level - engineering and CS students, as well as those seeking to learn how to communicate, write and polish up on quantitative skills.
One other quick observation on this thread. The vast majority of discussion is how to get students back on campus. Perhaps we need more discussion on best practices for online classes.
Those are the averages. Ultimately, the person most in control of their own learning is the student.
Well, I do not think anyone is arguing that these campus experiences are not valuable.
But they are by and large not happening, at least not on the scale and in a shape resembling prior years. It was clear to some of us as far back as march, and it is gradually beginning to dawn on most.
So the question then, is your school still worth it? That is something everyone would have to decide for themselves.
This happens on many campuses anyway if I am understanding this correctly. In Ann Arbor you are part of “their” community. Even though it seems like everyone is a student in reality you are having lunch or going to the local Krogers with people that live in that community.