No, to the contrary. I was saying that it is unlikely schools will allow dorms to operate. And of course those older, high risk patients should continue to social distance.
re dorm rooms vs cruise ships, etc. For many colleges, once kids hit sophomore year many live off campus and in apartments. As a matter of fact, in many communities many people live in apartments. Maybe the hybrid model is that freshman classes are all online. and other classes are hybrid, as freshman would not live in the dorms. Or the dorms would be partly filled. for Residential colleges with upper classman that live on campus, it would also make spreading out easier.
But based on what my kids are saying, they would rather be on campus, even if classes on are online.
In these college towns as well, when restaurants /bars open or at least the former, I assume young people will be hanging out anyway. Are we, as a country , going to keep all social events shut down until a maybe vaccine? I do think that coming up with treatments that decrease the death rate is likely what will be needed moreso. The Flu does not have a zero death rate, just a much lower one than Covid. And People who get the flu shot also do get the flu, as not all strains are in the shot which goes against the argument that a vaccine already exists.
My oldest wants to finish her college experience as a college experience. We have talked that if this cannot be done in the fall, and whats to say, in the spring, should she take a gap year and work. BUT she has one more semester to go, so I likely would push her to just finish, but only if at least some of her classes are in person. For my youngest, yes, he could do ok with online but he desperately needs socialization, as he already is a hermit. the next 4 months is already scaring me, with him home , in the basement, day after day… no job in site.
I would send my kids back today (yes I know that is not a possibility), but my point being that I dont see Covid-19 as a Risk for them because of their age and health, and I would assume anyone else on campus , including staff, would be there because they chose. Professors could SD and masks could be worn in public places and classes. I lived through my oldest having a bad flu at college as well as mono, strep, and other ailments. I guess we see what June brings…
So on a side, do we think that Vegas, Disney, cruises, sporting events have at least a year before they open as well? The economy of that is just wow as well. I guess if any of those places open before August colleges would as well.
@Debbeut Berkeley has said that classes will most likely be hybrid in the fall and they haven’t made a decision yet, but they said they will let all students come back to campus (and dorms) unless it is illegal in fall.
@1NJParent I agree with the panel idea to some degree. Especially a good idea for colleges to make decisions for the fall.
Which is the purpose of the thread.
If you read the article in today’s wsj from an esteemed Stanford scientist and other scientists who completely disagree with many of the current strategies that “science” is providing to leaders.
That is what I was suggesting. It’s hard to define exactly who is the right voice.
They also state that it’s very hard to get scientists into agreement in most cases.
https://www.wsj.com/amp/articles/the-bearer-of-good-coronavirus-news-11587746176
Also, I and not one person I know, could give one fig, literally, about being embarrassed in the “international” community. Angela Merkel has her own issues and Europe has big problems of their own. But I respect your view and get your point.
Given the main reasons for selecting a college (or going to college at all):
A. Affordable cost.
B. Academic content and pre-professional preparation.
C. The college experience.
D. Prestige and college-name factors.
A and B are the basic criteria, while C and D are the luxury criteria available to students with high end high school credentials and/or parents with money (these students and their parents are heavily represented on these forums).
The T20 and other residential colleges will continue to sell themselves based on C and D, because students and parents really desire them, and will choose them if affordable (i.e. parental money or student earning merit scholarship or student getting admitted to college with good financial aid). These students are unlikely to move to distance education, although those at the margin of being able to afford residential college may switch to commuter college if residential college price increases make residential college unaffordable.
But only a minority of college students can afford residential college; currently, most commute to a local college from where they lived before going to college, because they can only afford A and B (and some have no college options at all that meet their A and B criteria).
Because the latter group is not really getting C or D anyway, this is the group of college students who may switch to distance education if it is offered at a lower cost than in-person (commuter) education. A few may actually prefer it if they have time constraints due to work, family, commuting, etc., although most would probably do it because of budget reasons.
As a practical matter, I do not think young adults aged 16-24 or so will stay in the house once schools end within another 4 weeks or so. The summer weather will arrive, they have been dealing with loneliness and online learning, and many feel they have already done enough to protect the boomer generation which is at risk.
Where would they go though? Travelling, concerts, sports events, amusement parks, cinemas and other typical summer activities will still likely be off limits.
Parks, beaches, hiking trails. At least that’s where my kids will head.
A lot of seemingly health, young fist responders who went to the nursing home near Seattle got sick. seemed like a very large % and number of them at the time.
Tightly packed spaces with high contact are going to spread it. The biggest place people get sick are in their own families at home from people they live with.
Camping and hiking? That’s what my kids will probably be doing once restrictions start to ease. I also suspect we’ll come round to seeing beaches and lakes as relatively safe locations compared to most other potential activities.
If the academic community cared only about teaching vs money there would be no college sports, which in 95% of the time do not make money, but academic community is much larger than just teachers. Colleges are a business first and foremost, colleges for the most part do not really care about the student loan crisis, after all it is not their money, but I have a feeling is schools endowments were somehow lending the money for kids to go to college, things would be different. The business of school wants dorms, sports, alumi donations, summer camps…
Very few jobs have a thing called tenure.
Yes it is immense. Right now it’s about $1.6 Trillion in debt immense and growing. Personally, I think a population that can think critically is more important than an educated population. Educated doesn’t equal smart.
The academic community probably is concerned about educating people. Just like most health care workers are mostly concerned about patients. However, just like health care, academia is big business. It’s run by administrators and accountants, not professors.
All closed in my state so no kids going there , no jersey shore, no Delaware water gap, no great adventure , all closed .
It’s still April. They’ll be open in June, governors know they have to find ways to demonstrate progress and these are by far the easiest and least risky options. Utah just reopened its state parks this week. What they don’t want for now are out of state visitors. So it wouldn’t surprise me to see continued restrictions on short term rentals and/or non-residents for a while after reopening.
With 1500 post in , I have yet to see a real plan for dorms, you can not social distance in a college double, hallways are small , bathrooms are design in older dorms to fit the most amount of kids in them. So if schools open with a hybrid plan, that means dorms open? If dorms open social distancing is not gonna happen, you have maybe 2 choices there, more rooms or less kids and I do not see colleges going on a building boom now so less kids, but how to do that, less kids= less dollars coming in to pay for your hybrid plan. So even if you could get college kids to social distance , which I doubt for 18-22 year olds released from lockdown and back on their campus, the dorms are not setup for it. Then we move to the other Elephant in the room, full-time online solves the dorm problem but parents, who for the most part pay for the college , will want a discount. It is gonna be pretty bad PR when State schools raise tuition in July and announce the following week, we are online. A percentage of kids are gonna go back to their off campus apt when school starts , those apt are paid for and I doubt a lot of them will happily sit empty. I agree schools may not know their plans for the fall but I am pretty sure they could announce what their plans are for tuition are in the event fall and maybe Spring are online. 99.9% have not done thatIIRC. Some schools will open if their state lets them because they have to in order to stay afloat.
UC Berkeley has already announced that tuition fees are locked in for fall, and will not change regardless of delivery venue (on campus or online). In other words, no discounts.
Obviously, other publics could do the same.
https://news.berkeley.edu/2020/04/23/information-about-fall-semester-2020/
IMO, any school that reduces tuition for online classes is placing themselves in a precarious position.
Do you see K-12 schools opening in the fall?
My D’s dorm of 70 people with about 600 sq ft for every 4 people is far less dense than my S’s HS with 3,000 kids and several hundred staff stuck in one building for 8+hours every day with those 3,000+ kids and staff going home every night to family members who had multiple out of home exposures too, then they come back the next day and spend 8 hours together again…and everyone seems to think that HS is opening in the fall, but not the college dorm. Not sure I get that.
One issue that favors K-12 opening over campus dorms is that kids who do get sick can go home and isolate and be taken care of. In dorms, what will they do with the sick kids? They won’t be able to fly home…would be a real mess.
But how many kids and staff did that K-12 kid infect? Who’s to say that K-12 kid will stay home…especially the relatively large proportion that are asymptomatic, or have mild symptoms?
Where do college kids with flu or mono go?