When my daughter did her internship after her junior year, they really liked her and wanted her to stay. The little group of engineers told her they would homeschool her final year of college.
That may not be as crazy an idea now as it was 2 years ago. If kids do have to be online for classes, maybe getting a job in the industry (whatever that is) could provide a whole new set of tutors and mentors.
Maybe, Maybe not. Distance learning has been around for 30 years. Online learning for 20 years. They haven’t taken off because it’s not part of the business model. Kids on-campus, in classrooms, living in dorms is the business model, not online learning.
Since there are hundreds of thousands of online degree-seeking students at schools such as ASU, Western Governors, SNHU, etc., it seems many do see getting one’s degree via an online college as a viable business model.
IMO covid-19 will accelerate this transition, as @INJParent posted.
A minority of college students live on-campus in dorms.
It’s not germophobe paranoia. It’s more out of concern for others. My wife is a CRNA and has to work in the ICU if needed (luckily not much so far). We also have elderly parents to look after. Anything to reduce the risk of infection. My wife would feel awful if she thought she spread the virus. This nurse did too. Not a laughing matter.
Most students and their parents have an eye on post graduation job prospects. It’s not all, but it’s a large percentage.
Even for the group that is willing to pay for the experience, what happens when the experience moves off campus? I imagine a student saves certain core classes for their sophomore year to be taken online at a reduced tuition and then spends their college money on 9 months in Europe. Let’s say a month in 9 different cities with lectures arranged and tours scheduled while taking online classes for full credit back home. A lot of HS seniors will be interested in that experience.
Sure schools will try hard to keep the experience connected to the school, but they’re all competing to offer the most desirable experience.
My former SIL has a masters from U of Phoenix from about 20 years ago. Her employer paid for it. She’s been very successful and while her ‘office’ has always been in Denver, she’s worked most of those 20 years (for the same employer) while living in Florida and Connecticut. The online learning prepared her for a life of online working.
She’s an extremely smart person who originally went to U of Chicago (didn’t like it) then transferred to a city college and then did the online masters. Not at all the educational experience her parents expected her to have when she was 18 and heading off to U of Chicago.
Things are moving pretty fast, so by mid August we will probably know a lot more about treatments, prevention, immunity and the like. Whether that will be reassuring or terrifying remains to be seen. It’s 4 months, so there’s time for colleges to see what works, what doesn’t, and how ready everyone has to be to adapt to the changing landscape.
Personally, I hate the online remote instruction experience (other than the really short commute). “Hybrid” plans seem like they will be even more work, which is going to be a lift for a lot of adjuncts, who are barely getting paid to begin with.
Online is a viable business model. Just not the preferred one. About 15% exclusively online which leaves 85% as on-campus or a mix. Pretty slow progress over the last 20 years.
Covid may or may not accelerate the transition. Either way I bet higher ed will fight it as long as they can. It would mean a lot of jobs lost. Less professors required, less admin, less real estate needed, less room and board. Then there’s the interactive part of learning that is important.
Lets say the T20 schools all go online. Will people still pay $80k/year for that? No way. They have a brand to protect. To go even further, what happens when kids see classes from other schools? If I’m attending Harvard online and am taking Econ 101 and see that the prof at Stanford online is phenominal I’ll want to take that class. The internet has driven down prices or taught people to DIY. Online learning would drive down the cost. There are people that wouldn’t want that to happen. It’s why it hasnt’ happened to a greater extent already.
Personally, I’m for more options and I’ve taken some excellent online classes for work. I just think there’s too much gravitational pull not to make online learning more popular.
Bingo. I was at a lunch meeting several years ago and happened to sit next to a Vice Provost of one of the University of California campuses. At that time he said that the state Regents were pushing UC to start adding online classes as a way to increase enrollments to traditional and non-traditional students, but he said the academic senates, i.e., faculty, of each campus were diametrically opposed.
We have a kid who is starting a grad program at U of Missouri.
The first term is a summer term, beginning this June. It will be on-line.
She has not heard anything about the fall term yet.
Actually the UC system was an early adopter of online education. Their results were not very good (being charitable here). Google it, lots of articles about it.
I see that the majority of the comments here are focusing on whether classes will be on line or in person or a hybrid. But not much talk about allowing dorm living. I think this is the big question. Dorms will be like cruise ships and nursing homes and will lead to huge outbreaks if they are allowed to operate…social distancing in dorms is not possible. This is why I think non-commuter colleges will not be open in the fall, at least for any on campus living. There is too much liability and risk involved in trying to care for and isolate students who will inevitably get sick. And parents sending their kids to out-of-state schools will not be able to come get them nor will they be able to travel home.
2 things.
First how many 18-22 year olds were hospitalized after a cruise or being at a nursing home?
Second, schools can monitor dorm residents for symptoms (fever) and for social distancing. It’s the ones in the apartments that are worrying them.
@AlwaysMoving My point was not that the 18-22 year olds would need to be hospitalized. But they will be vectors transmitting the illness to older staff, professors, etc. who will potentially become seriously ill. As is the case at many nursing homes and on cruises. Also, as we know, fever is often not seen with Coronavirus infection. One can see anything from completely asymptomatic to full blown disease.
But it’s likely that CDC guidance in the fall will still recommend those at risk (elderly, immunocompromised, etc.) to continue to isolate because they will still be at risk as the virus will still be circulating…there won’t be a vaccine at that point to protect them. Are you saying older and/or at risk staff/profs should not continue to isolate in the absence of a vaccine?
Seems like there are some schools looking a block scheduling or Mini mesters… Any thoughts on this…
I can imagine it will help with possibly reducing density… your student may get on campus for the first mini and at home for the second…
I haven’t seen any clearly laid proposals but I could guess that it is a way of getting some kids on campus for in person classes.
Many schools have already open registration for classes for the fall- trying to switch now to mini mesters could be an issue.
The main issue for schools remains risk and planning for a potential outbreak on campus.
It seems we are conflating the gradual loosening of some “stay at home” restrictions by specific locale and eliminating social distancing.
These are not mutually exclusive concepts.
I agree we should watch the results of the research closely. However, it won’t necessarily provide clear directions and plans.
Science informs society, leaders recommend actions, laws set the actual rules. Citizens make the final choices.
Unfortunately, “science” will not be uniform in its opinions, even within the individual disciplines.
Also, when we correctly (imho) say science should inform our decisions it’s good to remember there are so many sciences to consider in this crisis.
Psychology, virology, economics, epidemiology, sociology, medicine, pharmacology, gerontology, political science and numerous others.
Who in this vast community of voices represents the single view of “science”?
Will they be capable of distilling all of the interwoven and nuanced considerations that are informing these big questions?
I don’t know. It will be intriguing to see how it all evolves.
.If the “school” choice for fall or spring makes a decision that is out of alignment with one’s view on the matter - there will be two bad choices. Do we go against our personal view of the risk profile (which can fall either way based on your viewpoint that either on campus or online is viewed as the poor decision) or missing out on an opportunity earned by our student.
That’s why the gap year seems so appealing. It pushes out the need to choose from two undesirable options.
One can see why it’s so frustrating and scary for so many parents.
I’ve decided to step back and wait to see how this all shakes out in the next few months. Then try help my d22 make the best decision possible at that time for jr. year with a few basic contingencies having been contemplated already.
Until then, any excessive dread, rumination, complaining, finger pointing and amateur fortune telling is akin to tilting at windmills.
@msdynamite85 the President graduated from Penn, so obviously that’s considered an elite education and it seems to have played no role in the scenario you presented. Not really sure how that relates to the thread.
I was responding to an earlier post of how some colleges may have been reluctant to include online learning because of fear of loss of income. I argue that education is for the public good and that public universities in particular should be doing their best to outreach to low income workers whose taxes are paying them yet are locked out of accessing them due to having to having to work full time.
Online learning can access populations who are currently less served by the traditional residential college model. So in relation to this thread, i hope that the elite institutions who have suddenly taken on online delivery of its courses out of need, expands and develops it in the fall and onward.
I think politics should be left out of this thread.