Meant that in the “generic” term. They should be treated equally, is my point. Maybe there is a better word, but that’s what came to mind.
1 Like
I have been fortunate to have kids who enjoy dining out and save their outbursts for us, at home. I am sympathetic to folks whose kids misbehave but really they shouldn’t be subjecting all of us to their out of control behavior. I agree they should leave the restaurant with a parent and have their meals boxed as needed. Sadly many parents feel they are entitled to inflict their kids on everyone.
I also have issues with people who are just very loud in restaurants and make it hard for us to hear those at our table. Someone never taught them about indoor voices or they’re all hard of hearing (tho all appeared fairly young—mid 30s to mid 40s).
4 Likes
Have recently had several experiences with very loud (commonly people of the age you mentioned, but not always) patrons at nearby tables. There frequently seemed to be cocktails on the table… perhaps a contributing factor.
1 Like
Yes, continuous cocktails seems to increase the volume of those voices. We could finally better hear one another walking back over busy NYC steeets. Haha!
I’m finding newer restaurants, at least where I live, are too loud due to how the space was constructed. I don’t eat out often (I cook most nights) but when I go out it’s a social thing with friends or family. It’s always so loud (we like to try new places).
6 Likes
yes on the too loud, cavernous spaces. Also, what’s with the high top table trend everywhere? Fine enough for us, but very difficult for many elderly customers. But, I digress…
4 Likes
We took our kid with us to multiple restaurants, including “clothe napkin” restaurants. However, we always asked for table near the entrance, or a table that is close to the door to the kitchen. First, these are locations that are not really good for people who are looking for a quiet dinner, since there is always activity there. Second, there is a lot going on, which keeps a young child’s attention. Next to the kitchen, you have waiters rushing in and out of the kitchen, glimpses of the kitchen with so much going on there. Next to the door you have people coming in and out, you can usually see the outside, and, if the kid starts showing signs of imminent meltdown, you can take the kid outside. Next to the kitchen is often close to the restrooms - another great place to take a crying baby.
Bringing activities for a toddler or child is also important. Drawing, reading, even screen-based activities. Based on their age, they should be required to be part of the general dinner interactions at the table for part of the time.
In general, if a baby is crying, and cannot be calmed down in a few minutes, they need to be removed from the restaurant to somewhere quiet and more enclosed. Alternatively, a walk around the block in a stroller can do wonders. A toddler who is having a meltdown needs to be removed from any location where they can cause damage to themselves or others, which includes the entirety of the restaurant.
Kids and toddlers who are running around a restaurant are not only disturbing other people, they are risking their own safety and the safety of others. There are sharp edges and hard floors, sharp implements, dangerously hot food and serving dishes, and open fire. They, and their guardians, should be removed immediately, and restaurants which allow this type of behavior should be reported as engaging in unsafe policies.
Parents should be encouraged to bring their kids to restaurants but basic etiquette rules should be observed. First, parents are responsible for keeping their kid occupied and keep them from producing more noise than adult patrons. Second, parents should be responsible for keeping their kids within acceptable spaces (no running between tables, down halls, etc). Basically, any behavior away from the table that wouldn’t be acceptable for an adult shouldn’t be acceptable for kids.
Of course, there should be more tolerance for toddler or young child behavior that, for an adult is creepy, but for a toddler is curiosity, such as staring at somebody at another table…
We brought our kid to multiple restaurants and really never had an issue. Of course, we both have had a lot of academic and other travel as a family, which meant that we were going out to eat in places which did not have “child-friendly” restaurants, and where we had no babysitter. We have never had issues with wait staff, and the number of free courses and treats that our kid snagged between the ages of 5 and 10 could have filled a dozen meals on their own. Our kid may have nearly given us heart attacks and ulcers during puberty, but her behavior at restaurants has always be exemplary.
Of course, there are some restaurants that are definitely not for kids. A restaurant with a large number of small courses is torment to most kids, pre-teens or teens. When they’re hungry, having something which is three bites, and then waiting five minutes for the next few bites is pure torment. I have know many kids who love sushi, but subjecting a 9 year old to Omakase could be considered child abuse.
2 Likes
Acoustics are an essential part of restaurant design. Setting up ways to " soften the sound" is relatively inexpensive. We use fabric on parts of the ceiling, absorbing a significant amount of the sound. Some restaurants will want an overall noisy room for atmosphere, but when you are at the table, you can hear each other clearly without raising your voice. You are below most of the noise.
5 Likes
lol yes to the high tables! High ceilings, high tables.
I don’t know these days. One of us always went out with a crier until they were calmed down. I considered this just part of parenting.
To be honest, it never really bothers me unless it’s super close quarters and the child is screaming in my ear. Worse, to me, is folks who let their children run around! OMG. He/she is going to take down a server with a full tray:::::cringe.
I saw that happen when I was waiting tables in the summer during college. OMG…the mess. Big tray including hot soups. The young children were with their grandma who didn’t lift a finger to help OR apologize. The management moved the family to a table in a far corner where no one would be walking past them (they needed to do that anyway so they could clean up the mess).
I remember being horrified. The waitress carrying the tray was a mess. Her biggest concern was getting replacement food for the customers who had food on the tray.
2 Likes
OMG - Mexican restaurants with the reverberating noise from all the tile drives me insane, don’t need children, just the chatter alone!
1 Like
I’ve never understood adults who let their children be a menace to themselves and others. Allowing children to wander or run in restaurants is definitely in that category. INEXCUSABLE! Where are the adults that brought the unrestrained people?!?!
3 Likes
We never brought young children to restaurants. But IMO the only etiquette for a screaming kid in a restaurant is to leave immediately.
4 Likes
To us it feels like some of the chain restaurants (PF Chang etc) actually WANT the decor to be hard surface… very loud. Our theory is they don’t want anybody lingering at the table too long. Might be a completely wrong theory, but it’s a table topic at those places.
1 Like
You are one hundred percent right. Restaurant chairs are built so they are not too comfortable. We make a living turning tables.
3 Likes
Not exactly a crying baby but kids in restaurants comment. In my town we had a restaurant that has now banned kids under 16. Parents would go and socialize ignoring their kids who would cause property damage. The owners just couldn’t keep up with repairs.
4 Likes
We adopted our children and they both suffered trauma in their infancies. One daughter had terrible tantrums until she was six years old that we often could do nothing to control. We were her fifth home when we got her at 9 months old: birth family, orphanage, two foster families and us. The other had lead poisoning and is to this day, very hyperactive. She also had severe scars that no one could or would explain. I hate threads like these because of personal experience with my children. I can’t remember ever having one throw a tantrum in a restaurant, but it did happen with each one once on a plane and I was so thankful that people around us were very understanding.
I was alone with my oldest during her tantrum (luckily a very short flight - she was under two and didn’t want to sit in my lap) and when we got to our destination, an angel of a man asked me if I needed assistance with her while getting off the plane. My youngest had hers on another short flight - she was barely OVER two and she WANTED to sit in my lap during take off, but the flight attendants couldn’t allow it - the same attendants who tried to force us to give up her seat for another passenger until we told them it was her seat and she was two. So she screamed bloody murder on takeoff until I put her on my lap before the seatbelt light came on (because I know how ugly people can be about crying babies). I heard the people behind me talking after she quieted down and they thought the attendants were being very mean. When we landed, they asked us if we were at our final destination. I guess they were going to kick us off any next flight we might have been on.
Another incident was right after we brought our youngest home. My husband was immediately called out on a wildfire assignment, and I and the kids were getting very little sleep. I had to go get groceries and she decided to throw a tantrum while we were in the checkout line. I tried to console her but it just made her scream louder. So I could do nothing but stand there being miserable with her. I wasn’t going to leave with her so close to the finish line. I did hear some judgmental comments that time. “Why isn’t she doing something?” Lady, if only you knew how hard I’d been trying for the past three weeks since we adopted her (including flying back and forth to/from China). You try dealing with an angry, traumatized, jet lagged child who just met you three weeks ago and hasn’t slept more than 5 hours a day since then!
Fortunately they learned to be very good travelers and we’ve been on many adventures with them. They are very polite and well mannered young women. The oldest always makes a point of clearing the table when we dine at restaurants and is always friendly and polite to the wait staff. They are smart, funny, hard working and make me very proud. Every child didn’t grow up in a home with nurturing and loving parents since birth and maybe couldn’t fathom the concept of social niceties until a little later in life. Maybe we should show grace to people who possibly don’t deserve it, just in case they do.
14 Likes
There is an advantage to being able to dine outdoors all year long - no noise bouncing off wood walls, and kids having somewhere to go when restless.
When little, son was quiet and happy to just have a book or some kind of handheld game device. And engage in conversations with waiter about games he’d never played but knew all about. We only took him to nicer restaurants when we traveled.
1 Like
I think that all of us are empathetic to those having meltdowns in public.
The problem is those parents who seem oblivious to the mayhem, don’t even try to diffuse the situation and are outwardly offended when others want to experience a positive eating experience themselves.
It’s not most, it’s the few that are seemingly trying to ruin the dining experience for everyone by their blatant lack of respect.
I’ve been in the store with a poor family whose child is having a meltdown. It happens and I’m not even kind of upset. They are in the checkout line and trying to get out of there. Of trying to shop for what they need so they can get out.
I’ve also seen parents have an extended chitchat while their children are running through the aisles screaming and dumping items on the floor. The parents totally ignore the kids and when they leave, they leave the mess.
14 Likes