I doubt there are many, if any, parents here who have different hopes for their kids.
I think the issues are more about what it means to be a “functioning adult,” what paths are available to that end, and what role choosing a college major actually plays in determining what paths will ultimately be available.
This made me think a bit of my older brother, who studied one thing in college but it didn’t really work for him. He then started a grad program, and that didn’t really work for him. He finally went to a professional school, which required taking some additional courses first (which fortunately he could do while in the grad program), and that finally worked for him. He has had a successful professional career ever since.
Along the way, he did in fact live at home for some periods after college. I suppose some people might have thought he was not yet a “functioning adult” at those times. But he eventually became one.
Part of what is happening in these cases is a type of luxury that comes from being financially stable as parents. My parents did not need my brother to pay rent or pitch in for groceries. They did not in fact need him to contribute money to help support the family in any way. So they could give him the luxury of time to figure out what really worked for him.
And of course not all families are in that situation. And of course if my brother had a lot of undeferred college loans, that would potentially have been a problem as well.
But personally, as a parent, if my kids need the luxury of time in the same sense their uncle did–I am prepared to give it to them. But again, that is because it is a luxury we can afford, and I don’t mean to suggest every family can.
For most people, especially those who cannot afford such luxury, encouraging a more direct path from college to employment and independence makes the most sense.
We had the means to guarantee both our kids 5 years of college and even then I was relieved when both chose engineering fields. But, even engineering doesn’t come with guarantees. Our S chose CS and with a BS and MS he is currently financially secure. Our D is still in undergrad BME and is looking at med school. Unbeknown to her, we will also pick up the med school tab. Debt must be avoided.
Your post describes what we are thankful to be able to do for our oldest S who graduates spring ‘25.
He is double majoring in IA and Philosophy with a minor in Russian language and lit. He had an amazing internship this past summer with govt and he could return there after graduation; alas, he has decided govt sector is not for him.
So……he is unsure what he will do in long term but is considering a teaching program next summer that would allow him to teach English overseas. His current plan is to do that for a year or two to determine whether teaching is possibly his preferred future path. Etc, etc.
Many neighbors once they learn of these plans feel a need to spontaneously judge him (and us?) for allowing him the freedom of time and space to better determine his professional future.
We are happy to give him this time. We are in position to do so and respect his desire for a path of social service and/or teaching.
He’s a bright, adaptive, hardworking, and versatile kid who has outstanding verbal and writing skills. We look forward to seeing how his humanitarian approach to daily life will unfold.
I have a couple of friends I met while in the Peace Corps who now, as 40/50-something year old adults, have made careers out of teaching English abroad. It ls fantastic! They have lived all over the world, they travel, they make good money, they have excellent benefits. (Although they don’t have kids, so that sure makes that lifestyle more feasible). Anyway, it can be a really great career for the right person
There are certainly some majors that can pigeon hole undergrads, but for the most part, a candidate can make themselves marketable beyond their course of study. I have an accounting degree. I’ve never done a day of accounting in my 32 year career.
Our older son chose a very niche major. Then, he chose the one of two tracks that was even more niche. He knew exactly what he wanted to do, though, and this was a way to achieve the goal. Luckily the major provided very marketable skills(coding, data aggregation and analysis, research, critical thinking, public speaking, etc.).
He was lucky enough to garner a highly competitive internship with a 3 letter agency…until Covid came along and killed it. That kept him from attaining a top secret security clearance, which was integral to reach his initial goal in time for graduation. Excrement happens. He pivoted to a new goal that would develop highly applicable skills to the original goal and pay good money while he built a work history. He received his first paycheck 4 weeks after graduation.
Interestingly, he is excelling at his back up occupation, to the point that it makes virtually no sense to pursue his initial goal. He would work more, make significantly less, and would have to move around the country and/or the world several times. In less than 2.5 years he’s received 4 raises, that last of which was 12%. His employer keeps paying for him to train, take classes, and earn some pretty impressive certifications. He couldn’t be happier. Most importantly to this thread, though, he hasn’t necessarily used his actual degree at all to this point.
To quote the former great, Mike Tyson, “Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth.” Grads need to market the right skills to the right employers. They may not end up with their first, second, or even third choice, but they may find their calling accidentally.
To answer the original question. Students should not choose a useful major, they need to pick the one they have the passion for and then make the plan for how to get to being a self-sufficient adult. I could have majored in chemistry but after one class, I realized that I hated the rhythm and feel of the class. Instead I followed my 2nd loves and double majored in History and Political Science. I went on to get a masters in public policy and have had a very successful career in government.
My SiL got an undergrad degree in history and masters in public history and he now has a career working at a historical site.
Not everyone wants to go into IB or engineering and that is a good thing.
And in fact, going immediately to a four-year college may not always be the right solution, particularly for kids who are not pretty sure exactly what going to a four-year college would do for them.
Of course, you don’t need to rule it out forever, but I think there is absolutely nothing wrong with working for a bit, including doing something like a 2-year degree first and then working, and then returning for a four-year degree if and when you have a clear idea of what it is you want to get out of that degree.
Unfortunately, I think in some circles this is viewed as a path that would have to be forced on you, by low financial means, academic struggles in HS, or so on. And of course that is fine if true. But I really wish more people just saw this as a good option to consider even if you could go straight to a four-year college. For some kids that is a fine next step immediately after HS, but for many others it may make a lot of sense to put that on pause for a bit.
I am all for my kids following their passion and natural inclinations. What I would disagree with is not utilizing effectively their time in college by not trying to learn things that would challenge them to expand their thinking and/or their skills. I would disagree with picking a major because it is perceived to be easy (by the kid) and not interfering with their social life. Of course, the “fluff” majors sometimes require as much, if not more, work as the “rigorous” majors
IMO, there are some aspects of the US college system that are conducive to not engaging your brain at full potential. First, the residential system and the vaunted “college experience”, including greek life, condition some kids to think that college is this magic fun place where you go as a reward for breaking your back doing extra-curricular activities and AP classes. Second, because of the GE classes and a plethora of interdisciplinary majors, you can graduate with enough credits without ever having to go deep into an area and tackle the difficult stuff. I am not saying that interdisciplinary majors or majors that include “studies” are easy but it is my impression that it is possible to graduate by skimming the surface
The human brain is at higher capacity for learning during the school and college years than later in life. These years should not be wasted.
It’s usually not, though. You can’t go through an interdisciplinary major just dabbling. In many of these majors, you sample different approaches but then choose a track in which you concentrate in a specific area. But even if you don’t, think of it this way – a discipline offers a set of methods to solve problems. In interdisciplinary majors, students have to juggle many methods of solving problems and answering questions that the interdisciplinary field poses. In many ways, it’s harder than a traditional major because it requires more elasticity in one’s thinking, writing, and research.
In this revealing documentary, veteran correspondent John Merrow takes you behind the ivy-covered walls of our colleges and universities to see if they are delivering on their promise.
Debunking commonly held notions about the rite of passage known as the college experience, this PBS documentary follows 30 students and their teachers along the path of higher education, from admission to graduation, and exposes the disappointment, disorientation and deflation many students feel – in both public and private schools. This revealing study also addresses the quality and readiness of America’s future work force.
Granted, these are not the colleges most coveted by the herd here, but the film does show how many students ARE able to graduate with “skimmed” degrees and what the implication of that mis-education is–a degree in hand, but lack of readiness for the work force, or anything else.
If you believe that college should prepare a student for a job (not my position), some colleges make it too easy to sidestep that goal.
Agree 100%. I’ve interviewed new grads with degrees in Business Administration who were unable to discuss “business concepts” at all. Not digging for Federal Reserve level observations… just softball questions. I’ve interviewed new grads with degrees in Psychology who only had a watered down, one semester class in statistics (how do you evaluate a longitudinal study without knowing statistics? How do you compare two populations without statistics?) And my least favorite “fails”- accounting majors. They can do a deep dive into a balance sheet but cannot discuss core, everyday issues like inflation (and easy questions- like “Given a 10% increase in the cost of raw materials, what options would you suggest to the product team?” Not looking for profundity here- basic things like “increase prices” or “cut non-mission critical expenses until costs stabilize”).
So “useful” is in the eyes of the beholder I guess. Most companies are not looking for someone to sit in a box… you need to have enough analytical horsepower AND content knowledge to be helpful in the “adjacent boxes” as well. You don’t know what team you’ll be staffed on or what problem they’ll need to solve. And since there is no course called “What to do during rapid inflation”, you’ve got to demonstrate that you can thread the needle!
Similarly, I’ve been shocked at how many schools allow students to change majors in their junior year and still graduate on time with no meaningful depth in their new major.
Agree. If it’s an adjacent major (the Russian Lit major switching to History) it can make sense- the student likely has already taken a comprehensive Euro History course, Art History, passed reading comprehension in Russian and often French, and so completing the new major likely won’t take extra time.
It’s the 180 degree switches (Early Childhood Ed to Psych-- which is not uncommon) where some of the foundational courses get short shrift. Some of it is nomenclature-- the student is shifting from EC ED to a Counseling track, will need grad school anyway to get certified. But it’s not the traditional “social science” of psychology where an employer expects a fair degree of rigor in quantitative methodology which is transferable to lots of different disciplines.
I unfortunately don’t get to interview recent grads anymore but when I did my question progression was typically as follows regardless of area of academic concentration…
1-What class that you completed during your academic career did you find the most challenging?
2-What grade did you get?
3-What was the toughest concept for you to grasp in that class?
4-Please explain that concept to me as if I was a 10 year old?
I never cared about the classes chosen, the grade, or the presumed academic “skills” acquired along the way. What I did care about was the candidates mental flexibility to talk their way out of stressful and challenging corner, their intellectual curiosity & self awareness and honesty.
Frequently kids would start by picking a class they thought would impress you (often finance related), almost everyone claimed to have gotten an A, many would struggle identifying a tough concept and very few could communicate and “teach”.
Those that discussed “eclectic” classes, owned a B, were thoughtful in what they found challenging but showed pleasure in the process of learning and most importantly who could effectively communicate to a child tended to be great IB analysts and future leaders in my experience.
I switched junior year and still graduated on time, but I had already been taking some classes before the switch (one a term starting second semester first year through first semester junior year), including the required Intro sequence. Even so I took nine classes for my major in my last three terms.
Cant ask a grade unless class is completed. The grade raises the stakes. Kids think they know the answer you want and correctly assume it won’t be confirmed.
Once a candidate says they got an A however, but can’t explain a major concept, we have a problem😀
That dissonance typically would take out about 75% of applicants.
